Creating the ultimate cutting routine

You just gotta love that Tot. Dat man has style!
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Normally a person should NOT decrease water consumption, but should increase it. As Tot said, it is your friend, especially during a cut. Dehydration is a way of death, not life. Even temporary dehydration that some contestors do is very rough on many internal organs. You'll have plenty of time to dehydrate as a cadaver...don't rush it.
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Also, do not cut sodium drastically in an attempt to lower water retention. 23% of bone structure is sodium. If you cut your sodium too low, your body will have to suck it out of your bones and leave you prone to fractures.
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I'm in with Tot about creatine and water. Manipulating water weight is a competitive cutting tactic for those who go on stage. It can also be used for an important day at the beach, metaphorically speaking. Long term water weight loss isn't possible. I can't believe I even have to write this.

Creatine is a must. It promotes strength and size gains. I have never read anything about it interfering with fat loss. The water retention that comes with creatine use is a non-issue. If, at the end of your cut, you want the water out just stop ingesting creatine. I can't believe I have to write this as well. Why me Lord?

I feel you on the arms. Much of my routine is caught up with correcting gross shoulder and upper back problems but I still find room to set aside a special time for my biceps. I am aggressive in my programming. Currently I am experimenting with a protocol taken from the pages of a 1999 dissertation on concentric and eccentric lifting. See the 1 set vs 3 thread for the details. Something I can offer you that is a little more predictable would be my Plan B. You've got 4 sets and two movements for biceps. The standing curl utilizes all three of the major elbow flexors. The preacher curl emphasizes the brachialis and the medial head. Two other lifts are seated incline dumbell curls for the lateral head and something I call shoulder flexed reverse curls. I'll explain below:

SFR curls: Reverse curls done with a 95 - 105 degree angle between the humerus and the body. How you find a way to do them is a matter of ingenuity. These are, in theory, the best curls you can do for the brachialis. Kinesiology texts state that when the arm is flexed at 90 degrees or more the biceps significantly lose their ability to pull during elbow flexion (a.k.a. - curling). As a result the brachialis becomes the prime mover. In addition the pronation of the wrist reduces the medial head's ability to pull because it inserts into the radius, which when you pronate, rotates away from the humerus taking the medial head with it. Combine the effects of wrist pronation and extreme humeral flexion and you have a recipe for brachialis growth. Much better than a preacher (Scott!) bench, which was originally intended for standing curls.

When I do my SFR curls I do them on a curling machine that has a horizontal elbow pad. The reason I use a machine is because if you use a free weight for any curling exercise the resistance decreases while muscle strength increases. It works obviously, but its not optimal. The machine I use has an angled bar making it impossible to reverse grip. So I put my lifting straps on and wrap them once around the bar using the remaining material as a handle. It works like a charm. In order to get the degree of humeral flexion necessary to effect biceps inadequacy I have to kneel on the ground and lean forward a little. I am 6 foot 5. This is an example. Your experience will vary.

As for incline curls I know of a trick: If you put something behind your head it may make you a little stronger in the curling.

You may like to try distributing your biceps volume across three or four of these curls.

If you believe in the power of Max-Stim, try your 5RM for 10 reps.

Cardio sucks. Might as well do Tabata, the Voltron of HIIT, and get it over sooner, without the cortisol. To reach 10% from 12 will require the loss of ~5 lbs. At 2 pounds per week which is what my dietician of a mother accomplishes with her clients, it will take you 2.5 weeks. To go from 15% to 10% is 10 lbs, which means 5 weeks. That's April. You'd have ~2 months before June. Might as well shoot for 7%.
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Time is on your side.
 
Great posts everyone, thanks!


tot, I usually stop taking creatine during a cut (thinking that it wouldn't help much w/o filling up carb storages), but you have got me thinking that maybe I should continue it. Can you elaborate on why it is a good idea during a cut?


og, I have no plans to drastically decrease sodium, as I am not one to go on stage. Plenty of water is always traversing its way through my body!

