A/B split again

C

cgutcu

New Member
In 2008 I have tha plan to do these exercicies:
Leg press
Bench press
Incline dunbell bench press
Dips
Chins
Pull-Up
One-arm dunbell rows
Military Press
Dunbell lateral raises
Barbell curl
Triceps extension
Wrist curl
reverse wrist curl
Back extension

I want to do 2 full-body a week, a A and B split.Arms will be trained just one time a week.
Nedd sugestion on how to group the exercicies.
Thank you very much
 
Chins
Leg press
Incline DB Bench Press
Back extension
Dips
Wrist curl
Triceps extension

One-Arm Bent-Over Rows
Bench Press
Military Press
Pull-Up
Barbell curl
Reverse wrist curl
Lateral raises

This should give you some good spacing of exercises... Heavy bench and squat are front loaded but not at the beginning. I put an explosive movement as the first exercise for warm up. I hope this helps!
 
Squats?

Only one exercise for the lower body which is half of your musculature?

Almost 1/2 of the exercises are isolation as opposed to compound.

A visit to the Simplify and Win thread might be beneficial.
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<div>
(Old and Grey @ Dec. 18 2007,13:11)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Squats?

Only one exercise for the lower body which is half of your musculature?

Almost 1/2 of the exercises are isolation as opposed to compound.</div>
That's exactly what I was thinking!!!
 
I agree with many of the other members. Your selection is predominately upper body and isolation. Some of these lifts are variants. Pullups with a close grip and dumbell rows are the same joint movement, as an example. The lat selection at a glance is complete. As a result your lats and back in general may come to look sharp. However there are other lifts you could do instead of all the lat work that would better support a goal of total body mass. But you wanted to know how to split these so that's where I'll deposit my 2 cents.

Listed below is how I would split your lifts, how I would do the lifts, and the order in which I would do them. We can discuss the logic if you like.

A Day:
*Bench press.

*One arm dumbell row.

*Military Press.

*Barbell Curl - if you are doing 2 or more sets consider using a narrower-than-shoulder grip for one set and a wider-than-shoulder grip for the second set.

*Lateral Raise - rotate your arms inward so your elbow points upward slightly. This will emphasize the lateral head, which is what I think you want this lift for. Also rotate your entire arm closer to the center of your chest about 15 degrees.

*Triceps extension.

*Reverse wrist curl.

B Day:
*Leg Press - if you do 2 or more sets then do one set with the heels low on the plate and one set with heels higher on the plate. Higher plate reps should have your toes completely off the plate if possible. Lower plate emphasizes quads, higher plate emphasizes hamstrings. Because you have no calve training consider ending each rep with a toe press (lower plate only).

*Dips - at the top of the dip push your shoulder blades all the way down. This will activate the lower trapezius and pectoralis minor. Its part of why I put the dips on B day.

*Pullup - palms facing you for biceps emphasis, palms away from you for brachialis emphasis. Alternate if you like.

*Incline dumbell press.

*Back extension.

*Chinup - use a wide grip and pull yourself so the bar comes to your chest, not behind the head.

*Wrist curl - start with the weight at the end of your fingers, not in your fists.

----

I tried to balance the larger muscles - pec major, pec minor, serratus anterior, traps all fibers, lats, tris, bi's, and forearms - across both A and B days so you are stimulating these muscles every workout day of the week. Because of your selection some muscles will only get worked 1 or 2 times per week like your quads, hams, wrist extenders, and erector spinae. The lifting order was intended to give muscle groups a chance to recuperate before they are involved again during the workout. Supersetting does not enchance hypertrophy response. The NSCA did a study. If you follow Dan Moore then you likely know that strain is more important than fatigue for hypertrophy. In a nutshell, all of this is what I have in mind for my regimen so its how I assembled yours.
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Arms will be trained just one time a week.</div>

That's not realistic friend. Here's what that workout would look like:

A day - done only 1 day a week.
Bench press
Incline dumbell bench press
Dips
Chins
Pull-Up
One-arm dunbell rows
Military Press
Barbell curl
Triceps extension

B day - done 2 days a week.
Dumbell lateral raises
Leg press
Wrist curl
reverse wrist curl
Back extension
 
You only have six exercise that can be alternated. They work the same muscle groups. The rest don't have a listed exercise that is similar. So alternate the exercises listed, but the rest should be done on both days since you are only training twice/week.


