Question on missing reps

B

brent217

New Member
I am using an HST program I built for my forearms following the FAQ.  I am now on my second 8 week cycle.  This past week I just completed the 15 reps stage of the second cycle, and will be moving to a lower weight with 10 reps this week (then building back up and increasing past the 15s max).

On the 15s, I am doing three sets of 15 reps.  Yes, I know the FAQ says you only need 1 or 2 sets, but this is for wrists, a small muscle, and I have not noticed yet any overtraining effects.  

Anyways, on the second last day, I missed the last rep of the last set.  On the last day, I Increased the weight again by another 2.5 pounds and I did 15/14/14, missing the last rep on the last two sets.  

So the question is, when I complete this cycle and start over again, do I:

a - add another 2.5 pounds to every workout as I did last time.

b - do the same weights over again during the 15s (thus increasing the spread between the 15s and the 10s by 7.5 pounds instead of my current 5 pounds difference) and increase the 10s and 5s

c - similar to a, but add a lesser amount of weight, say 1.5 pounds (I have fractional plates available)

d - something else that I missed
 
Just add around 5% to you top loads for each RM next time around. Missing a rep on subsequent sets is nothing to worry about. It's unlikely you would be able to do multiple sets with a true RM for any rep range without a lot of rest between sets.

What exercises are you doing for forearms? Are you trying to increase grip strength or just grow the forearm muscles?
 
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(Lol @ Jun. 02 2008,6:05)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">What exercises are you doing for forearms? Are you trying to increase grip strength or just grow the forearm muscles?</div>
I bought a formulator (no longer available) and captain of crush grippers and bands.  I am trying to increase wrist and grip strength.  For grip strength, for 15s, I use the trainer, for 10s, I use the number 1, and for 5s I use the 1.5.  I can't close the 2 yet, and likely won't be able to for some time.  For extensors, I use the green band for 15s, the yellow band for 10s and the blue band for 5s.  I realize this is not optimal, but I see no other easy way of incrementing the strength levels.
 
HST is used for hypertrophy.  If you want to increase grip STRENGTH, I suggest you go to www.gripboard.com  or follow the little workout program provided in your COC package.  

If you want to increase forearm size, I think you would be better off doing things like wrist curls while on a hst program.  Gripper work has greatly increased my grip, but did nothing for my forearm size.
 
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(stevejones @ Jun. 02 2008,1:22)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">HST is used for hypertrophy.  If you want to increase grip STRENGTH, I suggest you go to www.gripboard.com  or follow the little workout program provided in your COC package.  

If you want to increase forearm size, I think you would be better off doing things like wrist curls while on a hst program.  Gripper work has greatly increased my grip, but did nothing for my forearm size.</div>
I want both.  Yes, I am greedy that way  
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I have been there and read the articles, and I have bought the grip strength books.  To summarize them all - &quot;Here are a lot of different exercizes you can do for grip training.  We recomend lots of variation to keep your grip training from getting stale, as the muscles involved are very tiny, and thus VERY slow to improve&quot;

Hmm, I am able to work through boredom, so I don't really need 100 variants of the same exercises.  I am interested in what can increase the size of the tiny muscles, so I have more room for strength in those muscles.  HST seems to have a more logical science background than periodization, so that is what I am trying to adapt to my training.

And yes, I am doing wrist curls for HST, that is where I am running into the rep issues. In lie of any other responses, I will follow LOL's suggstion to keep increasing the weight, and I will start cutting back sets, until I reach the HST FAQ baseline, and see what happens.
 
Brent, I think that its unnecesary to do specific forearm/grip exercises. Deadlifts tax grip enough as well as bent rows. I'm a firm believer in Simplify and Win
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I think that its possible to get all the desirered # of reps provided that you rest long enough. 3-4 mins.
 
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(wannagrow @ Jun. 02 2008,8:42)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Brent, I think that its unnecesary to do specific forearm/grip exercises. Deadlifts tax grip enough as well as bent rows. I'm a firm believer in Simplify and Win  
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I like S&amp;W too but if you want really good grip you have to train it along with your other work. So it all depends on your goals.

Deadlifts are, of course, great forearm builders; powerful isometric contractions are required to stabilise the wrist and elbow joints plus there's all the necessary grip work. Do all your warmup sets with regular grip rather than reverse grip too. Save reverse grip for work sets where you just can't keep hold of the bar with a regular grip for a whole rep.

Like Steve pointed out, the grip strength muscles do not make up much of your forearm mass - they will enlarge through training but you won't really notice the size increase. The larger forearm muscles are involved in wrist and elbow flexion and need to be trained with exercises that use those joints: rows and chins work them hard as wannagrow said; use different grips too.

