Pyramids

R

ryolacap

Member
I was wondering about pyramids weight schemes. Pick about half your max and lift about 10, add 10% or so, do 8, repeat 6, repeat 4, repeat 2. You end up around 90% of your max for 2 reps, with 30 total reps. When you can do 3 on you last 'set' without failure, or when 2 weeks go by increase the weight a little. Wouldn't the volume of reps cause syncronized MU firing and the ending heavier tensions cause the muscle 'trauma'. Going way under failure allows me to do this with high frequency.

Volume...check
Heavy tension...check
Fatuige control...check
Frequency...check (I can do this everyday)

So what am I missing...is there a downside to pyramids.
 
If you keep the same weight for too long RBE is likely to catch up with you. If you keep testing your limits on the last set you might be frying your CNS.
It doesn't seem like a bad method but what's the upside hypertrophy-wise compared, for instance, with a vanilla HST routine?
 
I'm sure you would make some progress using this type of plan. However I suspect gains would be slower than with HST for a number of reasons. You are not really using progressive load as RBE will probably set in long before you reach the end of the 2nd week (Brian states it can occur within 24hrs, in some situations).

Also, as Brian states, there is some evidence that any sets other than your "working set" just burn calories. Using your pyramid method would mean your working set @ 90% is only 2 or 3 reps, therfore the TUT will be quite low for the critical working set that actually stimulates growth.

I would expect you would see some gains, but I think it conflicts with some of the key HST principles.
 
All exercise is good. However, all exercise is not efficient. I have found that usually one working set, or two if a large muscle, is usually all I need for maximum hypertrophy. Anything more is a waste of energy (calories), at least for me. Too many factors such as age, test levels, level of conditioning, recoverability, diet, etc. enter into the process to make too general a statement.
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Old and Grey,
Can you post your current routine with details?
 
I have used the ascending pyramid scheme before and it does work as long as you avoid hitting failure on the early sets. As noted it is not the most efficient means though. You really do not need more than one or two working sets. If you push the early sets too hard they will rob you of the energy needed for the heavy set that will give you the most effect.

A better pyramid IMO is a descending pyramid. A few warm up sets before a single heavy working set followed by a couple sets of decreased weight with higher reps. So one heavy working set after warmup. Followed by one pumping set to near failure in a mid range. The last set would be a high rep set avoiding failure completely to flush the muscle with blood.

Example:

1 X10 - Light weight to warm up the muscle and joints
1 X 5 - Moderate weight to start acclimation
1 X 2 - 80 - 90 % of target weight for acclimation
1 X 5 - Working set to failure
1 X 10 - Pumping set to near failure
1 X 15 - Flushing set avoiding failure, use light weight
 
dgm, this is my current 8 day routine (one set of each):

Exercise
Workout #1 12 reps
DB Incline Bench Press
Dips
Flat Bench Flyes
Dips
Workout #2 12 reps
BB Military Press
Lateral Raises
DB Shrugs
Seated French Press
Workout #3 12 reps
Pull Ups
Chin Ups
Seated Rows
Lateral Grip Lat Pull Downs
Concentration Curls
Workout #4 12 reps
Box Squats
Leg Press
Leg Extensions (15 Reps)
Workout #5 8 repsIncline Bench Press
Dips
Flat Bench Flyes
Dips
Workout #6 8 reps
Smith Military Press
Lateral Raises
Shrug Bar Shrugs
Close Grip Bench Press
Workout #7 8 reps
Pull Ups
Chin Ups
Seated Rows
Lateral Grip Lat Pull Downs
Hammer Curls
Workout #8 8 reps
Box Squats
Leg Press
Leg Extensions (15 Reps)



For the past year, I have been doing my cycles in 4 to 6 week stretches with increasing weights each week. Toward the end, I employ max stim to hit my rep targets so I can be using something like my 4 or 5 rep max but get 8 reps. I then always take 14 days off.

This is not your typical HST type workout but it works great for me at the moment. Prior to this, I used a more conventional HST routine of 2 weeks of 15's, 2 weeks of 10's, etc. and incorporated a lot of giant sets and metabolic decending pyramid sets. Those weekly workouts consisted of about 60-70 total sets versus 28-32 sets currently (sometimes I may do 2 days worth of workouts in one day by splitting between an AM/PM scheme). Lower volume is what my body needs currently. That may change again but I rather doubt it. I can't do the 1 1/2 hour workouts that I could when I was 40.

By sticking between 8 and 12 reps I feel I am staying in the hypertrophic zone, still getting sufficient metabolic work and staying away from heavier weights which can raise havoc with my joints. Again, this is not a strength inducing program so I wouldn't recommend for power or olympic style lifters.

Hope this helps!  
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Personally, I don't belive in the concept of the 'set' and there being one working set, which builds muscle.  The concept of 'sets' is completly abstract, and really is a form of fatigue contol between reps (after all a set is simply a long pause between reps).  I think more in terms of total volume of reps, independent of sets (kinda like Max-Stim).  When I pyramid each weight range is considered part of the total volume.  It really eliminates overuse injuries and joint strain while working in a good moderate volume range, still allowing me to end with 90% of my max for at least three but up to 4-5 reps.  It is the only form of rep volume that has not left my bones aching.  It all ends up being determined by the balance of what you are capable of and what your body and mind can take.
 
Not to mention even HST concentrated more on progression than anything else. When you really look at the program you will realize a huge % of the time you are way below what would typicaly be a hypertrophy weight range of your 1 rep max (70-85%) and only doing 1 set, that can be as low as 5 reps. I am now actually thinking of doing a volume increasing workout by starting at 1 set and each consecutive workout adding a step of the pyramid. That would give you a increase in resistence and volume over time.

workout 1: 1 set 10 reps 60%RM
workout 2: 2 set 10-8 reps 60%-70%RM
workout 3: 3 set 10-8-6 reps 60%70-80%RM
workout 4: 4 set 10-8-6-4 reps 60%-70-80-90%RM
 
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