Mass and strength loss when cutting

Discussion in 'General Training' started by Heavy Duty dude, Jul 30, 2005.

  1. Heavy Duty dude

    Heavy Duty dude New Member

    Do you guys think that if someone doesn't lose strength when cutting he doesn't lose muscle?
  2. baby a

    baby a New Member

  3. Heavy Duty dude

    Heavy Duty dude New Member

    You're sure? If the CSA of a muscle decreases it should be weaker. And it's unlikely to get stronger while cutting. So..
  4. noobie

    noobie New Member

    I've been able to gain strength while im cutting right now haha. I guess its from the caffiene =)

  5. Heavy Duty dude

    Heavy Duty dude New Member

    It's not impossible but it's rare.

    And it's unlikely to happen on many lifts.
  6. Actarus

    Actarus New Member

    if you drop fat slowly it shouldn't be a problem to get stronger/leaner. It's what I do and it works.
  7. Heavy Duty dude

    Heavy Duty dude New Member

    But you're not gaining muscle right?
  8. noobie

    noobie New Member

    nope. no mass gain here.
  9. Heavy Duty dude

    Heavy Duty dude New Member

    Did you lose muscle?
  10. Aaron_F

    Aaron_F New Member

    going from this pure question, just because you dont lose strength doesnt mean you didnt lose muscle. Its likely you didnt lose much, but strength (at least multijoint) is more than CSA.

    In terms of the way the other posters are going, yes you can get leaner and get stronger. Its not as good as getting bigger, but you can do it. It also depends on starting strength levels, as coan couldnt drop 40lbs of fat and still lift the same loads.
  11. Heavy Duty dude

    Heavy Duty dude New Member

    Well I'm talking in terms of probability here. Ok it's possible to lose muscle and keep the same strength, but it's just that it's rather unlikely.
  12. Aaron_F

    Aaron_F New Member

    yes, but its also likely you lose strength (or neural output) from being in a caloric deficit. So it starts getting messy.
    Because we cannot measure muscle mass directly, its a bit of guesswork really (LBM off a skinfold or other BF analysis is not a measure of musclemass)
  13. Heavy Duty dude

    Heavy Duty dude New Member

    Which is why I was wondering about that. You KNOW if you lose strength or not, but you don't know if the volume you lose is water, muscle or whatever.. See what I mean..
  14. Rakki

    Rakki New Member

    I've increased Strength while cutting B4 [​IMG]

    jus kept workouts short, do cardio after (more Sprints than long distances) and work out for strenght/Hypertrohy. Also keep Protien intake up. Another trick is to not just cut off the calories drastically, but slowly ease up instead

    Actually recently I was reading an Article from the Thinkmuscle newsletter that advised something VERY Similar. It stated that when introducing Cardio actually increase the Calorie intake for 2 weeks then let it balance out [​IMG]

    not to Brag but I guessed it pretty dang close [​IMG] and it worked for me

  15. Aaron_F

    Aaron_F New Member

    what was the starting and finishing strength?
  16. Rakki

    Rakki New Member

    not enough [​IMG] Nothing Drastic like when Bulking
    a couple lbs [​IMG]
    but hey it was positive
  17. jvroig

    jvroig Super Moderator

    Hello :)

    Just MHO, there really is no need to worry so much about muscle loss, even if it is during cutting.

    Even if you were to go on a starvation cycle, i mean something like perhaps around 1000+ calories below your maintenance and little protein, you'd lose very few pounds of muscle over an extended period of time like 2 weeks or so. That is nowhere even near cutting. There is an old thread (or perhaps new, I forgot. I just read threads everywhere, so perhaps just search for it if you are interested) where they talked about a similar thing, and Dan sort of laid it to rest with his post. If I find it again and it still makes sense to put it here, I'll galdly post it (Dan's post I mean).

    As for gaining muscle during cutting. Well, I suppose that would be possible, but when your cutting, it really shouldn't be your goal. And even when you do get muscle gains, it wouldn't be as dramatic as the gains during a bulking cycle. And muscle loss wouldn't be too much anyway. As long as you don't SD and do not go crazy on your cutting diet (I mean, eating far less than you should), protein synthesis would still probably be balanced (or even slightly higher) with protein breakdown.

    Just my two cents :)
  18. BoSox

    BoSox New Member

  19. Heavy Duty dude

    Heavy Duty dude New Member

    lol.. what indeed?

    Cutting without losing muscle is probably the hardest thing in BBing..

    My question was not if it is possible to gain strength while cutting, I know it is possible. It is just unlikely.

    The question was.. realistically, if someone doesn't lose strength, how likely is it that he doesn't lose muscle. If someone for instance loses volume but no strength, we can speculate that he lost just water.

    Theoretically, if you lose muscle, you should lose some strength because of the CSA thing..
  20. jvroig

    jvroig Super Moderator

    hahaha, sorry :D

    I didn't mean absolutely zero muscle loss. I meant it wouldn't be that much anyway. If you don't go overboard with the calorie deficit, it's not likely you'll lose so much.

    As for the strength... well, I didn't do HIT, but dudes there said they often had strength increases without actually gaining size (muscles mass i suppose), so I guess that might make it possible to cut and lose a bit of muscle and yet retain strength as long as you workout and the workout gives the "strength but no mass" effect that HIT users claimed they had. I don't know really, I don't know anyone personally who used HIT.

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