Bench press, dips, cable cross-over and another question

[hardvig]

Hi there everyone

I'm completely new to this site, but I hope you will still answer my questions

I am starting my 1st cycle in 2 weeks (finding my 15RM, 10RM and 5RM this week and then SD for 9 days)

I am considering using this program http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/hst_II.html (a little down the page), but I noticed yesterday, while finding my 15RM that there is no Bench Press in this program?!

Now... I was wondering if it would be okay to replace the incline BP with standard BP and add Cable cross-over - or will this change mean that I will be over training my chest and tricps? (when there are also dips and triceps extensions...) I think I can contribute my current lack of progress to over training, I am therefore very careful not to end up over training, but I really love BP, dips and cable cross overs!

And the 2nd question:

When should I check my new RM's? after my 5RM negative period, before the SD or after the SD, before the new 15RM cycle?

Thank you in advance for your answers

 

[Old and Grey]

HV, personally I would stick to incline BP and dips. They are two of the best compound chest exercises. However, if you keep your 10 rep and 5 rep sets low in quantity, there is nothing wrong with adding a finishing set of semi-isolation cable flyes of about 15 reps to keep all growth pathways open. I use weighted push ups as a chest finishing exercise but cable flyes would also work. I tend to stay away from flat bench presses as they cause shoulder problems for me. With slight inclines, I am able to keep better form.

After you have completed a cycle of HST, you can pretty much guesstimate your maxes for the next cycle and be close enough (i.e., within 5%). You can also adjust mid rep range if you feel you have mis-estimated. Constantly testing maxes is a bit of a waste of time when you could be working out, in my opinion.

 

[hardvig]

Thank you very much

I think im gonna go with the 1x15 2x10 3x5 approach, which just made me think: some of my exercises are 2 set'ers from start - do I then do 2x15, 4x10 and 6x5?

Oh anf maybe it's just my english that isn't good enough, but what do you mean by growth pathways?

 

[Old and Grey]

HV, the program you referenced was set up to use the same number of sets for 15 reps as for 5 reps. If you try and double or triple that, you will be seriously overtraining.

Without getting into technical terms, you should just know that there are several "pathways" to muscle growth. HST tries to cover them all by using the 15, 10, 5 rep approach. That being said, some find it advantageous to keep a high rep set as a "finishing" set to continue to stimulate the pathways that respond to high reps while they are concentrating on the pathways that respond well to low reps. The choice of the exercise is not that critical and it is also not necessary to go to failure to obtain the benefit. The more compound the finishing exercise chosen, the more the benefit. For chest, I usually do a set of push ups, 15 reps if I use a weighted vest and 50 reps if just my bodyweight.

For your first HST cycle, I would just recommend that you follow the program that Bryan outlined that you referenced and worry about 'tweaking' it at a later date.

Good luck and let us know how you make out.

O&G

 

[hardvig]

Thank you

I'm going to just follow the program as laid out and maybe change the exercises for my 2nd cycle

I'm going to take some "before"-pictures this sunday, and then start the cycle on monday

 

[faz]

Thank you

I'm going to just follow the program as laid out and maybe change the exercises for my 2nd cycle

I'm going to take some "before"-pictures this sunday, and then start the cycle on monday

if you have been lifting before you might find 1x15 2x10 3x5 a little to easy,i would personaly go with 2x15 3x10 3x5.

 

[hardvig]

Old and Grey just told me to follow the program as it stands i.e. 1x15, 1x10, 1x5...

I have been lifting for about 1.5 years... I'm just thinking that the 2x 3x 3x way to do things seems a little like what I have been doing so far - with less than impressive results... however one (major) difference is the progressive load and the change of reps - I've been doing 3x10-12 for the entire year...

this is however my first

 

[faz]

Old and Grey just told me to follow the program as it stands i.e. 1x15, 1x10, 1x5...

I have been lifting for about 1.5 years... I'm just thinking that the 2x 3x 3x way to do things seems a little like what I have been doing so far - with less than impressive results... however one (major) difference is the progressive load and the change of reps - I've been doing 3x10-12 for the entire year...

this is however my first

yeah O&G probably thought you were a noobie,but if you have already lifted for nearly 2yrs and done sets of 3 i dont see the point in doing less even with an SD.

 

[Old and Grey]

Faz, with the program he selected and what you are suggesting it would call for 6 sets of chest during the 15's and 9 sets during the 10's and 5's, three times per week or almost 200 sets for a total body workout per week. That is about 4 hours on workout days, at least. That is extreme overkill unless he has been lifting for about 10 years and been on heavy juice for about 5 years and double splits each workout over two days. Perhaps you did not take into account the program he was referencing? That program, with no modifications calls for 66 sets per week as written without any tweaking. Or, perhaps, I misread what you were intending to say?

 

[faz]

Faz, with the program he selected and what you are suggesting it would call for 6 sets of chest during the 15's and 9 sets during the 10's and 5's, three times per week or almost 200 sets for a total body workout per week. That is about 4 hours on workout days, at least. That is extreme overkill unless he has been lifting for about 10 years and been on heavy juice for about 5 years and double splits each workout over two days. Perhaps you did not take into account the program he was referencing? That program, with no modifications calls for 66 sets per week as written without any tweaking. Or, perhaps, I misread what you were intending to say?

no sorry mate thought he was just talking about a straight fullbody 3x awk.

 

[manimal]

Hi there everyone

I'm completely new to this site, but I hope you will still answer my questions

I am starting my 1st cycle in 2 weeks (finding my 15RM, 10RM and 5RM this week and then SD for 9 days)

I am considering using this program http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/hst_II.html (a little down the page), but I noticed yesterday, while finding my 15RM that there is no Bench Press in this program?!

Now... I was wondering if it would be okay to replace the incline BP with standard BP and add Cable cross-over - or will this change mean that I will be over training my chest and tricps? (when there are also dips and triceps extensions...) I think I can contribute my current lack of progress to over training, I am therefore very careful not to end up over training, but I really love BP, dips and cable cross overs!

And the 2nd question:

When should I check my new RM's? after my 5RM negative period, before the SD or after the SD, before the new 15RM cycle?

Thank you in advance for your answers

It's really what you want to do with bench or db incline. I alternate bench and db incline press but still follow the program of 1 set of 15, 2 sets of 8, 3 sets of 5 etc. If you don't want to engage your tris while doing bench, incorporate a quarter press instead of full press. This way your tri's won't even come into play. Keep in mind you'll have to lift less weight doing this because it keeps all tension 100% on your pecs.

Dips: Two ways of doing them. a) leaning forward is going to engage your pecs along with your tri's and possibly some front delt. b) doing dips straight up is going to limit the amount that your pecs leaving most of the work on your tris though you can't nearly go down as far due.

Remember to have a certain amount of exercises that when you get to week 5&6 your not doing a stupid amount of volume like 70 sets per sessions x 3 times a week.