Customizing HST

Discussion in 'Hypertrophy-Specific Training (HST)' started by proteus9, Jan 18, 2005.

  1. shakeel

    shakeel New Member

    vicious
    no

    1.what if i want to introduce stretch point movements and ls,in what phase can i use it?3-5 rep range?

    2.for the stretch movement do i start directly with a 5 rm load?

    3.after a 14 days sd for the very first workout on monday do i go to failure for 8 reps?

    4 is there any benefits going to failure?does it promote strength?or you can stop 1 rep before failure?

    5.the cycle is about 6 weeks?is there any methods to extend the cycle?partials LS etc?

    6.am confused on something arriving on 110% of 1 rm load ,you are obviuously working with negatives????or normal reps?as it is impossible to work normal reps with 110% of 1 rm l,oad
     
  2. And this wet dream is really what muscles need to grow.

    tested excately this for arm-specialisation during about 4 Weeks

    Results: +1/3 inch, more veins,fuller and much sculptured shape

    and my arms are really a part gains occur slowly (1/3 inch a year was what I could expect)

    regards
     
  3. [​IMG]
     
  4. Lance

    Lance New Member

    Currently doing that as well and it's going fantastic!

    Question is, what's better, clusters or negs?
     
  5. My opinion would be Negs for the simple reason that even though with clustering you can get into some heavier weight, 2 or 3 RM, you still aren't approaching your 1 RM or beyond.
     
  6. Lance

    Lance New Member

    I was thinking along those same lines, negs would equal heavier loads.
     
  7. Yep, plus the remodeling effect of eccentrics.
     
  8. Lance

    Lance New Member

    What's the remodeling effect? Havn't heard of that.

    That's just more incentive towards negatives over clusters.

    Wouldn't clusters give more strength though as well?
     
  9. Probably easier to say "damage caused by eccentrics", you've probably heard it that way.

    Good question, strength, from what I have read shows to be increased more in eccentric or accentuated eccentric with concentric. So it would seem that eccentric is overall better for strength gains as well.
     
  10. semajes

    semajes New Member

    I believe, with regards to strength, that gains are specific to the approach.  That is, eccentrics will increase eccentric strength and concentrics will increase concentric strength.  If strength is a concern it's best to do full reps.  As a matter for hypertrophy, eccentrics will cause more myotrauma and, thus, potentially lead to greater gains in size.
     
  11. shakeel

    shakeel New Member

    vicious
    1.
    the 2.5-10 % is it of 1 rm or 5 rm?

    2.have you personally use the hybrid max ot?whar are the results?

    3.with it can you exzpect strength gains and mass gains?

    4.you said pulsing with chins low loads.how do you do it?what load you use?you pulse from the above descens a few inches then top again?

    5.suppose on monday i did 10 rep to failure.am in the 6-8 phase and i do 2 sets to failure.then on wednesday and friday how do i cluster?for 20 reps or 16 reps?

    6.how to test for new load on monday if one uses alternate exercise flat bench monday wenesday incline bench and friday flat bench

    7.you said there are many ways to make hst more effective.can you post the ways?
     
  12. shakeel

    shakeel New Member

    hannesbruck
    tested excately this for arm-specialisation during about 4 Weeks

    can you post your arm specialisation routine what you did exactly
     
  13. shakeel

    shakeel New Member

  14. shakeel

    shakeel New Member

    vicious
    where are you
     
  15. vicious

    vicious New Member

    5RM, but they're just a guide.

    Not exactly. Much of Max-OT fits HIT split systems, and so I extrapolated aspects of that and DC's approach training to load progression.

    Yup. Keep in mind that you can get noticeable strength gains with normal HST too; it's just that the original program is not really structured to guage and adapt according to your strength gains. In applying this or any strength-oriented variation of HST, a person is adding a layer of abstraction that's not necessary for strictly hypertrophy, but is important for strength-orientation. Thus this fusion is really just one example of that layer; you could adapt 5x5 and other PL-ish programs too.

    Pulsing with chins with low loads is for producing a burn (i.e. metabolic stress.) You'd pulse at the sternum, where the most burn is created, which happens to be the weakest part of the moment. Thus, the low loads at that point.

    "Pulse-stretches" with chins would be normal-or-high loads at near lock-out. That's for generating extra strain.

    16 reps. The range prevents a trainee from performing too many reps that would impact fatigue .

