Advice on 2 hst days per week + 1 day at home

K

knight

New Member
Hi everyone,

I have had a surgery and did not lift for 3 months. I am just getting back on track ( i used to do 3 day split with some success) . I assessed my 15s and going to do the 10s and 5s next.

The problem is I am very busy and have hard time going to the gym but i might be able to go twice a week . I have a pair of adjustable dumbells at home so i can train there but obvioulsy I can't do much as I have no bench at all just dumbells. so what do you recommend ?

monday gym

wed home

friday gym
?

what exercises can I do with just a pair of dumbells related to hst other than curl, triceps extension and are recommended to keep me in the hst cycle?

Thanks everyone

I currently do in this order (1 set each) :

squat

Incline bench
bent over row

chins
dips

military press
calve raises

bicep curl
tricep extension

stiff legged deadlift
weighted ab machine

please critique also
 
Since you're only doing 2 days per week, you can do more volume, so do at least 2 sets of everything, if not 3. Try to set a high rep count if you're going for constant reps, like 25-30, so you're doing 50-60 reps per ex per week, same as if you were doing 3x per week.

Do arm isos, lat raises and abs on off days at home with your DBs (use that extra time in the gym to do extra sets of your big exercises)
 
Knight

What Peak recommends is very much what i am busy doing, I admit though trying to go for 6 sets, but having to stick to 4 or 5 depending on how I feel on that particular day (since I am on 5's now).

It was fine though thorughout the 15's doing 2 sets and the 10's doing three sets, my exercise selection though is only the big five.

And on days off I do curls (variety) and tricep exercises (also varied), but include 3 x week Tabata, that is the only difference.

I do miss the MRP's and creatine badly and my strength is not the same without them, but if you get stuck just backup one w/o and carry on!
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You could also add in d/b flyes.
Hey guys, wouldn't you just need to do failure training at 2x a week only? Seems to miss the HST principles of recovery, so why not just slam it?
 
Quad: I don't think going to failure every workout is going to help with hypertrophy. Whilst frequency is down on three times a week, hitting all body parts twice a week is still going to elicit good results if everything else is in order.

I think Peak and Fausto are on the money. Just up the volume on the days you can hit the gym (Mon & Fri). So do around 1 and a half workouts worth each session (about 25 reps per exercise). If that pushes up your gym time excessively just drop arm isos and, as Peak and Fausto suggest, hit arm isos on Wednesdays. You could also do some side and rear lateral raises and ab work. One legged calf raises are really hard if you hold a db and stand on a stair or similar. If you could rig up a chinning bar somehow that would get your back sorted.
 
Hey ,

Thanks for the advice everybody. I assume that when you mean do 25 reps that I can do them in multiple sets and not 1 set as that is going to bring the weight down a lot . so I would do 1 set of squats X15 reps and the next would be x 10 . Is that right ?

I also have a question: while gauging my inital strength ( after the setback due to the surgery) I found out that I can do a specific weight X12 but if i lower the weight just one level then i can do 15s easily so which one do I stick to when I am findng my maxes?

since I can do arm Isos at home , I can drop them from the gym and up my sets for the other exercises that I can't do at home so when I come home can I do my arm isos after workout ( 30 min difference after I leave the gym) or should I do them another time during the day like say the morning or before I go to workout ?

Thanks
 
can anybody answer my last 2 questions please?

1) I also have a question: while gauging my inital strength ( after the setback due to the surgery) I found out that I can do a specific weight X12 but if i lower the weight just one level then i can do 15s easily so which one do I stick to when I am findng my maxes?

2)since I can do arm Isos at home , I can drop them from the gym and up my sets for the other exercises that I can't do at home so when I come home can I do my arm isos after workout ( 30 min difference after I leave the gym) or should I do them another time during the day like say the morning or before I go to workout ?

Thanks
 
1) Stick to 15's and go through them, by the time you hit the 2 nd week of 15's you will be bale to lift the 12's weight without a doubt.

