Are bent over barbell rows sufficient for rear delt development?

N

nislyj

New Member
I buddy of mine who's been nursing a shoulder injury sent me a video about preventing common shoulder injuries as a way of encouraging me to stay out of the same trouble he's in now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9bvVGFYl-8

Th first point the author makes is that many shoulder injuries result is a development imbalance between the front and rear delts which eventually leads to rotator cuff injuries. He recommends some rear delt excercises like facepulls and the like, but I'm curious if you guys think that the bent over barbell rows that I have in my HST cycle would provide adequate rear delt development compared to all the front delt work that is done by bench pressing and overhead pressing.

Would it be a good idea to work in some rear delt specific movements, or am I likely covered by what I'm doing already?

For convenience sake, my split is currently:

A:
Squat
Bench
Overhead Press
lat pulldowns
straight bar curls
lying tricep extensions
bent over barbell rows
standing calf raises
weighted incline crunch

B:
Same as A, but replace squat and bent over BB rows with deadlifts

Thanks!
 
Last edited:
Hi nis - to answer your question......no , barbell rows won't be enough to work your rear delts on their own. They're a small posterior muscle and they need their own special attention. Trust me on this , I have the rotator cuff from hell to prove this point after figuring that they would get plenty of attention from other work sets for many years.
I now spend my time nursing my delts with lighter dumbells and pure isolation movements ,my rhomboids and traps are also getting the same attention. I don't have my time over again as I am where I am , but I would encourage you to work your delts carefully and with patience through external rotations and light overhead shrugs to warm up and then rear delt raises and lateral raises. I was a big overhead press fan but now I wouldn't even consider it were I problem free. Delts are a small group that are located in a multi joint area , isolate your posterior and lateral delts and they will grow in a balanced manner. No need to do anything for the front delt , it gets plenty of air time in your bench.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sci
I second what Nagels said.

I do a set of external rotations for each shoulder with a power band that has one end wrapped around a basement support pole with every workout as a warm up and rotator cuff corrective and strengthening movement. I use a skinny band and do 15 to 20 reps. DB's do not really provide enough stimulation directly to the rotator cuff muscles, in my experience. The band hits them directly. It takes all of 3 minutes to do both arms. You could also use the pulley system shown in the video.

Rows are good but will not provide the strength needed to really protect the small mucles surrounding your rotator cuff.

O&G :cool:
 
Thanks, guys!

If I'm understanding correctly, Nagels is hitting the posterior and lateral delts as an accessory movement after benching, and O&G is doing it before as a warmup. Is practice, is there a reason to choose one way over the other?

I've been warming up with the rotator cuff movements described in the video then working the "face-pulls" in as an accessory towards the end of my workout. I still pretty novice in my development and I haven't developed any join issues as of yet, but at 32, I old enough to realize that I really should play it smart from the beginning so as to not get myself in trouble.
 
My sequence general nis is as follows - warm up the shoulder joint with rotations - then light overhead shrugs - face pulls and finish with some lateral raises. Then and only then I move on to whatever chest or back compound I do.
 
In general, I believe that you should warm up any joint area that had been subject to a previous injury just to be safe.

Bear in mind whatever your age, today is the oldest you have ever been and the youngest that you will ever be.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I would not recommend doing external shoulder rotations as a warm up. You don't want to fatigue the tiny rotator cuff muscles prior to heavy compound movements. That is a sure way to injure a shoulder at some point.
.
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2
 
Bulldog, I believe that light bands and high reps negate that risk. I believe you run a bigger risk going into heavy over head type presses without the RG muscles being warmed up. Especially because they are small muscles and losing form overhead will tear the smaller muscles first.

Anyway, just my opinion. The real point is to not neglect them totally.
 
Old and Grey said:
Bulldog, I believe that light bands and high reps negate that risk. I believe you run a bigger risk going into heavy over head type presses without the RG muscles being warmed up. Especially because they are small muscles and losing form overhead will tear the smaller muscles first.

