Finally I get to post!

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DanO

New Member
Well, I'm excited to finally be able to post. I've read just about anything and everything over the past couple months since I signed up with an account. I feel like I know half you guys on here just from reading everything.

I found this website from a link on the Madcow 5x5 website. I originally planned on starting a 5x5, but I found a link here and I have never looked back. I was previously trying to cut down but after finally shedding some weight I realized I wasn't going to have enough muscle to satisfy the look I was going for so I decided I would try a bulk.

I picked up Mark Rippetoe's Practical Programming and Basic Barbell Training as well as Alan Aragon's Girth Control after reading his sticky over on BB.com Those three books really opened me up to some new ideas, and of course HST was by far the most eye opening of them all for me. Dual factor programming and progressive loading are king!

I started my first HST cycle towards the end of Dec. 07. It began pretty easily with the 15s after about 9 days of SD. It most certainly was an ego check and I had to keep reminding myself the weight didn't matter but rather the results were what I was after.

I included

3x per week all cookie cutter HST style

Squats ATG
Flat Bench
Dead Lifts
Pendlay Rows
Overhead Press
Weighted Dips
Calf Raises
Weighted Incline Situps


I read the simplify and win article and it all really started coming together.

The first week went by like a joke and I had a few reservations about the workout but I had faith so I stuck with it.

Over the Holidays I finished up my 15rms with ease, and I probably could have pushed all reps on my 15 rep max day to 20 or beyond. I was eating like mad and the weight really started climbing the 1st week of 10's. Holiday time makes eating easy! I was probably putting back 3500 -4000 cals a day.

I started out on Nov. 24th at 175lbs and fairly lean, maybe 10-12%BF or (8-9mm as measured by Accumeasure calipers)

After deciding to start eating more I quickly put on 5lbs probably due to glycogen and water retention. As it turns out I was 181.2lbs the day I started my HST routine. I managed about 4 weeks of HST before I had to stop due to a septoplasty surgery that was coming up. I planned to SD during the down time and start it all over again. I rechecked all my RM's and everything went up dramatically

Body weight went form 181-190lbs in about 4 weeks. Sadly though after surgery and not being able to work out for about 2.5weeks I lost 6lbs.

I started another HST routine 4 weeks ago and I'm currently finished with my 15s and 10s and heading into the 5's. My body weight jumped from 184-193 this time around and I'm excited and determined to hit 200lbs before this cycle is over!

I've put on some fat which is what I expected but my strength and size has gone up quite a bit.

Measurements before and after non flexed

Arms 14.0/14.6 +.6"Measured while arm hanging at side
Thigh 21.8/23.8 +2" ( I've got really long legs!)
Calf 15.0/15.4 +.4"
Forearm 10.5/11.5 +1" Measured at center of forearm
Chest 41.5/43 + 1.5"
Waste 35.25/37 + 1.75" I put fat on my waste quickly even though my jeans size has stayed the same throughout other than getting tighter in the thigh area.

Before and after photos: Nov. 24- Feb 17 +18lbs

Dec. 1, 2007 181lbs
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Feb 14,2008 193lbs
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I just started taking Havoc by RPN and hopefully it will live up to it's hype. I'd like to go into the 5's with full intensity and finish up my havoc/5's cycle and head directly into a serious cut diet to shed some fat and drop back down to a much leaner 190 if I can in fact hit 200lbs in the next month.
 
Welcome aboard DanO. Great progress so far.

Aside from bodyweight what are you lifting/size goals? And why not start a log next cycle?

Not sure how tall you are but from your measurements it looks like you could do with packing a few pounds on your thighs. I'm a squat nut though!
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Great transformation, dedication, hard work and a good program. I'm sure your numbers will continue upwards as you stick with it. I did well for 7 cycles then went to a 5x5 for a break. Nice to know we have a link over there.
Your 4000 cals a day may soon become your maint. cals - wait 'till you have to do 5000 to bulk!
The Havoc has some usual hype in the ad I see, and some words I think they made up - and that's not new either, but the ProMagnon they claim to beat is crap itself, so that's no biggie. I've heard good about Halodrol, so if this is better, you may get some life from it. It appears to be methylated, so be sure to get some milk thistle at least or Anabolic Extreme's Liver pills. And I would be sure to take fish oil during cycle, tho you should be using it anyway. The reviews sound pretty good, and I've fairly trusted the guys on Anabolic Minds opinions. If you lie over there, they fry you a new butt. I have limited experience with PH's, but I know if you don't do PCT, there go your gains. If this stuff is better than superdrol with less sides than M1t it should be the shizzit. Add your thots on it in your log, k?
 
