Advice Please

B

billy

New Member
Hey guys,

I realise this forum is absolutely huge and you strongly encourage to search the forums before asking questions . Although I have searched a fair bit yet cant find the information I'm after( or ive simply missed it) Ill start by telling you my situation: I'm a student, 100% novice, looking to get a bit of bulk. I'm limited by a few factors, being a student im disturbingly poor leading to inability to obtain a gym membership and I only can afford one can of protien powder with no signs of affording any more. Dont worry, im not asking for a routine with no weights; I do own a bench(with inbuilt dipstation) barbells, the long bar, sufficient weights(for now).
After extensive browsing of various workouts etc, in search of the best workout routine, I've decided HST seems to be the smartest idea. Basically I'd like to be explained the excercises in the suggested HST routine; I'm not sure what I can and cannot do considering my limitations in gym aparatus(I know i dont have a place to do chinups which was previosuly stated, in a different thread, to be the "lion" or something of the main compound excercises) Also is it possible to get sufficient protien intake while rationing my protein powder to one shake a day, it wil eventually run out too, could tuna and steak be enough? Also in the explanation from the site of the routine, I'm not sure if when establishing my maximum RM's I should do it prior to each 2 week cycle. i.e when I eventually get up to the 10s week will I be using a 10RM i established prior to the 15s 2 week cycle or will i find out what my 10RM just prior to the actual 10 set cycle. Instinctively I think it would be just prior to it, in order to make load progression, but it never hurts to be too sure right?. umm also I've got some creatine; best time to take it after or before workout? Is protien imporant on off days? would cardio before breakfast on workout and nonworkout days be detrimental to creating muscle mass? and yeh just basically any suggestion for acceptable excercises i can perform despite my limitations , i forgot to mention my bench has that the leg thing on it. also is squatting without one of those racks and partner dangerous? Oh and also is it posisble to measure body fat without calipers?
Sorry for the unstructured and blaberring post aswell as the lack of correct terminology, you have to remember im a noob at this though:P Any positive input would be greatly appreciated, thanks.
 
Hi Billy,

It actually sounds like you have everything to achieve your goals. My workouts usually consist of only Barbell exercises and have thus far yielded excellent results. If you are concerned about safety with squatting, perhaps substitute front squats for normal back squats.

I would say that supplements are optional - they can enhance results (particularly creatine) but in my humble opinion are not a requirement for progress. Tuna and steak would be fine - perhaps add some low-fat milk if you need it.

In so far as determining your maximums are concerned, they should be done before you even begin your first workout. In other words, find out your max for 15, 10 and 5 reps, then take a week off (SD.)

You'll find, as you correctly assume, that once you reach your maximums that the weight is no longer as taxing as it was before. After the HST cycle is over, you can then re-find your maximums, or do as many people do: Simply increase the weights by 5-10%

Cardio can and should be performed on non-weight training days. As long as it's not performed for too long or perhaps without too much intensity, it shouldn't interfere with your gains. I personally find it helps with recovery from workouts, particularly the 5's.

Good luck,

Daniel
 
Hey Daniel

Thanks for your hastey reply. Thats good news. I'm not sure what you mean about the back squat but i wont bother you by pusing on an explanation I'm sure google can offer speedy answers. So in the essence this means by the end of the 6 week cycle I wont be lifting anything heavier then what was possible at the start of the cycle? Then this all must be based on some principal that gains can be made as long as the load increases progressively but doesnt need to be neccesarily at the uppermost of your strength? Like im not expecting a miracle here but im kinda of a bit paranoid in that by the time I reach the 5's It will feel a bit to easy and not really like a productive workout, due to strength progessions made in previous week, then again, im not the expert, just seems a bit counter intuitive. Anyway, so I can still make substanstial gains without chinups? and how many cans of tuna/how much steak would you reccomend a day?
 
Oh, and one more thing: quoting you " In other words, find out your max for 15, 10 and 5 reps, then take a week off (SD.)" So your saying I take a week in finding my Maxes, then take a week of (SD)? I thought the Sd was the week after you finish the 5's
 
It is done at the end of week 8 in your cycle, but it's also done after finding your max. I think in doing this you decondition your body to the max weights and then you are able to grow on lighter (submaximal) weights.
 
so i literally spend a week finding my max for 15,10 and 5 RM. Then I take a week off? I reaad somewher else some people had different advice for complete novices i.e me. any thoughts? and what are the usual gains for begginers anyway, i know it varies alot but on average? in kilos too plz:P
 
Billy

SD works best to start from ground zero!

In your case it would not be too detrimental to start off but rather do things by the book.

Info on how to do exercises is here:

Exercise & Muscle directory

We are not going to tell you what gains you can get as that varies from person to person, good gains would come if you eat over maintenance by 500 - 100 calories.

Start off with a simple program like:

Squats/Deadlifts/Bench/Dips/Rows (as you don't have a chinning bar) and Military presses.

Else follow the Vanilla program as per main page.

