Ephedrine HCL and ephedra extract.

R

restless

New Member
I just saw in a site (netrition.com) a product that contains an ephedra extract with 60 mg of ephedrine that is presented as equivalent in potency to 25 mg of ephedrine HCL. Is this true? If so then the equivalent to the recommended 70 mg per day of ephedrine HCL would be around 160 mg of ephedra extract ephedrine. I am worrying now that i might be underdosing with 72 mg of natural ephedrine...... :confused:

Here's the link.
 
Depends on the standardisation, Ma Haung is usually 6% stndzed. Also which alkaloids that you get are purely up to chance, where as HCL is ephedrine :D

Man i wish I Could get some....
but then again its illegal in competition or out of competition. :-(
 
Thanks for the reply, but what I meant is that they state that 60 mg of EPHEDRINE from an herbal extract has an potency that equals 25 mg of ephedrine HCL.

This doesn't make much sense to me, since it should be the same compound right? Nevertheless it has had me worrying about underdosing it.
 
I think the confusion lies in the fact that their product's name is "Ephedrine 60" - which in this case says nothing about the actual content of the ephedrine hcl alkaloid (which is 25mg). They could call a protein product "Protein 360", and still only have 80g of protein per 100g. Dose accordingly.
 
Maybe, but they do say "60 mg of Ephedrine derived from Ephedra Extract " and then: "The natural Ephedrine 60 is similar in strength to 25 Mg of the synthetic Ephedrine HCL. "
ence the confusion. :confused:
 
It will be 60mg of ephedrine extract, but due to impurities, it matches 25mg of the E HcL
or sumfin like that
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Aaron_F @ Jan. 05 2003,2:35)]It will be 60mg of ephedrine extract, but due to impurities, it matches 25mg of the E HcL
or sumfin like that
Click to expand...
Actually, that might be it. Thanks Aaron. That's one potent ephedra extract then, if it has around 30 % active component.

This advertising is not clear at all. Whish I hadn't read it. :mad:
 
One other thing, anyone knows how much is your body temperature suposed to rise while on EC stack? The rise I'm getting is very small, like 0.2 ºC.
 
If you want to be sure of the dose you're getting then just use the real deal ephidrine HCL. 1fast400 sells bottles of 60 25mg pills (scored so you can break them in half) for like 7.00. He also sells caffeine pills cheap.

Here is the link:

Ephedrine HCL

Steve
 
Ephedra contains "alkaloids", which include ephedrine, norephedrine, pseudoephedrine and norpseudoephedrine, as well as tannins, etc.

Ephedrine HCL is a pure, medical drug containing ephedrine only.

They are not equal in effects. Some of the alkaloids in ephedra may be more likely to stimulate heart rate, etc. and is probably the more useful decongestant. Due to tannins, ephedra is "slower" in its onset and probably lasts longer in the system, whereas ephedrine hcl absorbs quickly, spikes quickly, and probably leaves the system sooner.

Do a medline search, they are both useful, but are perhaps NOT the same in effects.




d.
 
This one didn't:


Herbal ephedra/caffeine for weight loss: a 6-month randomized safety and efficacy trial.

Boozer CN, Daly PA, Homel P, Solomon JL, Blanchard D, Nasser JA, Strauss R, Meredith T.

New York Obesity Research Center, St Luke's-Roosevelt Hospital and Columbia University, New York 10025, USA.

OBJECTIVE: To examine long-term safety and efficacy for weight loss of an herbal Ma Huang and Kola nut supplement (90/192 mg/day ephedrine alkaloids/caffeine). DESIGN: Six-month randomized, double-blind placebo controlled trial. SUBJECTS: A total of 167 subjects (body mass index (BMI) 31.8+/-4.1 kg/m(2)) randomized to placebo (n=84) or herbal treatment (n=83) at two outpatient weight control research units. MEASUREMENTS: Primary outcome measurements were changes in blood pressure, heart function and body weight. Secondary variables included body composition and metabolic changes. RESULTS: By last observation carried forward analysis, herbal vs placebo treatment decreased body weight (-5.3+/-5.0 vs. -2.6+/-3.2 kg, P<0.001), body fat (-4.3+/-3.3 vs. -2.7+/-2.8 kg, P=0.020) and LDL-cholesterol (-8+/-20 vs. 0+/-17 mg/dl, P=0.013), and increased HDL-cholesterol (+2.7+/-5.7 vs. -0.3+/-6.7 mg/dl, P=0.004). Herbal treatment produced small changes in blood pressure variables (+3 to -5 mm Hg, P< or =0.05), and increased heart rate (4+/-9 vs. -3+/-9 bpm, P<0.001), but cardiac arrhythmias were not increased (P>0.05). By self-report, dry mouth (P<0.01), heartburn (P<0.05), and insomnia (P<0.01) were increased and diarrhea decreased (P<0.05). Irritability, nausea, chest pain and palpitations did not differ, nor did numbers of subjects who withdrew. CONCLUSIONS: In this 6-month placebo-controlled trial, herbal ephedra/caffeine (90/192 mg/day) promoted body weight and body fat reduction and improved blood lipids without significant adverse events.
 