2) Keep arm iso's for days off as suggested for now if yoiu can handle more volume, then start including them 8 or so hours before the workout.
 
I sometimes do arm isos and abs on my off-days. Just make sure you don't overdo it. It's easily done as you will be fresh.
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">so I would do 1 set of squats X15 reps and the next would be x 10 . Is that right ?</div>

Exactly!

Tabata+Arm &amp; Shoulder isolation on off days works well for me.
 
Stop by your local thrift store: they usually have flat benches or BB benches for $5-$20, and a bar for even less. I used to even use a strong coffee table, but I don't recommend risking it.

LOL, I disagree. I built most of me on failure training 3x a week; there are a hundred programs out there that get some results. I was just thinking that since he's limited, his results will also be somewhat, so it might be better to maximise, since he's got more recovery time. But I didn't pay attention to the surgeries; my bad. You guys were right. I gotta start reading slower...
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(quadancer @ Nov. 07 2006,13:48)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">LOL, I disagree. I built most of me on failure training 3x a week; there are a hundred programs out there that get some results. I was just thinking that since he's limited, his results will also be somewhat, so it might be better to maximise, since he's got more recovery time. But I didn't pay attention to the surgeries; my bad. You guys were right. I gotta start reading slower...
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</div>
Quad: I'm not knocking what you did, just stating that it isn't going to improve his chances of progress going to failure twice a week against not going to failure.

We all now understand that progressive strain and work done are two of the primary factors required to induce hypertrophy over time. Failure training does help with strength because of the neural implications but, even then, if you do it all the time you will plateau sooner.

Why will failure training make up for the reduced frequency? So, I feel some extra volume would be more beneficial if time and energy permit, clustering reps if need be to control fatigue.
 
Well I think this begins to get into that old argument for volume or intensity. In this case, of two vs. three workouts a week, I'd say that (injuries and surguries aside), doing HST for two days a week negates the frequency part of the principles. You've gone back to hitting the muscles two times a week, as in failure training, so why not make it count?
Here again, you could skip failure and just do more sets and I suppose get nearly the same effect, but that's another argument I'm not qualified with any opinions on. That said, more sets means a longer workout, so maybe that's not viable either.
I just can't really justify calling it HST if you're taking five days a week off, you see?
 
Well, you might be right about the volume Quad. It would certainly be up to the individual to decide whether enough of a growth stimulus was being created from 2 x weekly with standard volume. It quite probably would be, so the extra volume might not be necessary for growth and would just be burning calories.

I just think the extra volume would be preferable to failure training every workout. Don't forget that for HST we are focussing on lifting more than the previous w/o and not on how tired we feel as an indicator of an effective w/o.

For it to be HST we would have to have:

1) Mechanical Load - strain on the muscle tissue not the effort reqiored to lift the load - Yup

2) Acute vs. Chronic Stimuli applied with Sufficient frequency - perhaps not optimised for all body parts, but not too bad either considering some working out to be done at home, mid-week (some of Dan's research papers show 2 x weekly being almost as good as 3 x weekly).

3) Progressive Loading throughout cycle - Yup

4) Strategic Deconditioning - Yup

I think Blade made a few good points when he said:

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">It is not necessary to train at 100% voluntary strength levels to stimulate &quot;growth&quot;. ... It isn't necessary to push against a weight that won't move (due to load or fatigue) to induce the necessary strain to muscle that leads to growth.</div>

I've blathered on enough but I do feel that recommending failure every workout is just not a good idea for knight.
 
Merely discussing, not arguing, but I said injuries and surgeries aside, meaning Knight was excluded, of course. I didn't see the article of Dan's you did, so I'm not sure what the parameters were, but basically I'm saying that most all programs make adjustments for lesser frequency, and I'd say that HST is no lone ranger. The difference for me would merely be a couple of reps per set to hit failure, since I do a linear type progression - and I'm probably thinking from that point of view.
I can see that for someone zigzagging that it would be an entirely different animal. They themselves would have to go linear in order to do it.

