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martin85

New Member
Hey guys, I've been reading posts on here for a little while and though I'd participate as I am about to embark on my first cycle of HST. I just came off about 6 or so months of the intermediate 5x5 program if you've heard of that and made some really great gains in strength, but not so much in size that's why I decided to give HST a shot. I've got a few questions though before I start:
1. If I am doing 1x15 for the first 2 week block, 2x10 for the next, and 3x5 for the last---wouldn't that last workout of week 6 be extremely hard because I am doing 3 sets of my 5 rep max? Or am I confused and it's not actually 3 sets of 5 rep max but you start with a lower weight on the first 2 sets?
2. How many exercises should you have total, and how many for each body part? Should you switch (ie Squats and Leg press each session)?

Sorry for the huge post, but I just really need clarification. Don't want to be doing this wrong.
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Thanks
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">1. If I am doing 1x15 for the first 2 week block, 2x10 for the next, and 3x5 for the last---wouldn't that last workout of week 6 be extremely hard because I am doing 3 sets of my 5 rep max? Or am I confused and it's not actually 3 sets of 5 rep max but you start with a lower weight on the first 2 sets?</div>

Yes, the 3 x 5RM would be really hard. Don't worry if you can't complete your sets. The number of sets are guidelines only.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">2. How many exercises should you have total, and how many for each body part? Should you switch (ie Squats and Leg press each session)?</div>

Once again, I can't give you a strict number. Concentrate the most on your back, legs, and chest. Okay, there's nearly your entire body... then specialize with arms, shoulders, and whatever else. Switching between Squats and LP is not a bad idea, but not needed... maybe just stick with whatever exercise you tend to favor.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Sorry for the huge post, but I just really need clarification</div>

If that was a long post, then I would be in trouble when reading through Joe or Fausto's threads.
 
1.  Depends on how you want to do it.  More than likely if you use your 1 set 5RM then by the time you get to week 6, provided you have been eating right, you will probably be able to do 3x5 no problem.  Your hypertrophy and corresponding strength increase will cover that. Edit: Yeah what Colby said... completing the sets arent important just get the 15 reps in however you can. If you cant do that without killing yourself dont worry about it. There is always the next workout.

2.  Somewhere between 4 and 14 depending on your endurance, time constraints, volume, etc. might work as a guideline.  I personally wouldnt switch anything with leg presses since they wouldnt be in my routine anyway.  An AB routine is fine and is commonly used for things like deadlift/squat and incline press/dips.  Some people switch rows and chinups too.

I dont mean to get irate but posting huge posts like this all the time is going to take up a ton of space... Bryan's server can only hold so much....      
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HA! forum space? such matters are the concern of puny keyboard-jockeys, not mighty iron-lifters such as ourselves!

martin85 welcome to the boards, you've asked some intelligent questions. In my first cycle on my 10RM day I failed after 7reps in the 2nd set (aiming for 2x10, 1min rest), and did 5x3(5 sets of 3 reps, 30-45sec rest) on my 5RM day, to avoid failure. But if you find you can do 3x5 then go for it.

Somewhere around 6-7 exes is about average, not including abs, common programs include deadlifts, squats (good overall massbuilders), incline bench press, chest dips, military press, chin ups, bent over rows. Also you can add isolations like bicep curls and tricep extension etc.
 
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(Peak_Power @ Dec. 04 2006,02:44)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">In my first cycle on my 10RM day I failed after 7reps in the 2nd set (aiming for 2x10, 1min rest), and did 5x3(5 sets of 3 reps, 30-45sec rest) on my 5RM day, to avoid failure. But if you find you can do 3x5 then go for it.</div>
Welcome Martin.
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Unlike Peak, I allow myself more rest time during heavy 5s and at the end of 10s.

So far I have managed to get 2 sets of 10 or 3 sets of 5 when at my RM loads but I think if I cut my rest down I wouldn't make it for any subsequent sets. For some exercises I superset to save time but not when doing squats or deads. During 5s I allow around 15 mins for these, inc. warmups.

I'm currently doing 25 reps total which is more than I have attempted up until now - 15 reps at top weight plus 10 reps with my current 15 RM to make up some work and keep that progressing too.

Avoiding failure for much of the cycle is key to allowing you to really push it on your RM w/os. You may be surprised how well you do.
 
Thanks for all the help everyone, I'm real excited to get started. Referring to this chart here:
http://my.bodybuilding.com/register.php?a=ver&amp;refsite=my

would I be fine doing just one exercise per body part? Because in that chart for some body parts they say to do 2 exercises like for legs they say do either squats or leg press and also do leg curls. Also what are the benefits of doing incline bench as opposed to flat? Thanks again.
 
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(liegelord @ Dec. 04 2006,00:31)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">If you need another exercise for legs in addition to full ROM squats, then deadlift.</div>
Adding deadlifts would be good if I was lagging, but if I'm not just squats are fine for legs?
 
You must keep in mind that deads are not simply a leg exercise. It is the arguably the best one exercise for you whole body. It is also a great way to measure overall strength levels, as opposed to a bench max.

