Sorry, another "Check my routine"

R

r_graz

New Member
Hello to all, my first post here.  I'm about to start my first HST cycle (as I'm sure the subject line implied  
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).  Been lifting since Feb '06, and have spent the last 4 months on the single factor 5x5.  Made good strength gains and now I want to do a hypertrophy oriented program for a while.  As of right now my 5RMs are about (I'm 5'7", 175 lbs):

ATG Squat - 270x5
Flat bench - 210x5
Pendlay row - 170x5
Overhead press - 135x5
Deadlift - 305x5

Trying to set up my first HST cycle, spending next week working out 15 and 10RM's, following week SD, then rock 'n roll.  Here's the exercises I've worked out out so far:

Squat
Bench Press
SLDL/Deadlift
Pendlay Rows
Overhead Press
BB Curls
Lying Tricep Extentions
Dips
Lat Pulldown/Pullups

I'd do the SLDL Monday/Friday, and conventional deads on Wednesday.  Lat pulldown would be for the rep ranges where I can't get enough pullups, then pullups at least for the 5's.  My legs are doing pretty well after 4 months of 3x per week squatting, added mass to my chest and back, but I have lagging arms and would like to bring them up a bit.

All advice and criticisms appreciated.
 
Your routine looks good, personally I would drop the barbell curls and do supinated chin-ups/pulldowns instead, these work my biceps better than curls.  After underhand chins, I can't curl without overstraining my biceps and brachialis.  It is possible your arms are lagging due to overtraining.  Dips should hit your triceps really well, but some people need iso work for triceps, so depending on how you feel, you may or may not want to keep the lying triceps extensions.
 
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(scientific muscle @ Oct. 21 2006,12:48)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Your routine looks good, personally I would drop the barbell curls and do supinated chin-ups/pulldowns instead, these work my biceps better than curls.  After underhand chins, I can't curl without overstraining my biceps and brachialis.  It is possible your arms are lagging due to overtraining.  Dips should hit your triceps really well, but some people need iso work for triceps, so depending on how you feel, you may or may not want to keep the lying triceps extensions.</div>
Thanks for the reply.  Not sure about the overtraining, I continued making strength gains throughout my 16 weeks on the 5x5 and decent size gains overall, just not on my arms.  Of course the 5x5 was mostly big compounds and little direct arm work, so arms definitely weren't a focus.

As far as the supinated chins/pulldowns, do those in addition to the wide grip pullups/pulldowns?
 
My opinion is don't bother with wide-grip pulldowns, it puts the lats at a mechanical disadvantage. Wide-grip are good at developing the middle of the back though. Some guys alternate them. I like close-grip underhand as a larger load can be used which really hits the lats and biceps hard.
 
I like the routine!!!

About the arms Isos, Sci Musc has good advice. If you have a hard time letting go of bi and tri stuff, then just do one set of them, last thing, and only if you have the energy left for them.
 
Oh, the other good thing about your routine is that after the 5s, you can split it up into the A/B routine you did in 5x5 and do a few weeks of that, gaining as much strength, and probably a little more size, before you SD and start your next HST cycle.
 
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(etothepii @ Oct. 22 2006,07:53)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I like the routine!!!

About the arms Isos, Sci Musc has good advice. If you have a hard time letting go of bi and tri stuff, then just do one set of them, last thing, and only if you have the energy left for them.</div>
Sounds good, they would have probably been last thing in the routine anyway. I definitely like to do all the really taxing (i.e. compound) stuff first.

Thanks!
 
OK, I've used Monday and today to test my 15 and 10 RM's.  My guesses were mostly pretty close to the mark, based my estimates on my 5RM's, which I mostly knew.

What I discovered is that 9 exercises seems like a lot to squeeze in to each workout.  And I've only been doing 1 set of each for testing my maxes.  Today the 10 RM's took me almost 90 minutes to get through (with warmup sets), which seems awfully long, and that's without even doing any ab work.

I'm thinking I'll skip the conventional deads for the 15's, and just stick to RDL's.  For 10's and 5's I might alternate deads with squats.  For 15's that would leave me with:

Squat

Bench Press
Pendlay Rows

Overhead Press
RDL

Dips
Lat Pulldown

Lying Tricep Extensions
BB Curls

I'm hoping pairing opposing muscle groups will help me get through the workout a little faster.  Unless someone sees any ridiculous overlap in that routine that could be trimmed down...(?)
 
That sounds like a good plan. I reckon you should be able to finish that for 10s in around 45 mins. Certainly under an hour which is fine.
 
One suggestion.

Something to work toward in the future is trying to make sure you can row as much as you bench. Or vise versa.

In this case it looks like your chest (push) is stronger than your back ( pull) which could cause problems down the road.

Good luck
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(Joe.Muscle @ Nov. 13 2006,07:50)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">One suggestion.

Something to work toward in the future is trying to make sure you can row as much as you bench. Or vise versa.

In this case it looks like your chest (push) is stronger than your back ( pull) which could cause problems down the road.

Good luck
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Yes, that makes a lot of sense. I guess the hard part for me is how to get my row weight to progress faster. With all my lifts being as low as they are, I don't really want to stop working my chest to allow my back to catch up.
 
Most folks are slightly stronger benching than rowing due to a greater mechanical advantage in benching. Rowing requires that your lower back not give out too. I can't remember the approx ratio of bench to rows though.
 
Well, I'm through the 10's of this routine.  What I'm finding is it's just too many exercises (esp. the compounds) for me to be doing in a single workout.  Here's what I've been doing:

Mon and Fri:
Squat
Bench Press
Pendlay Rows
Overhead Press
Romanian Deadlift
Dips
Lat Pulldown/Pullups
Lying Tricep Extentions
BB Curls

Wed:
Front Squat
Conventional Deadlift
Bench Press
Pendlay Rows
Overhead Press
Dips
Lat Pulldown/Pullups
Lying Tricep Extentions
Bicep Curls

I'm thinking about changing to an alternating A and B workout, and adding incline bench.  It would look something like this:

Workout A
Squat
Romanian Deadlift
Flat Bench
Overhead Press
Pendlay Rows
Lying Tricep Extentions

Workout b
Front Squat
Conventional Deadlift
Incline Bench
Dips
Pulldown/Pullups
BB Curls

That split looks OK to me (plus I think it would give me room to add some direct ab work at the end), but any feedback from the experienced HST people would be greatly appreciated.
 
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