Do 1 x 15/2 x 10 and 3 x 5 and negatives, SD after 8 weeks, and get the feel a complete cycle before attempting to cahnge anything.
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Cheers
 
<div>
(billy @ Jul. 15 2006,07:39)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Hey Daniel

Thanks for your hastey reply. Thats good news. I'm not sure what you mean about the back squat but i wont bother you by pusing on an explanation I'm sure google can offer speedy answers. So in the essence this means by the end of the 6 week cycle I wont be lifting anything heavier then what was possible at the start of the cycle? Then this all must be based on some principal that gains can be made as long as the load increases progressively but doesnt need to be neccesarily at the uppermost of your strength? Like im not expecting a miracle here but im kinda of a bit paranoid in that by the time I reach the 5's It will feel a bit to easy and not really like a productive workout, due to strength progessions made in previous week, then again, im not the expert, just seems a bit counter intuitive. Anyway, so I can still make substanstial gains without chinups? and how many cans of tuna/how much steak would you reccomend a day?</div>
Happy to help, Billy.

By back squat I mean the normal &quot;squat&quot; - I used the term to distinguish it from the front squat. As you said you didn't have a rack, I'd think that doing a regular squat is going to a pretty interesting experience
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(How would you get the bar on your shoulders?)

You're right on the mark by stating that you won't be lifting anything heaiver at the end of 6 weeks than you did in the beginning.

Now I know what you're thinking - you're thinking this is a pointless exercise (no pun intended) - but I'd suggest trying it. What you'll find (as I did) is that once you get to the 5's and you reach your maximum that it's not as hard to do as when you first determined the weight.

If anything, this is proof positive that the routine is working (think about it!) and you don't need to be &quot;busting a gut&quot; each and every workout with your maximum weights. Just try it, what have you got to lose?

What some guys do after 6 weeks, is another 2 weeks of 5's (in place of negatives, which is no option for you as you don't have a training partner!) ... Increase the weights if you can, or just work with your maximum. In the next cycle, just increase your weights by 5-10% ... This is the progression you're seeking.

Like you said, it seems counter intuitive, but there IS progression - you're just not charging at it like a wounded bull
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... You're taking your time, the weights are going up slowly. Slowly is best - resist the temptation to up the weights too quickly (which can result in injuries, etc.)

Think of it this way, what is the alternative? In a traditional routine you're hammering away day-in day-out, pushing for more all the time. From my own observations, I don't see the people who follow this method gaining any better - to the contrary, they're usually not getting anywhere as they're &quot;burnt out&quot; by the 2nd or 3rd month of this training style.

In HST, from a practical stand point, you're taking a couple of steps forward and then a step back (IMHO.) It works remarkably well.

As far as a program is concerned, what Fausto lists looks really good. Chinups are great, but if you can't do them (no chinning bar), there are work arounds (Barbell Rows is the logical alternative from your point of view.)

The amount of tuna and steak you eat depends on your protein requirements. I suspect you don't really need more than .8 - 1 gram of protein per pound of bodyweight (I know, I know, a lot of guys shoot for a lot more and there is evidence to suggest this is helpful.) Don't neglect the carbs and fats either. The important thing is a calorie surplus.

I hope that helps!

Daniel
 
Daniel is right, overshooting protein will result in bone &quot;leaching&quot;, in other words it causes acidity in excess and your body needs to counter balance this by leaching calcium off your bones...not a good alternative in my opinion.

Do not take protein much above 25% (range 15 - 25%) of your total calories, carbs would carry the bulk (up to 75% - range 55 - 75%) and fat on the lowish side (up to 20% from about 15 - 20%).
 
Hey

Sweet, thank you all. I like this forum everyone gives solid replies and doesnt see a nooby lifter as some kind of prey enabling them express their lifting superiority over them(like I found in t nation)

Yeah it seems like a good program. Just originally seemed a bit weird that you dont plan to lift anything more after 6 week, as I trained about 6 months ago for a month using standard 3 sets 12 rep schemes and woulda made strength gains slightly every week. but yes i kinda understand the basis of it now; its essential for hypertrothy to increase the weight regularly, and this program allows you to do it each workout. The only part I dont understand is why lowering the reps is of any benefit i know it says in the program some thing like &quot;to accomadate the increasing load&quot; but like the load is never anything more then what you could have done previosuly, so why do you lower the reps, not that it matters, as I guess ill be doing same reps as I liked the sound of 1 set 15's 2 10's and 3 15's, but yeah its just something i couldnt explain if someone asked me lol
When I did squats last time I started working out i could manage to life the weight on my shoulders but like i Suppose if im doing squats after like a different compound movement (something ive never done) it could be a bit tiresome.
good news too, just found out im getting a healthy tax return, maybe can afford some protein after all!
Thanks for the help guys
 
Sorry, one more thing; As i said im a begginer,so I'm not capable of doing 15 dips, how is that meant to work? just do as many as i can every day? and what do you mean by rows, im looking at the excercise directory now and theres all differnt types, i remeber i used to to do a bent over row, is that it?
 
thanx, just one thing- I'm really weak so I cant do Dips and for some excercises I may not be lifting enough to ligten the weights with 6 equal increments and still have weight on it!! what should I do in that situation. I'm about to go figure out my 15 rep maxes
 
Use fewer increments. For instance 120 120 140 140 160 160 instead of using six different ones.
 
You oculd always use declines up to the 5's and then start doing dips, once you can add weight you will see major benefits!
 
Cheers, unfortunately my bench doesnt do that:(
I actually think I might take a couple weeks just doing 10 rep sets just to get used to the excercises and hopefully build a little strength so the whole increment thing can work out properly. Is this a good/bad idea? also how should my diet differ on non-training days? and ive heard cardio before breakfast is best way to burn fat, will this definately only burn fat and not be detrimental to muscle building?
 
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