Giving HST a try, a little hazy on a few things...

T

turbo332

New Member
I am new to these concepts and I have decided to give HST a try. I have previously been dedicated to the 4-6 rep heavy as possible weight day in and day out. My gains got stagnant, and in the last two weeks I gave 10-12 reps and try and my joints were quite happy with me. I was then going to cycle weeks of 4-6 with weeks of 10-12 until I found this site. The results thread got my interest so I am going to begin my first cycle this week.

Joint/rest wise I feel great now, so I am opting to skip the 15's and begin with 10's. I like to change things alot too, so i want to stick with 2 week blocks for each rep scheme (I would get bored with larger blocks).
So, 2 weeks of 10's followed by two weeks of 5's followed by....?
Perhaps I need the 15's simply to make the cycle longer?

One last thing, I understand that when I complete one cycle, SD, then start another, I will start the other (hopefully) with higher Rm's than before. When will I have determined these new Rm's, if my last workout for each rep scheme was when I used my originally determined Rm's? Is there ever a time when, for example, that you are going through a given rep scheme, and then keep going PAST your previous RM's, even though the last workout for that rep scheme is supposed to be using your previous RM's? Do you only do this by extending the 5's?

I am willingly to accept that i might be able to grow using submaximal weights, and that I might also get stronger, I am just unclear as to when I am to determine my new strength?

I have done a 5x5 cycle previously (the Bill Starr program), and that involved statrting off BELOW your 5 rep max, then progressing(!) to your current 5 rep max, then attempting to BEST your previous 5 rep max.
I am now wondering when I get a chance to blast away from my old Rm's during this program.

Sorry for the length, and any help is greatly appreciated. I am very excited about beginning this program!
 
If you are in the middle of 15's or 10's and know you will be able to lift more than what you calculated as your max by the end of the mesocycle you can adjust your weights during the as you see fit.

I would recommend taking a week off for SD prior to starting your cycle if you weren't planning on it.

This may be worth reading also if you haven't seen it yet. It's pretty short and has some good infor in it.

Principles of HST

On your next cycle you just add weight to what your last RM's....10 pounds or so.
 
I am kind of glad this topic was opened because there are always going to be new ppl that get confused....

I the posted Principles of HST it says "...beginning weight at around 44% of your 1RM." Is this an effective method only when you are just starting HST with your 15 reps or should I use the 15...5RM? I was just wondering which would be better to start off.
 
For me it is easier to use my 15,10 & 5 RM's to calculate everything. Then just try to keep your starting weight at 70% of the RM. This weight in the 15's should also be pretty close to 50% of you 5 RM weight. There is an example of this in that Principles of HST document.
 
turbo332: Why not try the 15s? My experience with them is that they can be brutal once you are at or near your 15RM loads. In your case, where you have been working with low reps for a while now, they will be beneficial for your joints. They only last a couple of weeks anyway.

If you know your RMs for each rep range you plan to use (as you will if you take a week's workouts to find them - ie. Mon find 15RMs, Wed 10s & Fri 5s) then a good rule of thumb is to start each mesocycle with around 70/75% of your RM (as Bulldog suggested). Then use increments of around 5% each w/o to take you up to your RMs. This will usually allow for some zig-zagging and hence some fatigue management after each RM w/o.

My personal preference is never to mess with RMs during a cycle but to note down how easy or hard it is to get the required reps for the 15RM and 10RM w/os. Then next cycle you can decide whether to add 5 or 10 lbs to these RM loads.

Once you reach your 5RM w/o you can then continue to increment the loads each w/o until you reach your new 5RM for each exercise. Note these down for next cycle and then continue working with these weights for a few more weeks OR you can continue to increment the load, say once a week, and drop to say three reps each set and then cluster reps to reach your required rep count or do negs (where it's possible to do so). You can continue this way until your joints are telling you to SD and start over or when you feel that you are not able to make any further progress. Some folks just do 4 weeks of 5s and others stretch them out as long as possible. My personal preference is now for around 6 weeks of 5s and post-5s before I want to start over again although I did several cycles with the vanilla program (2 weeks each 15s,10s, 5s, post-5s) and that worked well too.

Have a great cycle!
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I just finished two weeks (one muscle per day, once per week) of 10-12 rep sets, and juding from what I enjoy in the gym I think I would prefer to skip the 15's. I think I'll start with: 10x2week, 5x4 week, SD or more 5's as needed.
Do I then take the first week back, following SD, to determine new Rm's and then start a 2nd cycle on my 2nd week after SD based on those new Rm's?

Ty for that document BTW, I like the way he alters the really light starting weight and zigzags.

I really can't wait until the gym on Monday, and I'm not going to know what to do with myself on Tu/Thurs lol, guess it's time for cardio...
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I just wanted to address a few things turbo332 brought up in his initial post. It’s important for people new to hypertrophy-specific training to understand that the reps schemes and loading schedules are not arbitrarily chosen. By that I mean, we aren’t just doing things this was to be different.

About the “15’s”, they serve a few purposes. The 15s provide an opportunity to heal after weeks or heavy weight loads. Very few people can use their 5RM and above for weeks at a time without experiencing some joint pain. This is normal but it also needs to be actively managed. You can't just keep going and hope that it goes away. The 15’s, with the lighter loads and higher (burning) reps, can stimulate healing without the trauma associated with heavier loads.

The 15’s also serve to stimulate pathways in the muscle that respond to metabolic activity. By intentionally burning the crap out of the muscle you stimulate some growth and enzymatic adaptations that will facilitate new growth. And though I’m not such a proponent of the hormonal angle, some would say the impact on hormones (i.e.GH) is also beneficial.

Finally, if planned correctly, the 15’s also stimulate growth. After SD, the weight loads can induce growth. However, if a person goes straight from heavy loads to using their 15RM, the lighter loads won’t be heavy enough relative to their current level of conditioning. Only after a period of deconditioning will the lighter loads be effective for stimulating growth.
 
I seem to recall a study done last year or so on high rep sets with the result being the growth of mitochondria - which can produce some size and also has something to do with the metabolic pathways you referred to.

I may be mistaken, but I thought that most GH output came from the heavier sets and compounds. Not to say that we don't have output from the 15's.
 
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