Forearm curls and reverse curls are often sited as good forearm exercises but I actually think the regular compounds and a few isos like bb curls or hammer curls do just as much for forearms, if not more.

When you look at the forearms of roiders they are always thick and muscular and yet many of them don't do any direct forearm work. Guess it must be all those rows, chins, curls and deads then.
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(Lol @ Jun. 02 2008,6:09)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">When you look at the forearms of roiders they are always thick and muscular and yet many of them don't do any direct forearm work. Guess it must be all those rows, chins, curls and deads then.  
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They'd get thick and muscular forearms from just scratching their backs.
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What I have been doing to improve my grip strength is static holds. After my set of deads I will strip the weight down usually 50% and attempt to hold it for 30 seconds or failure, whichever comes first. I do this three times. So far it has helped a lot. Just make sure you do it in a power rack or a squat rack so the weight doesnt have far to travel when you lose your grip.
 
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(wannagrow @ Jun. 02 2008,3:42)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Brent, I think that its unnecesary to do specific forearm/grip exercises. Deadlifts tax grip enough as well as bent rows. I'm a firm believer in Simplify and Win  
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I think that its possible to get all the desirered # of reps provided that you rest long enough. 3-4 mins.</div>
This is getting a bit off topic, but at the moment I don't do any exercises other than grip and forearms.  I hurt my back very badly (now chonic), and while I am doing physio I have been banned from all exercies that involve the lower back.

Since I have this NEED to improve myself, I decided that I could do wrists and forearms without putting any pressure on my back.  I followed the basic templates suggested in the CoC minibook until I stopped advancing.  Then I started reading.  Eventually I found my way here, read the FAQ, designed my own program, and am on my second cycle.

I am happy enough with the progress I have made so far, although it will be years at this rate before I can close the number 3.  

Anyway, to continue the response, I have been resting a long time between sets.  When I start a 2 week cycle my rest is 1 to 2 minutes, long enough to grab a drink of water.  By the last workout of a cycle, my rest between sets is 6 to 7 minutes, which, according to the books I have read, should allow close to 99% of my strength to have returned.  But I am still missing the rep.  Not sure why.  I just seem to run out of gas, and I can't really cheat it up cause the weight is being held stable across my legs, so I either get it or I don't.

And to forestall the other questions/comments, yes I want to return to a full body workout asap.  Not going to happen soon though, maybe another couple of months.  In the meantime, this is where I am.
 
Sorry to hear about your lower back injury. What does &quot;exercises that involve the lower back&quot; mean? The lower back is a important stabilizer muscle for most of the exercises but is not directly involved in many others. What I mean is, can't you do bench press, chin-ups, supported rows, leg extensions, biceps curls, triceps extensions... ? If you are able to do (some of) those at least you are preparing yourself for when the lower back heals.
 
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(electric @ Jun. 03 2008,8:35)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Sorry to hear about your lower back injury. What does &quot;exercises that involve the lower back&quot; mean? The lower back is a important stabilizer muscle for most of the exercises but is not directly involved in many others. What I mean is, can't you do bench press, chin-ups, supported rows, leg extensions, biceps curls, triceps extensions... ? If you are able to do (some of) those at least you are preparing yourself for when the lower back heals.</div>
The problem is my lower back is surrounded by and covered with scar tissue, so I cannot do exercises that involve contracting the lower back muscles, as I have no way to lengthen them afterwards, and they just stay contracted for days afterwards, and the constant pressure stops me from sleeping or resting, and drives me batty.

You would be suprised how many exercises use the lower back to stabilize and support your body.  Pretty much everything I think.  I have not yet figured out a way to tense and contract my upper arm muscles without tensing my core for stability (when I am holding more than 50ish punds in my hands), when I am trying to do biceps or triceps.  I have tried doing bench press with my feet up on the bench to take the pressure off my back, and doing supported rows, but I find light weight does nothing, and when I increase the weight I tend to start the Valsalva manoeuver, which makes my back contract.

Last week on tuesday I got frustrated and went to the gym anyways.  I was unable to sleep on tues and wed nights, and my physiotherapists were not very sympathetic.  I am learning the hard way to let my body heal the way it needs to.  

I am trying to convince myself that &quot;muscle memory&quot; is true, and that once I am healed I should be able to push myself hard again for total body workouts and get back to where I was.

I will attempt to stick with my plan for now, and just do wrists and hands (forearms).  Today is day 1 of my 10s, so should be a nice fast workout, and relatively light compared to my last 15s, so a good change  
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