A)Dips B)Bench press
A)Pull-Up B)Chins
A)Incline dunbell bench press B)Military Press
Leg Press (A+B)
Dunbell lateral raises (A+B)
One-arm dunbell rows (A+B)
Barbell curl (A+B)
Triceps extension (A+B)
Wrist curl (A+B)
reverse wrist curl (A+B)
Back extension (A+B)
 
Thank's for the aswer's.
My gym dont have a power rack.Squats is out.Also, I wont want to do the deadlift now, since I had lower back injury in the past.
These exercicies I listed is the ones that I do pain free.I will only train 2 times a week(no free time).I have 2 options on my mind:

A
Leg press
Bench press
Pull-up
Military presses
One-arm dunbell rows
Triceps extension
wrist curl





B

Leg press
Chins
Incline dunbell bench press
Dips
Lateral raises
Barbell curls
Back extension
Reverse wrist curl
Or a more simple, just this:

A
Leg press
Bench press
One-arm dunbell rows



B

Chins
Military press
Leg press
Incline dunbell bench press
Back extension

I read simpl. and win , but even on this are many routines whit isolation mov.
My delts are pour and I lost size on arms and forearms if I dont train this directly.
Also, I am not a begginer, I am intermed..Begginers gains are out of me.
Thank's for the help!!
 
Just because you had a back injury in the past doesn't mean you should exclude deadlifts from your routine now. Deadlifting is not bad or dangerous for your back, in fact it is quite the opposite if you learn to lift with good form before increasing the loads.

What is the current situation with your lower back? If you are actually in pain (from an injury) then leg presses are not a particularly good idea either even if you use a greatly reduced range of motion (but then, what's the point?).

Some years ago I sustained a ruptured disc in my lower back from lifting a heavy plywood sheet awkwardly on to a roof. It did take a good while to heal but I was always getting trouble with it until I started deadlifting two years ago. My lower back is now so much stronger and has been pain free over that time (well, I say pain free; I have had sore spinal erectors but I view that as a 'pleasant' pain  
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).

So, what I am saying is, don't exclude deads unless you know that they will exacerbate a spinal injury, congenital defect or an ongoing condition; when performed correctly, they can be a very useful back rehab exercise as well as a fantastic overall bodybuilding exercise. If you do feel you can give them a shot, do be sure to start off with a light weight (say, 40kg to 60kg) and build them up gradually.
 
In the past, the presure on the nerve was so severe that I cant extend my rigth leg.Now, I can extend it and fells nothing!!!
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I just the fear of injuring it again.Also, I have natural big traps and small delts, and deadlift will make this even more pour.
So, If I restart the deadlift, it should be made in the begining of the workout or at the end?
 
OK, well if you have a long-term condition that you think deadlifting might well exacerbate then it makes no sense to make matters worse. It might be worth getting a medical opinion though. If you got the 'OK' and wanted to add them in to your routine then I would do them in place of the leg-press, just once a week, and see how you get on.
 
Lol said it all for me; I'm in the same boat, having been in agony for 30 years of supposedly &quot;bad back&quot; and I still wonder if my bigger problem might not have been chiropractors.
Deads and squats are doing wonders for me. I live with the erector pain, as does Lol, but it's perfectly bearable compared to the agony I went through with the back weakened from not using it.
To feel and be safe, if you go to deads and squats, just start light and advance slowly with perfect form. Let the back strengthen itself. In the meantime, you could push harder on the presses and junk that doesn't hurt you now for strength and a bit of development.
BTW, my legs are stick-determined. They never grew for 'squat' until I did squats and deads. Not huge now, but better, and I'm 54.
 
You only have 2 days a week!? Ok. That is life. The A/B split is not the best for this. My split was designed to work out the same muscles every workout day. I understand that your arms need iso's to grow. Below I have written up an alternate routine that you do each workout day. I try to squeeze in a lot of exercises like you but it is not easy. Time is limited. So we must be efficient.