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(Lol @ Feb. 17 2008,07:37)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Welcome aboard DanO. Great progress so far.

Aside from bodyweight what are you lifting/size goals? And why not start a log next cycle?

Not sure how tall you are but from your measurements it looks like you could do with packing a few pounds on your thighs. I'm a squat nut though!
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I started out this time around just wanting to lean up and get back into decent shape probably as most do. I worked out on and off a lot in my early 20's but always got stuck and lost interest. If things continue to progress I'd like to get to a lean 200 and just stay there. I'm not looking to powerlift or do BB competitions so it's all just for fun.

I'm 6'2 with very long legs and a shorter torso so putting size on my thighs has always been pretty tough for me, but getting easier now that I'm getting more educated.

I totally agree with you about the size of my thighs and I started squatting religiously because of it and am forcing myself to love it.



Also, what would be considered an above average thigh measurement for someone my height? I need a goal to shoot fort.
 
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(quadancer @ Feb. 17 2008,08:31)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Great transformation, dedication, hard work and a good program. I'm sure your numbers will continue upwards as you stick with it. I did well for 7 cycles then went to a 5x5 for a break. Nice to know we have a link over there.
Your 4000 cals a day may soon become your maint. cals - wait 'till you have to do 5000 to bulk!
The Havoc has some usual hype in the ad I see, and some words I think they made up - and that's not new either, but the ProMagnon they claim to beat is crap itself, so that's no biggie. I've heard good about Halodrol, so if this is better, you may get some life from it. It appears to be methylated, so be sure to get some milk thistle at least or Anabolic Extreme's Liver pills. And I would be sure to take fish oil during cycle, tho you should be using it anyway. The reviews sound pretty good, and I've fairly trusted the guys on Anabolic Minds opinions. If you lie over there, they fry you a new butt. I have limited experience with PH's, but I know if you don't do PCT, there go your gains. If this stuff is better than superdrol with less sides than M1t it should be the shizzit. Add your thots on it in your log, k?</div>
I read through a bunch of logs on Havoc over the past couple months. Bloute over on BB.com has a pretty good right up on how to run a decent cycle. I've heard great things from just about any log i've seen so hopefully there is something to it.

I'm using cycle support and liver longer during cycle and a SERM for PCT. I'm also taking sessamin and cissus during cycle to help keep joints and fats in check. Seems most of the guys are keeping about 90% of the gains. It's a really dry compound so I guess it causes very minor bloating but beats up your joints a little. I also will not be drinking.


Thanks for the input guys! I'll start up a log with the havoc/5's.
 
How are these new legal non pro hormone supplements different than the ones that were true conversion pro hormones? Is it just a bunch of stuff that is put together in hopes of raising testosterone production as oppossed to converting to testosterone itself? I have not kept up to speed on what is being hyped these days.
 
The legal 'prohormones' nowadays are nothing but a ripoff. All steroids and steroid-like products are illegal now in the U.S. Anybody who claims differently is selling snake-oil. Its sad that people are still buying the junk and falling for the dishonest advertising.
 
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(Old and Grey @ Feb. 17 2008,15:25)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">How are these new legal non pro hormone supplements different than the ones that were true conversion pro hormones? Is it just a bunch of stuff that is put together in hopes of raising testosterone production as oppossed to converting to testosterone itself? I have not kept up to speed on what is being hyped these days.</div>
Of the stuff coming out these days, they invariably fall into two categories:

Some are ripoffs that don't do anything. Or they are questionable &quot;proprietary blends&quot; that might do something like increase libido or whatever, to make you think that they are actually working as the ads claim, but are by and large total bunk.


