Anabolic Response

[quadancer]

It's several related questions, regarding anabolism. QP posted something about splits not being optimal from a study and I got to wondering.
To compare to what we know: about 50 minutes being optimal for a workout. I'm comparing a 50 minute workout, (fullbody) to these:
a.) A split ocurring in the same day, half the body in the morning and the other later.
b.) A split ocurring with almost fullbody and the leftovers occurring later.
c.) Any split with the A routine on one day and the B on the other.

I occasionally don't finish a workout and hit the remainder later, so questions arise, like:
- Is later in the day a weaker anabolic response?
- Is tomorrow better for that?
- Is overlap a big problem? I mean say, doing something that hits a muscle in the morning like how deads hit the traps a bit, then hitting shrugs directly to the traps later?
Dig deep guys, this is important, I think.

 

[cxw]

I'm not digging deep, nor am I strong (although I have gotten stronger thanks mainly to HST).

IMHO I don't think it matters too much.

 

[quadancer]

Wow, I'm surprised not to see some anwers to this one: seems like something we'd all like to know about. Maybe there are more drunks in here than I thot: we just stay home and safe on New Years! (watched Spiderman 3...)

 

[imported_frivolousz21]

well..I have thought about splitting legs and upper body...because I believe my legs need more work.


However, they say 36-48 hours of recovery is optimal for growth and strengh gains.

wouldnt splitting hurt that

 

[Krieger]

I'm very curious to see the response to these questions.

 

[QuantumPositron]

Quad,

I tried to find some articles pertaining to split training effectiveness. I managed to dig up one on the effect of splitting the volume between two sessions in one day. Here is the abstract:

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Distribution of strength training volume into one or two daily sessions and neuromuscular adaptations in female athletes.
Häkkinen K, Kallinen M.

Department of Biology of Physical Activity, University of Jyväskylä, Finland.

Neuromuscular adaptations were investigated in ten female athletes during a &quot;normal&quot; intensive strength training period for 3-weeks (I) as well as during a separate second 3-week training period (II), when the same total training volume was distributed into two daily sessions. No systematic changes took place in the maximal voluntary neural activation (averaged integrated EMG) of the leg extensor muscles, in the cross-sectional area (CSA) of the quadriceps femoris muscle or in maximal voluntary isometric strength of the leg extensor muscles over training period I with one daily sessions. However, a significant increase was observed in maximal strength from 2493 +/- 553 to 2620 +/- 598 N (p &lt; 0.05) during period II accompanied also by a significant (p &lt; 0.05) enlargement in the cross-sectional area of the muscle and by slight (ns.) increases in the maximum IEMGs of the trained muscles. The individual changes in the maximum IEMGs of the trained muscles during period II correlated significantly (p &lt; 0.01) with the individual changes in maximal strength. The present results with female athletes suggest that the distribution of the volume of intensive strength training into smaller units, such as two daily sessions, may create more optimal conditions not only for muscular hypertrophy but by producing effective training stimuli especially for the nervous system. These kinds of training conditions may lead to further strength development in athletes being greater than obtained during &quot;normal&quot; strength training of the same duration.

PMID: 8187678 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]</div>

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed....actPlus

Other articles I found on the topic examined hormonal and other responses but did not examine strength and/or size specifically.

 

[quadancer]

I would assume that they correlate...hypertrophy dependent upon hormonal response and/or availability. I sort of wanted the best anabolic system to be divulged; being older and lacking the hormones of my youthful counterparts. First glance, it appears that there may be no difference.
The strength may be better, but I find it difficult to drag myself back in there again...which is why I usually do fullbody.
Thanx again, QP.

 

[BAX67]

If you provide your body with the right nutrients post workout to promote anabolism and your body is an anabolic state to start,  I wouldn't think it would matter if you split the workouts , one in the morning and one later.  I guess it boils down to can you give it your all on the later workout to trigger the anabolic response or are you just going through the motions.  I personally prefer one full body workout because I just don't have the time to split.

 

[quadancer]

I'm with you man, not enough hours in the day...but I've tried splits and usually feel so shot at the end of the day I skip...and therefore lose ground, having to catch up the next day. I don't really like working out in the evening unless I have to. That's aging for ya, or I'm just a morning person. (I'm superman at 10:00am)
I was really more interested in the GH spurts and total test output differences. There may not be any info out there on that yet. A lot of stuff is going on by way of studies lately though.

 

[Old and Grey]

My &quot;full body&quot; workouts actually take 4 workouts over two days to complete. For example:

Monday AM:
Chest
Monday PM:
Shoulders, Traps and Triceps

Tuesday AM:
Back and Biceps
Tuesday PM:
Legs

Each workout is about 15 to 20 minutes.

I believe that I get much more effective workouts this way as overall fatigue never has time to set in.

 

[imported_fearfactory]

great topic.

if you happen to come across a study that shows anabolic hormone response (GH, test, IGF-1) to resistance exercise in men 40+, please let me know. I've been looking for awhile but my search skills aren't the best.

 

[Ruthenian]

Quad,

I run into a similar problem.  I like to workout in the morning, but in order to get ready, get the kid off to school and, a few days a week, take a long commute, I have to get up before 5 am.  I suspect that over all the important thing is that you do it, whether it takes a few days or not.

That said, the study cited makes sense to me.  I tend to think that getting it all done in one day is best, especially if you are hitting any of the same muscle groups in each set - and with compound exercises this often happens.  My reasoning is that this gives maximum recovery time between days -- if you spread it out too much you reduce the time each muscle has to recover.  Thus, I make sure to do the big, important lifts in the morning  and  try to finish my routine in the evening with the lesser lifts.

Still, I am just getting over a cold and spread this last routine over three days due to fatigue (on 2x/wk frequency right now) -- better that than not finishing at all.