    Not a good idea. Best way is to test both incline and flat, on the same day, in the same order every week.

    Really involves looking at your journal and rewriting the workout plan according to your goals. Specifically, it's about working the mechanical strain and metabolic stress variables, according to individual constraints, to maximize overall response.

    cheers,
    Jules
     
  16. shakeel

    shakeel New Member

    thanks vicious .what if i want to introduce stretch point movements and ls,in what phase can i use it?3-5 rep range?

    2.for the stretch movement do i start directly with a 5 rm load?

    3.after a 14 days sd for the very first workout on monday do i go to failure for 8 reps?

    4 is there any benefits going to failure?does it promote strength?or you can stop 1 rep before failure?

    5.the cycle is about 6 weeks?is there any methods to extend the cycle?partials LS etc?

    6.am confused on something arriving on 110% of 1 rm load ,you are obviuously working with negatives????or normal reps?as it is impossible to work normal reps with 110% of 1 rm l,oad
     
  17. vicious

    vicious New Member

    You could probably introduce it right away (or about a week or two into your program.) That being said, I'm uncomfortable with generalizing how they can be used in this form of program.

    The beauty of classic HST is that strength goals don't figure into the picture. But, when measurable strength gains are a primary goal or implemented into the system, then you must consider how additional hypertrophy techniques complicates things.

    Any strain technique that creates significant microtrauma (i.e. strain over RBE) drops your strength levels almost immediately, or the responsiveness of your muscles to neural drive. Loaded stretches and negatives (they themselves require less drive than normal reps), coupled with HST's high frequency, will affect your ability to make failure-based strength gains week-to-week. To what degree is not clear; it will probably depend on the individual. It's important to remember that, in this approach, you'll be training to failure once a week every week.

    In this and most strength-oriented hypertrophy systems, the basis for success is to be able to produce load progressions in order to continue the cycle. Once a trainee cannot make any more progress, their bulk cycle ends. A bulk cycle should be at least 4 weeks and ideally 6+ weeks to be favorably compared with DC and Max-OT systems.

    It's about risk, really. When implementing a functional strength layer upon the core HST system, you ask yourself this -- "can I demonstrate load improvements every week if you use this or that hypertrophy technique in addition to the basic requirements of this functional strength system?"

    I would correlate the load in proportion to the adjunct compound movement. If the 5RM of your fly movement is 40% of your bench press 5RM, then your fly movement would always default to 40% of whatever load you work with the press. Ideally, you would skip positive movement altogether, performing either negatives, loaded stretches, or a combination of the two.

    Yup. You would use your journal to find a load between your 5RM and 10RM and see how far you go. And when you train to failure, you really go to failure, pressing for another 4-5 seconds when the weight stops moving. You know, all that Artie Jones good stuff. :)

    There's a good avantlabs article on the pro/con to training toward failure. Generally, yes, it promotes functional improvements by helping you practice high rate coding through neural drive for a given load. Because you're working the 6-8 and 3-5 rep ranges, you won't see a lot of metabolic adaptations, but you'll see a lot of skill acquisition (which is further helped by the cluster training you do on your other days.) Although, there's certainly a hit in CNS fatigue, it should be less than if you were using a traditional 8-12 rep range. Keys to success including having really full glycogen stores and enough sleep before the Monday test and to be very "easy-going" with the cluster training Wednesday and Friday. When you're working at super-heavy loads (approaching 3RM), you may perform 1 rep with 30+ second rest periods.

    Because this is a strength-oriented program, you will stop your cycle when you can't make any more load progressions. That's it. No partials, no fancy cycle-extending strategies. You stop.

    On the fusion program, you just keep making strength adaptations week-to-week. You may go well past your original 5RM, but you should be really working with your true 3RM-to-8RM week to week.

    cheers,
    Jules
     
  18. shakeel

    shakeel New Member

    thanks vicious for your patience.last question.

    how can you make a hybrid of dc training and hst?
    same guidelines as the max ot-hst?
     
  19. vicious

    vicious New Member

    Pretty much the same thing, except drop it down to 2x-a-week, add in the loaded stretching, and include burn sets.

    cheers,
    Jules
     
  20. steini

    steini New Member

    well, a 6x hst - dc hybrid for the gymrats would be pretty cool.

    But I think that would be a bit too much ;).
     

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