How do we explain this?

[Joe.Muscle]

So I a friend of mine is a personal trainer at my gym. Well he is die hard Bodybuilder...and recently he has gained about 15 pounds in last 3 months. Now he is the type of guy he would never take steroids...I know this for sure.

He has basically started force feeding the hell out of his body tons and tons of calories a day all being very very clean. I mean this guys is by the book perfect with nutrition.

Here is the thing...I ask him how many sets he is doing b/c I feel like he is overtraining.

He tell me he is doing 20 sets per big bodypart 4 days a week. So for example his chest and back get 20 sets a piece on MOnday Wednesday. Friday and Sunday.

I told him this is like 80 some sets a week and is EXTREMELY overtraining. Now I know my stuff and I know for sure this is beyond overtraining even if he was on roids its severe overtraining, but he is making PHENOMENAL progress...so of course he is not listening to me? He thinks he can eat enought to not overtrain...however Overtraining is from CNS...not muscle?

I know I am right...but how the hell do I prove it...not that it matters...its just me doubting myself?

 

[mostlyallan]

If he's eating so much, whats his bf% like? He might be humungous but if its just fat then thats lame gains.

Plus, 20 sets of what weight? Is he going to failure everyday or just doing sissy weight?

 

[dkm1987]

Well in todays world there is a severe stigma attached to anabolic use so to say with utmost certainty he's not taking steroids may not be accurate, unless of course you are with hiim every waking moment. Now I'm not saying he is or isn't just be careful when taking peoples words for things especially when they are talking about illegal substances.

15 lbs in 3 months, that's doable for sure but is also very dependant on where he is in his training. I mean it's much easier for a 140 lber to add 15 lbs in 3 months than someone who is at or near their gentic limit, just ask Biz how long it takes him to a couple lbs of lean mass.

Is he overtraining? Maybe maybe not, without blood tests to check hormones levels and other items it very hard to say. Also remember as I mentioned above training adaptation is specific to the stimulus and if your friend has been using 50 sets for some time he has adapted to this and for him to now drop to 12-20 sets per week probably wouldn't do much good.

It's actually much more simple than you are making it out to be. As I mentioned in our emails use whatever volume you can handle, if this falls in line with your 24 rep idea then go for it, if you feel you can handle more without having to decrease to 1X week workouts do more.

Volume is only one variable in the myriad of controls we have, all the variables play and interplay with each other so to constantly second guess your volume use without looking at everything is to constantly chase your tail....


Remember the TV commercial

I do coke...I work long hours....to make more money....to buy more coke

So settle down, find the volume you plan on using and stick to it.

Secondly, take a poll, go to 10000 personal trainers and ask them your same question just be prepared for a diversity of answers that will further boggle your mind.

 

[Joe.Muscle]

Dan great points.

Yeah I definatly need to settle on a method I agree, however it fun and interesting to look at all variables.

why would anyone including myself want to do one more set than need be?

I dont live with the guys but I know him pretty damn good and I would be shocked if he is on juice, simply b/c I know were he stands on that...I guess though you never know.

To answer the other question he trains very intensly and weighs almost 200 pounds at say 8% bodyfat...abs were ripped and are still very ripped even with the weight gain.

the only thing he does is take creatine that I know of and eat like a horse.

I also agree with Dans statement about volume, its just when you look at the research bryan has as well as Dan closet full of articles you see...or appear to see that there is no need to do lots of volume?

Yeah you should increase volume if you can handle it and trust me as i stated above I use to work anyone into the ground in the weight room as far as total sets and intensity but I didnt get that much bigger?

I know he can become conditioned to EXTREMELY high levels of sets or work...but still there has to be a point were no matter what it simply overtraining regardless of the conditions or supplements.

This was my point this guy is die hard bodybuilder....love to train, trains at the highest levels of intensity and does it a lot and often.

His diet is perfect...but even under all those circumstances i just thought with that level of intensity and training you MUST be overtrainng.

Thought the answers would be different than what you guys said.

 

[imported_drpierredebs]

my experience is telling me that as long as you don´t go to exhaustion, you can do a lot. I am on the second week of everyday, full body, and never going to exhaustion and I feel fresh every day.

 

[Old and Grey]

20 sets per bodypart 4 times per week would be about 320 sets (Shoulders, Chest, Back and Legs =4 bodyparts * 20 sets * 4 days per week). And that excludes abs and arms. That means he must train close to 20 hours per week. That is nuts, even for a professional. Me thinks he sorely needs some outside interests and a bit of psychotherapy.