A program without deads is like cereal without milk. Whats the point? (people who cant do them due to medical problems aside)
 
A guy at my gym who can squat 5 plates a side has recently decided to do deads again after he saw me doing them last week. After starting them up again he couldn't believe how much his back got sore afterwards and how much he needed to work on his grip strength.

So, if you can add in deads as an alternate exercise to squats (or a once-a-week exercise) that'd be good.

I favour doing squats and SLDLs during 15s and 10s and then Mon Squats, Wed Deads, Fri Squats during 5s as it just about gives my lowerback time to recover from the loading.
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">If that was a long post, then I would be in trouble when reading through Joe or Fausto's threads. </div>

I'll make it rather short this time
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1 - You can always elect to do 2 sets instead of three in your second week, but as the guys pointed out, you don't have to complete the reps on the second set by the book, alternatively you can just do an extra set with the reps you missed, what the guys call cluster training.

2 - Varies a lot and is rather personal...I do 5 p/workout at the moment...just the bare essentials
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some guys go overboard and do 12 - 15 (too much IMO).

P/bodypart - generally at least two (my opinion):

Legs - Squats/Deadlifts or stiff leg deads to improve lower back and Hams, some use claf raises too (many don't)

Chest - Dips/Incline bench some will also include flys

Back - Chinups/Rows (any kind cable/D/B or B/B)

Shoulders - Military press mostly but some use lateral and rear delt raises, others include upright rows.

Traps - most of us, include these in deads, each rep, just extend therep to include a shrug.

Biceps and Triceps - many of us feel these are not all that necessary when reverse grip Chins and Dips are in constant use with attached weight...for obvious reasons.
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Hope this helps
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2 -
 
<div>
(Fausto @ Dec. 04 2006,05:56)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"> <div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">If that was a long post, then I would be in trouble when reading through Joe or Fausto's threads. </div>

I'll make it rather short this time
laugh.gif


1 - You can always elect to do 2 sets instead of three in your second week, but as the guys pointed out, you don't have to complete the reps on the second set by the book, alternatively you can just do an extra set with the reps you missed, what the guys call cluster training.

2 - Varies a lot and is rather personal...I do 5 p/workout at the moment...just the bare essentials
wink.gif
some guys go overboard and do 12 - 15 (too much IMO).

P/bodypart - generally at least two (my opinion):

Legs - Squats/Deadlifts or stiff leg deads to improve lower back and Hams, some use claf raises too (many don't)

Chest - Dips/Incline bench some will also include flys

Back - Chinups/Rows (any kind cable/D/B or B/B)

Shoulders - Military press mostly but some use lateral and rear delt raises, others include upright rows.

Traps - most of us, include these in deads, each rep, just extend therep to include a shrug.

Biceps and Triceps - many of us feel these are not all that necessary when reverse grip Chins and Dips are in constant use with attached weight...for obvious reasons.
biggrin.gif


Hope this helps
wink.gif

2 -</div>
yea i did squats while on the 5x5 program and they worked great. so if i were to incorporate them into hst once a week in place of squats, say on wednesday, that would be fine? what about the rep range, isn't it pretty much useless doing high reps w/ these?
 
How does this look:
Legs- Squats, Deadlifts on Wednesdays &amp; leg curls
Chest- Flat bench, Incline bench on Wednesdays to hit shoulders more
Back- Bent over row--- i'll do chins on my second cycle of HST because i've never really done them, but I know they work really well. But for now, I'll stick w/ rows
Shoulders- Rear lateral raises
Biceps- Barbell curls
Traps- Dumbell shrugs
Triceps- Skullcrushers
Torso- Crunch machine

So i'll be doing 9 exercises each workout. For Wednesday I will substitute deadlifts for squats and incline bench for flat bench. Does this look solid? Feel free to add suggestions, thanks.
 
I would do standing presses for shoulders and wouldn't bother with RLRs until I could row with at least my bodyweight. Goal for presses should be at least 75% of bodyweight too.

For rows try doing Pendlay rows or at least some form of strict row where you keep your upper body about parallel with the floor (knees slightly bent).
 
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(Lol @ Dec. 04 2006,18:36)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I would do standing presses for shoulders and wouldn't bother with RLRs until I could row with at least my bodyweight. Goal for presses should be at least 75% of bodyweight too.

For rows try doing Pendlay rows or at least some form of strict row where you keep your upper body about parallel with the floor (knees slightly bent).</div>
OK, I looked into the Pendlay row and think I will be doing that instead of regular bent row. And for shoulders, if I elected to do military presses, they would be on the same day I do bench press. That wouldnt be too much would it?
 
One other thing. If you haven't already developed a decent amount of strength overall, I would drop the leg curls and arm work and just focus on the core stuff. And I mean really focusing on it.

Better to look at this way, why should I waste energy on small exercises that I could be using toward increasing the weight on the big stuff.

Also, if you are planning on doing chins at some point, it's better to just start doing them now. The only way to get strong enough to do chins is to just do them. Know it sounds like an impossible situation. So, the best thing to do if you have access to such a machine is to do assisted chins until you can do bodyweight.
 
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