Do I have too many routines?

[spiesii]

Hello
I am on my second cycle of HST. I am doing 12 sets of exercises each workout, plus a 10-15 minute ab workout. I do one set at about 60% for a warmup, then begin my first set, do my ab workout, and intentions of another set. After my ab workout, I've been in the gym about an hour, and am completely without energy to complete another set.
Here is my workout.
Squats, Leg Curl, Bench Press, Incline DB press, DB shoulder press, Lateral raise, upright rows, shrugs, DB bent over rows,
wide grip pull downs, standing curls, lying tri-ext, machine preacher curls, and tricep extension.
I then do my ab workout. I don't have a problem with the 15's because I don't warmup first.
Suggestions?
Thanks in advance.
spiesii

 

[Totentanz]

It looks okay, though in my opinion you are doing more arm work than is neccesary. I would also drop the leg curls, since they are basically worthless for hamstrings compared to something like good mornings or SLDL. You probably don't need so many lifts for shoulders either. I would drop it down to just DB shoulder press and Upright rows, drop the lateral raise and shrugs.
I would seriously consider replacing pulldowns with weighted chins. I also feel that BB bentover rows are better than DB bentover rows, but that's more of a personal choice. I would toss dips in there instead of incline DB press, that will take care of your triceps as well. Then replace the bench press with incline BB bench.

Basically, here is how I would do it, not necessarily in this order:

Squats
Good Morning or SLDL
Incline Bench
Weighted Dips
DB shoulder press
DB bentover rows or BB bentover rows
Pull downs/weighted chins
BB Curls

That would trim it down from 14 lifts to only 8. I would do multiple sets for some of them, but even with multiple sets, it should take no longer than 30-40 minutes, even less if you superset. If you superset, I'd go like this

A1. 2 x Squats
A2. 2 x Bentover Row
B1. 2 x Weighted Dips
B2. 1 x Weighted Chins
C1. 1 x Incline Bench
C2. 2 x Good Morning or SLDL
D1. 1 x Shoulder Press
E1. 1 x BB Curls
*E2. 2 x Weighted Ab

That would end up as 12-14 sets, but still shouldn't take very long.
*As for the ab routine, is there a reason you are doing abs? I believe strong abs are important in lifting, but a lot of guys do abs thinking it will give them a six pack, which it won't necessarily.
You probably only need one movement for abs, preferably with enough weight added to keep you within the rep range you are working under with HST. Keeping the abs in your HST workout would trim back the time used even further.
I could easily complete this workout in 45 minutes, assuming a little bit of dinking around between sets.

 

[Bryan Haycock]

A good rule of thumb is, if you are still too tired from your last workout to enjoy your present workout, you're doing too much.

I know people who can do a tremendous amount of "work" and still recover sufficiently to train that muscle group effectively within 48 hours. Others, like myself, tend to have more limited energy supplies.

 

[Joe.Muscle]

I agree with Totentanz.

What I now do after a year or so of HST looks like this most of the time.

10 degree bench press for

Rows or chins

Shoulder press standing ( this hits the core too )

Squats or leg press.

I will through in tricep press down and curls when ever I can for high reps but if I am in a hurry I just do the compounds only.

Also I stick with high sets for Chest and Back and legs I use 3 to 4 sets and I use just one set only for shoulders.

This gives you more than enough volume yet still keep your overall sets down around 12 or 14.

 

[Gesar]

HI, I have a question about burning out. for example my weekly routine is MWF but this past friday could not do it but I did it today (sunday). Now my second week of 10's starts tomorrow.
should I skip tomorrows? or just start regulary ? would that be burnout? I dont feel too tired now.

also about supersets I dont know if I get them but with supersets do you have to do 2 excersices one after the other?
for example 1 set of biceps then triceps then biceps then triceps...is that how it works? I read articles but i just want to maker sure I get it right.

Gracias

 

[Fausto]

Spiesii

Bryan's got it! It's that simple.

I think Tot has given you some direction there, he has kept only the eesntila whilst giving you other directions.

But that is basically it, dude, if you are tired is because you doing too much!

To tell you the truth, most of us have found that less is actually more, keep just 5 - 6 basic exercises and hit them real heavy (within your maxes of course)

yields the best results!

So - re-think and re-try, then tell us how's it going!

 

[spiesii]

Thanks for the help and input.
It's hard to get past the old way of "more is better" thinking. Even though I read the article, which states you only need 8 routines, I felt that just wasn't enough. I am in my 5's and plan on switching to the workout "Tot" has suggested.
I read on another post to do SLDL last. Is that correct, or should I do them directly after squats?
Thanks again for the help.

 

[Fausto]

I prefer it directly after squats!

 

[Joe.Muscle]

Getting past the more is better is tough!

I know what you mean...just try to make every set count for quality, and really focus on doing a little more load or work each workout!

I have expiermented with this myself and for some reason you just tend to hold back on some sets when you know you have more ahead, unlike when you only have 2 or 3 sets to get the workout in, the extra focus seems to work for me!

 

[spiesii]

I did the routine suggested by "Tot" last night. When I got done, I was sweaty, but still had lots of energy. The desk person asked how my workout was, and my reply was just ok. It's only been approx 12 hours since my workout, and I feel it now.
The things I did different were reducing the amount of sets, SLDL instead of leg curls, I did three sets of each routine back to back versus, three full circuits, and reduced my 10 minute ab workout to one routine of weighted crunches on a machine. I was out of the gym within an hour.
Is what I experienced before, what is referred to as CNS fatigue, and should I do three sets of each routine before switching, or should I do a full circuit, then start over?
Thanks again for everyone's input. It really seemed to help.
spiesii