QP, I know I am not far and I do have time on my side. Rather than trying to get down to 7% and losing my hard earned muscle, I would rather get to 9-10% on a slow cut and make sure I maintain my strength as much as possible.




I changed my routine since starting this post...

I never started cardio, as I don't want to lose too much too fast. I should though as my BP is 145/76. I am going to wait to use it when weight loss stops (should be another week or three).


My routine is all lifting and is as follows:

A Routine:
Weighted Pullups - 2 sets, 10x @ 35lbs
Flat DB Bench - 5 sets, 5x @ 100lb (EACH DUMBELL! read carefully lol!!!
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Wide Grip Machine Pulldowns - 2 sets, 10x @ 125lbs
Vertical Leg Press - 3 sets, 15x @ 255lbs
Skull Crushers - 2 sets, 10x @ 95lbs

B Routine:
Deads - 1 set, 10x @ 315lbs (mtime)
Seated Rows - 2 sets, 10x @ 75lbs
Weighted Incline Crunches - 2 sets, 10x @ 90lbs
Dips - 3 sets, 10x @ 70lbs
DB Curls - 2 sets, 8x @ 50lbs


I am lifting M-F with the weekends off, switching back and fourth between A & B.


I am really enjoying my new split. It allows be to go heavy on my deads, but isn't too long that I have no engergy in the tanks for recovery. As of today I am 203-204lbs in the morning.
 
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(colby2152 @ Feb. 28 2008,09:33)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">QP, I wish I could cut that quick!</div>
me too!
 
I sure don't want this to be an argument.

Creatine is what I use to improve recovery during my workouts.

I normally only supplement with Optimum Nutrition 100% whey protein and Glutamine powder. Nutritious food in quantity is my main go.

I take EAS Phosphagen HP (creatine) when I take Creatine. I load it several days until my body has a reserve and then I back off to about half what I took during loading.

I notice almost immediately a size difference in my body, my strength and endurance improve noticeably. My understanding is the Creatine enables water to be absorbed into my body at the cellular level. It is my understanding from what I've read that it is important to take alot of water while taking Creatine to inhibit any Kidney problems that might occur.

Taking Creatine during cutting would have never occurred to me, since I get a great pump when I'm on Creatine and gain size. The gain is just water.

Maybe there is a creative way to take creatine. It would be interesting to read about it with some corroborative proofs of just how Creatine can help with cutting safely.

Note: I'm not saying it doesn't work for cutting I just don't see the connection.
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">QP, I wish I could cut that quick!</div>

Dietician's aren't concerned with losing muscle mass when dealing with their clients, who are generally obese.

I've never done a cutting cycle because I've never had to. Gaining mass is my game. But if I had to, or if I was asked to give advice to someone who is, my advice would be to read a whole hell of a lot. I have accidentally read enough on fat loss to know there are many potent details on how to get the job done. Why, just last night I was reading in a bookstore on celebrity beauty secrets. Turns out a lot them like some drugstore product called Emergen-C for its fat loss abilities. Another practice was putting vinegar dressing on salads before a meal because the acidic PH levels off blood sugar for 2 hours. Things like that.

Here is an article by a guy who is a nutritional consultant for competitive bodybuilders. He's also succesful competitive bodybuilder himself. He says he actually gains muscle while cutting.

http://www.t-nation.com/article....ach&cr=
 
It just occured to me this morning that you can do an SFR curl with an elevated bench and a barbell. Lay down stomach first on the bench, letting the arms hang straight down. Now reverse curl the barbell.
 
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(QuantumPositron @ Feb. 29 2008,17:17)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">It just occured to me this morning that you can do an SFR curl with an elevated bench and a barbell.  Lay down stomach first on the bench, letting the arms hang straight down.  Now reverse curl the barbell.</div>
Would this not be too different than a pull-up using pronated grip?  I certainly would like to find the magic formula for optimal arm growth so I'm open to trying most anything.
 