Some are actually steroids that aren't quite illegal to sell yet. Don't be fooled though, if the police catch you with this stuff, you'll still get in trouble. Just because you bought the superdrol off the internet doesn't mean it's legal to have hormone analogues.

In either case, you'd be better off money and health-wise to just get some testosterone. The new designer steroids that are marketed as either &quot;pro-steroids&quot; or &quot;pro-hormones&quot; always come with more side effects than actual testosterone. Superdrol, for instance, was effective enough (as it was based on Masteron) but was extremely harsh on lipid profiles - much more so than testosterone would be.
 
From everything I've read people are really getting a lot out of it. It's still legal so there is no law keeping people from buying it/owning it. Test on the other hand is a class 3 substance and will land you in jail Havoc will not. This is also a lot less androgenic.


2a,3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androstan-17b-ol


1100% as anabolic and 91% as androgenic as plain methyl-test


I'll let you guys know how it works out if at all.
 
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(DanO @ Feb. 17 2008,18:45)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Also, what would be considered an above average thigh measurement for someone my height? I need a goal to shoot for.</div>
Check out this muscular measurements calculator which is based on measurements obtained from drug-free bb champions.

Max Muscular Bodyweight Calculator

My guess is that your thighs would need to be at least 27&quot; @ 10% bf to look at all 'built' on your frame.
 
I'm trying to get a cop to hook me up with his test supplier. Hak!
The PH system is a cat-and-mouse game between the govt. and the suppliers. Havok (if it works) will be illegal soon enough. Then the company will change it's name and put it out with a slight change to the formula under a new name. And on we go again...
 
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(DanO @ Feb. 17 2008,16:34)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">From everything I've read people are really getting a lot out of it.  It's still legal so there is no law keeping people from buying it/owning it. Test on the other hand is a class 3 substance and will land you in jail Havoc will not.  This is also a lot less androgenic.
 

2a,3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androstan-17b-ol


1100% as anabolic and 91% as androgenic as plain methyl-test


I'll let you guys know how it works out if at all.</div>
Well, good luck. It sounds like typical supplement hype BS to me. It might do something, but nowhere near as good as the claims.
 
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(DanO @ Feb. 17 2008,03:25)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">3x per week all cookie cutter HST style

Squats ATG
Flat Bench
Dead Lifts
Pendlay Rows
Overhead Press
Weighted Dips
Calf Raises
Weighted Incline Situps


I read the simplify and win article and it all really started coming together.</div>
Dag, somebody who reads first before starting to post! Where's the fun in that... ?
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Looks like the traditional response: &quot;Check out the Simplify and Win thread&quot; is beginning to have an effect.

Your vanilla HST cycle looks good. If you can keep your eating up, you should have some nice gains.

Book 'em, DanO...
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DanO

Great improvements...sorry been outof touch a while...just moved over to New Zealand so I am still trying to get my feet, that is why I am only getting involved now.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Dag, somebody who reads first before starting to post! Where's the fun in that... ?</div>

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Good to see though, it gets a little boring pointing people out to that thread.
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Good going DanO, keep it up.
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(Fausto @ Feb. 27 2008,16:45)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">sorry been outof touch a while...just moved over to New Zealand so I am still trying to get my feet, that is why I am only getting involved now.</div>
Yup, I've noticed you hadn't posted in a while. I was wondering if you were making your move. Good luck with that!
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Havoc is an actual anabolic steroid. It's methylated to survive the first pass in the liver.
It will affect your cholesterol levels and might even cause a natural test production shutdown, but only if you take if for prolonged periods of time at relatively high dosages (40mg/day).
This steroid is mild but it will provide you with quick and lean gains.
From researching logs, best gains I've seen were 8-10 lean muscle lbs in 4 weeks on at least 3k diet with at least 1g/lb of bw, protein per day.
From personal experience, I gained around 5 lbs in two weeks and stayed the same BF%.
The gains are easy to maintain too, providing proper PCT.
Good luck
 
Italin: how much over maintenance were you eating at the time? Evidently that stuff is giving dry gains, or you'd have bloated?
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Ok, I admit I am nosey. What are you doing in NZ? </div>

Immigrating, O &amp; G, looking for a job now! To settle, then the family! Not nosey I'm ok with that!
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