Transitioning from Madcow 5x5

M

ManosHandsOfFate

New Member
I've been progressing nicely using a combination of Madcow's 5x5 linear & dual factor routines. Due to a lower back injury though, I've been looking to transition to another type of workout, with HST being the #1 choice.

I'm sure that many are familiar with 5x5, as it really stresses using compound movements with very little isolation work - it's even suggested that one could choose not to do any isolation work and you will still get pretty much the same results. Well, that's what I did, and again, I had some pretty damned good results.

My question is, can I use HST in the same way, focusing on compound movements? Taking what I've learned from 5x5, I was thinking something along the lines of:

DB flat press
DB incline press
Leg press
Leg curl
Lat pulldown
Seated row
Abs

A few notes - since I've been on 5x5 for so long, I want to steer clear of the exercises that I'm doing on that program and incorporate some new ones. It will give my body some time to heal (lower back), and taking time of a certain exercise can only help gains in the future when I decide to jump back to it. Hence, the DB movements (haven't used DB's in about a year!), the leg press (instead of the squat), and leg curl. Not only that, but I'm also getting some much needed stabilizer work in there we well.

Thoughts? Thanks for any responses.
 
Nothing wrong with using dumbells.

Why are you doing leg curls and extensions instead of squats and deads?

That's all I see that I would do differently from what you've posted.

Squat
Dead
Bench
Row
Pulldown (I prefer pullups but downs are fine)
Ab work.

Should do fine for an HST program.
 
<div>
(vagrant @ Feb. 07 2007,13:17)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Nothing wrong with using dumbells.

Why are you doing leg curls and extensions instead of squats and deads?

That's all I see that I would do differently from what you've posted.

Squat
Dead
Bench
Row
Pulldown (I prefer pullups but downs are fine)
Ab work.

Should do fine for an HST program.</div>
As my original post stated, I've suffered a lower back injury, so I want to avoid placing and unnecesary stress on my lower back for a few months. Not only that, but I've always been a big believer is switching up exercises every so often, and I HAVE been squatting a deadlifting pretty much for 1+ years without switching out
smile.gif
 
Switching up exercises doesn't really help growth. Increasing load used over time is what stimulates growth. However, switching now and then can be good for a mental break. Still, I wouldn't drop both squats and deads completely...
 
I personally wouldn't give them up. However, it's your back and you know what it can handle and what it can't.

Extensions and curls will work. They aren't the best, but are better than time in traction from not listening to your body.
 
As a guy with 32+ years of low back trouble, I can appreciate what you're trying to do. It may well be good to try a change if the deads are killing it; I sort of doubt that the squats are as bad, depending on form. Suggestions:
Switch to sumo deads. The back is more upright and it's working for me these last 3 workouts.

When squatting, tilt the pelvis backward if you have that pelvic tilt and distended belly from the spinal curve...and tighten the crap out of everything in your torso throughout the movement. Don't exhale until the full rep is done, or near the top.

If doing leg presses, try to find a position the puts the spine in as straight a line as possible, even if you have to lay the seat way back. Leg presses hurt the lower back for some people as bad as anything.

Leg extensions really mostly just hit the quads above the knees, but that's a good thing if you don't have teardrops.

If you switch to machines or not, don't quit doing leg raises, crunches for the abs, especially if you have pelvic tilt. I'm presently researching a bit on this and other exersizes for the back. I'd like to buy Fokko Houing's book, but can't afford it just now.
 
<div>
(quadancer @ Feb. 07 2007,20:00)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">As a guy with 32+ years of low back trouble, I can appreciate what you're trying to do. It may well be good to try a change if the deads are killing it; I sort of doubt that the squats are as bad, depending on form. Suggestions:
Switch to sumo deads. The back is more upright and it's working for me these last 3 workouts.

When squatting, tilt the pelvis backward if you have that pelvic tilt and distended belly from the spinal curve...and tighten the crap out of everything in your torso throughout the movement. Don't exhale until the full rep is done, or near the top.

If doing leg presses, try to find a position the puts the spine in as straight a line as possible, even if you have to lay the seat way back. Leg presses hurt the lower back for some people as bad as anything.

Leg extensions really mostly just hit the quads above the knees, but that's a good thing if you don't have teardrops.

If you switch to machines or not, don't quit doing leg raises, crunches for the abs, especially if you have pelvic tilt. I'm presently researching a bit on this and other exersizes for the back. I'd like to buy Fokko Houing's book, but can't afford it just now.</div>
Thanks for the comments - another reason for switching up exercises is, as someone else pointed out, for a mental break. Squatting 3x's a week for over a year DOES get kinda boring after a while, and the intensity decreases just a bit whether we want to admit it or not. The switching of exercises is temporary - 6 weeks at the most, before I got back to them for a long period of time.

I originally suffered my two herniated disks (L4&amp;5) squatting on the Smith machine in 2001. Around that time, I also learned that the Smith machine is &quot;less than ideal&quot; for doing squats on because it takes you out of your natural range of motion. I aggravated the injury AGAIN last week doing light BB squats. I think that the problem was that, for my lighter sets, I was placing the bar higher on my traps/shoulders, when I normally place it up my upper back (powerlifting-type squat) for my heavier sets (better for my back, believe it or not). I'm shown my form to a few different personal trainers at different time, each one saying that my form is spot on.

Thanks again!
 
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