Maybe this is telling me not to worry so much when I miss a workout (like yesterday!) The temptation here is to work out less though, and that's a danger to this old guy~!
 
Hey Quad, my bad! I forgot Knight had had an injury!  
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 However, I still think it makes sense to train with HST principles even if you can only manage 2 x weekly. I'll see if I can locate that article relating to frequency on Dan's site. It made me think too. However, the fact that Dan recommends 3 x weekly for MaxStim tells me that there is probably a greater summation effect overall with three times a week over twice a week training (obviously talking full body w/os here).

So, re the failure thing: I get what you are saying ie. whatever the load that day, do a few more reps to reach failure, but I don't understand why this would be any better for hypertrophy than stopping a set prior to failure, as per HST, taking a brief rest and then doing a few more reps? (Or in other words, doing a bit more volume whilst better managing fatigue.)

If it can take up to 7 days for the CNS to recover fully from a bout to failure (as I think has been shown to be the case, although I can't now find where I read it  
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) then it would make sense to only go to failure once a week at most, but I reckon the usual HST once a fortnight is better.

It may well be (as in the case of many other factors) that folks react differently to failure training. My personal experience is that if I push a set to failure then any subsequent sets are severely affected (ie. I reach failure again very quickly), whereas if I stop a rep or two short of failure, I am able to complete further sets. I'd be interested to know if you find it the same or not? If you were doing, say, 2 sets of 10s would you go to failure on both or just the second set? And if you went to failure on the first set would you then have to do several sets with reduced reps just to get your allocated reps in?

So, yeah, I agree that for reduced frequency an adjustment might be necessary and for me at least, I feel that adjustment would likely be a bit of extra volume whilst avoiding failure to reduce overall fatigue.
 
<div>
(Lol @ Nov. 08 2006,09:35)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I still think it makes sense to train with HST principles even if you can only manage 2 x weekly. I'll see if I can locate that article relating to frequency on Dan's site.

If it can take up to 7 days for the CNS to recover fully from a bout to failure (as I think has been shown to be the case, although I can't now find where I read it  
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) then it would make sense to only go to failure once a week at most, but I reckon the usual HST once a fortnight is better.



So, yeah, I agree that for reduced frequency an adjustment might be necessary and for me at least, I feel that adjustment would likely be a bit of extra volume whilst avoiding failure to reduce overall fatigue.</div>
Unless I misread something, CNS is a 72 hour phenomenon, so twice a week workouts are in the clear for failure training. Which would help increase strength, which would increase loads, which would increase hypertrophy, since you're going in the less frequency direction. HST is the opposite, since it stays out of the CNS, and the muscles are ready to go in 48, you get to do more frequency.
As I understand it all.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">So, re the failure thing: I get what you are saying ie. whatever the load that day, do a few more reps to reach failure, but I don't understand why this would be any better for hypertrophy than stopping a set prior to failure, as per HST, taking a brief rest and then doing a few more reps? (Or in other words, doing a bit more volume whilst better managing fatigue.)</div>
You're talking volume again here. I'm not.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"> If you were doing, say, 2 sets of 10s would you go to failure on both or just the second set? And if you went to failure on the first set would you then have to do several sets with reduced reps just to get your allocated reps in?</div>
I've kind of stopped warming up a lot. So if I were doing failure sets (IF) I would be at a slightly higher weight than last workout, and maybe fail early in the first set, and cluster it. Then try on the second set to hit the rep mark, but not really worry if I didn't. If I came in too low on reps, I'd stay at that weight for the next workout, because I wouldn't be ready to advance yet.

With my present HST sets, I can't do intentional failure because of the same reason as you: fatigue for the rest of the workout. But I often hit failure on some exersizes due to the linear progression I use. When you guys go to the tens, say, you drop the weight. I don't. I keep adding whatever increments I'm using and keep stroking. Then if I hit a slow rep before the 10th, (primary failure), I stay at that weight for the next workout. But most of my sets just keep adding up. It's ;just a little more brutal than vanilla, but great for strength.
As I see it. Peace bro.
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