Or this one:


An herbal supplement containing Ma Huang-Guarana for weight loss: a randomized, double-blind trial.

Boozer CN, Nasser JA, Heymsfield SB, Wang V, Chen G, Solomon JL.

Obesity Research Center, St Luke's-Roosevelt Hospital Center and Department of Medicine, Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons, New York 10025, USA. [email protected]

OBJECTIVE: To examine in overweight humans the short-term safety and efficacy for weight loss of an herbal supplement containing Ma Huang, Guarana and other ingredients. DESIGN: An 8 week randomized, double-blind placebo controlled study of a herbal dietary supplement (72 mg/day ephedrine alkaloids and 240 mg/day caffeine). SUBJECTS: Overweight men and women (body mass index, > or =29 and < or =35 kg/m2). MEASUREMENTS: The primary outcome variable was body weight change. Secondary variables included anthropometric, metabolic and cardiovascular changes. RESULTS: Sixty-seven subjects were randomized to either placebo (n=32) or active Ma Huang/Guarana (n=35). Twenty-four subjects in each group completed the study. Active treatment produced significantly (P<0.006) greater loss of weight (X+/-s.d.,-4.0+/-3.4 kg) and fat (-2.1+/-3.0% fat) over the 8-week treatment period than did placebo (-0.8+/-2.4 kg and 0.2+/-2.3% fat). Active treatment also produced greater reductions in hip circumference and serum triglyceride levels. Eight of the 35 actively treated subjects (23%) and none of the 32 placebo-treated control subjects withdrew from the protocol because of potential treatment-related effects. Dry mouth, insomnia and headache were the adverse symptoms reported most frequently by the herbal vs placebo group at the final evaluation visit. CONCLUSIONS: This herbal mixture of Ma Huang and Guarana effectively promoted short-term weight and fat loss. Safety with long-term use requires further investigation.
 
Someone should tell these people that you should use a 1:10 ratio!
dozingoff.gif
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Steve McDermott @ Jan. 05 2003,8:36)]If you want to be sure of the dose you're getting then just use the real deal ephidrine HCL. 1fast400 sells bottles of 60 25mg pills (scored so you can break them in half) for like 7.00. He also sells caffeine pills cheap.
Here is the link:
Ephedrine HCL
Steve
Click to expand...
Good product. This is what I use myself, as D&E pharmacy--the only other legit distributor of ephedrine HCL--does not ship to states in which it is banned. One should be aware, though, that the product contains 200mg guafenesin per tablet (an expectorant, the main purpose of which is to prevent folks from cooking the stuff into meth), which has been linked to kidney stones in habitual users consuming as little as 600mg a day. There are at least two case studies looking at this, though no, to my knowledge, clinical studies. If you're predisposed to kidney stones, though, it's probably best to stay away.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Steve McDermott @ Jan. 06 2003,3:36)]If you want to be sure of the dose you're getting then just use the real deal ephidrine HCL. 1fast400 sells bottles of 60 25mg pills (scored so you can break them in half) for like 7.00. He also sells caffeine pills cheap.
Here is the link:
Ephedrine HCL
Steve
Click to expand...
Thanks Steve.

I'll have to find if this will get through local customs though. I have a feeling it won't.... :confused:
 
Thanks for teh stuidies, I hadn't seen them before. Ah customs, that is a whole other issue. I would email Mike at 1fast400, he would probably know if there are any issues where you are.

Steve
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Steve McDermott @ Jan. 07 2003,6:30)]Thanks for teh stuidies, I hadn't seen them before. Ah customs, that is a whole other issue. I would email Mike at 1fast400, he would probably know if there are any issues where you are.
Steve
Click to expand...
Yeah, let's see how it goes. I emailed Mike and he said it's always a gamble, might get through or not. I ordered one bottle, so let's see if it get's here. The worst that can happen is them asking for a medical prescription, which they are known to do sometimes.
dozingoff.gif
 
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