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(omega99 @ Mar. 04 2008,21:24)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I certainly would like to find the magic formula for optimal arm growth so I'm open to trying most anything.</div>
The trouble with most magic forumulas for optimal growth is that they usually require a lot of hard work and great deal of eating...
 
QP

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">It just occured to me this morning that you can do an SFR curl with an elevated bench and a barbell. Lay down stomach first on the bench, letting the arms hang straight down. Now reverse curl the barbell. </div>

That I saw once being called the Arnold curl only it was not a reverse curl.

I do an interesting one, standing in front of the cable cross over machine, hook up the short bar (must be self moving) to the top cable, then position your arms so that the biceps are right next to your ears, keep them there and curl back over the head, do not take a weight that is too heavy as you will loose form, works like a charm, I use it before going to the incline dumbell curls.
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Just thought I's add it.
 
Hey guys,

I have found the easiest way to lose fat is to simply eat it! I have never needed a cutting routine because my diet keeps my body fat very low all the time. It hovers between 3-5.3%. (Thats what the magic scale says at least lol.)

Roughly 65% of my diet is fat, 25% protein and the rest carbs. The carbs come up as needed for glycogen stores. The fat provides TONS of calories for growth and radically raises growth factors like testosterone.

Not only is the diet healthier but its far easier to gain mass without fat. I have trained a number of folks on such a diet and all respond quite well. They bulk up and lose fat. I believe Giranda used to use somewhat similar dietary methods if memory is right.

Anyway, goodluck!
Jeff
 
Jeff, you sound rather enthusiastic, but what is your body fat percentage? Scales are crap at best, so do you have pictures to show? Plus, do you claim someone will drop the fat without cutting calories on this diet? Did you go from a healthy body fat % (8-15) to your current state using this high fat diet?
 
Colby,

I dont have pics as sadly no digital type of camera or cell phone. (Yeah yeah, I am technologically challeneged!)

Anyway, after looking through the pics thread, I look very similar to Sniggle, but I also have an 8 pack. (I do alot of gymnast type training and that blew my abs up!)

I am an ecto/meso mix so I have never been fat, and gaining mass IS hard. My body fat on a typical high carb diet was somewhere around 10%. However, as soon as I switched to a high fat, medium prot., much lower carb diet, I lost all the fat without doing ANY exercise. (It may not be that easy for all, but everyone I train responds quite fast so far, so it seems to.)

As for dropping cals, mine actually went up lol. Still lost the fat. I imagine there is a limit to upping cals but a friend on a different forum, in an experiment, was taking in 7000!!! calories a day for a month (mainly as high fat, medium protein, and low carbs.) He wasnt training either.

He gained about 3 lbs, thats it. Now I cannot say this is the norm but I was surprised. It was a raw type diet as is mine. Mainly raw suet and egg yolks for fat, raw greass fed beef and some fruits. I too gain no weight on this diet, around 3500 cals for me, UNLESS I work out. Then I gain, but as of yet, never fat.

I imagine at some point extra cals would be stored, but I havent found that limit yet myself.

I have read some good science in the past that says that the body sheds the fat because there is an abundance and thus no reason to hold it. Also, the cleaner the diet, the less need for fat as fat is a storage for toxins.

In any event, I hope I answered your questions.

Good luck in whatever you pursue and if you have other questions, just ask!
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I think it's true that about 3% of body fat in men is essential stuff found in the brain and other parts of the central nervous system. Then you have to add all the other types to get a true figure for total body fat. Most people would be dead at around 3% fat, whatever their method of reading might say.
 
Lol,

I agree. I was just going by what the scale told me.

I go more on appearance. The fact that I can easily see my 8 pack and other muscles and have no discernable body fat tells me its low.
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...course I could be missing the fat in my head...after this week of misunderstandings I had with &quot;load&quot; who knows!
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Jeff
 
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