Anyway, just my opinion. The real point is to not neglect them totally.
Click to expand...

I would recommend simply warning up with light weight doing compound movements. Even light weight when doing isolation movements for the rotator cuff muscles can fatigue them enough that it could be a problem when you start the heavy compounds. I would recommend you save any rotator cuff isolations and face pulls for after your regular workout. That is my opinion anyhow...take it for what it's worth.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2
 
Bulldog, I am a firm believer in doing what works for you. You just have to take the time to experiment and find that right combination, which you obviously successfully did. Cheers!
 
Alex, this is a bit off topic and I agree with you said but have recently read that supinated WG chins can lead, over time, to trouble where the bicep meets the shoulder and pronated WG pull ups can lead to shoulder joint problems. I have now switched to a neutral grip (palms facing each other) medium width pull ups and find I eliminated all shoulder and bicep pain and can handle heavier loads as the bicep is in a better position. I do the same thing with lat pull downs and would with bench presses if I had the equipment that allowed me to do that. A lot of shoulder injuries come from wide pronated lifts. Again, these injuries come from long time lifting in those positions, not overnight.
 
Thanks for the insight, guys.

I just found out my buddy who sent me that video is seeing an orthopedic surgeon today because his shoulder is NOT getting any better. This is not a path I want to follow him down. We've both only been at it as adults for about six or eight months now, but he's sighting years of bad form in high school and college as the seed for all of this. I hope he can figure it out. He's been super motivated to make some positive changes and I'd hate to see it go down the drain due to injury.
 
Old and Grey said:
Alex, this is a bit off topic and I agree with you said but have recently read that supinated WG chins can lead, over time, to trouble where the bicep meets the shoulder and pronated WG pull ups can lead to shoulder joint problems. I have now switched to a neutral grip (palms facing each other) medium width pull ups and find I eliminated all shoulder and bicep pain and can handle heavier loads as the bicep is in a better position. I do the same thing with lat pull downs and would with bench presses if I had the equipment that allowed me to do that. A lot of shoulder injuries come from wide pronated lifts. Again, these injuries come from long time lifting in those positions, not overnight.
Click to expand...

I agree. My preferred spacing and hand placement is palms-facing, although I did find a great piece of equipment the other day that had sort of, 30-45degrees between palms-facing and supinated. Felt great.

But yeh. Any 'extreme' in life usually leads to a negative result down the track. Big scale or small scale. And this fractal theory applies to weightlifting too. Fully supinated grip is arguably an extreme, super-wide pronated is an extreme.
 
Nagels said:
Hi nis - to answer your question......no , barbell rows won't be enough to work your rear delts on their own. They're a small posterior muscle and they need their own special attention. Trust me on this , I have the rotator cuff from hell to prove this point after figuring that they would get plenty of attention from other work sets for many years.
I now spend my time nursing my delts with lighter dumbells and pure isolation movements ,my rhomboids and traps are also getting the same attention. I don't have my time over again as I am where I am , but I would encourage you to work your delts carefully and with patience through external rotations and light overhead shrugs to warm up and then rear delt raises and lateral raises. I was a big overhead press fan but now I wouldn't even consider it were I problem free. Delts are a small group that are located in a multi joint area , isolate your posterior and lateral delts and they will grow in a balanced manner. No need to do anything for the front delt , it gets plenty of air time in your bench.
Click to expand...

This is an excellent answer. I too have had shoulder problems, I agree with everything Nagels said here. Good advice all around.
 
Unsupported bent over rows may be putting undue static stress on your lower back.
I've been doing 1-armed lying side laterals for the purposes of keeping my rear delts developed, and thus preventing any risks coming from front/rear delt development imbalance.
 
HST_Rihad said:
Unsupported bent over rows may be putting undue static stress on your lower back.
Click to expand...

Any exercise performed incorrectly can place the wrong level of static stress on the body.

Supported BB rows are a very bad exercise. Extreme hyperextension of the lower back, compression affecting your breathing. You lose all structural support from the glutes and legs.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top