Leg Press to toe press. - quadriceps, hamstrings, soleus, gastrocenemius, prolly some glutes in there too and a few knick knack muscles.

Decline Bench Press - triceps and mid to lower chest (sternal head of pectoralis major)

Wide Grip Chinup/Pulldown to the chest. - lats, lower to mid traps, rhomboids, posterior(rear) deltoid, and teres major.

Jerk and Push Press. - lateral and anterior deltoid, upper trap, middle traps, lower traps, triceps, coracobrachialis, and upper chest (clavicular head of pectoralis major).

Barbell Curl - biceps and brachialis.

Louie - bent arm pullover into lying triceps extension - works long head of triceps which is the biggest part, and also the medial and lateral heads. Better than a cable extension and better than a lying extension.

Wrist curl.

Reverse wrist curl.

If your A/B split doesnt work, consider the routine above. It is more simple. You can add a barbell row or a close grip pullup for your lats and overall back if you want. Lateral raises can also be added.

The one arm dumbell rows are time consuming. Why do them? Use a barbell so you can do the same work in half the time. The Jerk and Push Press is two shoulder exercises in one. Keep your grip close to shoulder width and your upper pecs will be directly involved, therefore we can drop the incline presses. The decline press does for the pecs what the flat bench and dips do together. So we drop both flat bench and dips and use a decline bench. Close grip pullups and dumbell rows are the same movement for the lats. They are both humeral extension. Drop one and if you do rows use a barbell. If using a barbell hurts your back because you must lean over than do close grip pullups. One arm dumbell work wastes time. You could do two lifts in the time it takes to do one set of one arm dumbell rows. If you want to add lateral raises without taking more time then forget one arm dumbell rows and do a set of close grip pullups and a set of lateral raises in the same amount of time.

No abdominal work?

Consider rotator cuff work. It is not very intense. You are intermediate so think about injury prevention.

I have not read the simplify and win article. My ideas come from my understanding of muscle anatomy and the EMG studies I have read.

I know enough about the back to know you shouldn't mess with it if you don't know what you're doing. I think it is wise not to do deadlifts until you see a doctor. Not all back injuries are the same. The Jerks may activate your back pain. If so drop Jerks and do only the Push Press and add lateral raises. Remember to keep your elbows pointing upward slightly. People who do lateral raises like they are birds flapping their wings haven't read a kinesiology text.

Good luck. I hope the routine you choose works.
 
Thank's.
Just a doubth:close grip chins is for back wide.
and one-arm dunbell rows for back thickness?

Also, whit just 2 workouts a week, 20 reps per mov. is enougth?
My plan is to take my 5 rm, do 5 reps, rest 1min, then do 3 or 2 reps untill I reach 20 total reps.This way I will save time than doing it 5 reps, rest 3 min, 5 reps, rest 5min, and so on...
Why not alternate the exercicies whit a A day and a B day?What the problem on this?
QuantumPositron, your ideias are very interesting!!
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Thank you very much!!
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">close grip chins is for back wide.
and one-arm dunbell rows for back thickness?</div>

That's what people say. Without scientific research all you can do is see for yourself. Deadlifts will put muscle on your upper back as well. I have heard snatch grip rack pull deadlifts are the best for this. I remind you this is just what people say. I do wide grip pulldowns and barbell rows in my regimen because I have time.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Also, whit just 2 workouts a week, 20 reps per mov. is enougth?</div>

You are doing your reps in a manner that is similar to Max-Stim. I think 20 reps is enough. If you do two sets of ten reps that is also twenty reps. Many people grow on just one or two sets.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Why not alternate the exercicies whit a A day and a B day?What the problem on this?</div>

A/B system is only a problem if you do not stimulate the same muscles on both days. This is because you work out two times per week. How can you get the best biceps growth if you only stimulate biceps once a week? If you alternate between A and B days be certain all muscles are stimulated on A day and on B day. This means you will do leg press, wrist curl, and wrist extension on A day and on B day.
 
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