mostly compounds for hst cycle

B

B.b. in stress!

New Member
would u guys recommend this for the hst?

such as:
-squats
-leg press
-sldl
-deadlifts
-pullups/pulldowns
-rows
-incline/flat/decline bench
-dips
-shoulder press
-calf raises

if i were to do this, should i just eliminate direct arm work and increase the volume for the large muscle groups?

my main goal for this hst cycle (actually for lifting in general) is to focus on my large muscle groups, as i avidly believe that with a large chest and shoulders come large triceps (and same for the back and biceps)

thx!
 
Great exercises, but I wouldn't do squats and leg press in the same workout.. or deadlift and SLDL.. or pullups and rows... alternate them and it will workout better.
 
i agree with colby exept i would use pulldowns and rows ..one is for width and the other is for thickness .
 
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(colby2152 @ Mar. 14 2006,00:51)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Great exercises, but I wouldn't do squats and leg press in the same workout.. or deadlift and SLDL.. or pullups and rows... alternate them and it will workout better.</div>
Depending on the person and perhaps COlby has his reasons but personally, doing squats and leg press in the same workout is fine and I would recommend doing it.

Changing the plane of motion in the back movements during the same workout is also a good idea.
 
I know Dan is 'the man'
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but I reckon that when you get to the heavy 5s you will not be so keen to do squats and leg presses in the same session (or SLDL &amp; deadlifts for that matter). Something I tried which does seem to work quite well is doing a set of 15 reps on the leg press after 5s for squats as a metabolic blaster set. Gives you a really good burn &amp; pump in your quads.

Depending on the frequency you plan to use and your previous lifting experience I reckon you might be better off alternating squats and deadlifts rather than doing both in the same session. If your CNS and lower back can cope okay then no worries. See how you get on and then, if you find it all gets too much as the loads increase, you can always start to alternate the heavy lifts later in your cycle.
 
The only reason I am I saying I recommend it is- It's generally not the quads that cause diminished work during squats, it's the back and other synergists or overall aerobic conditioning. Therefore doing leg presses after squats adds additional stimulus to the quads and may be more benefical and less joint taxing that trying to do heavy leg extensions. But to each their own and do whatever works for you
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(B.b. in stress! @ Mar. 13 2006,23:27)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">would u guys recommend this for the hst?

such as:
-squats
-leg press
-sldl
-deadlifts
-pullups/pulldowns
-rows
-incline/flat/decline bench
-dips
-shoulder press
-calf raises

if i were to do this, should i just eliminate direct arm work and increase the volume for the large muscle groups?

my main goal for this hst cycle (actually for lifting in general) is to focus on my large muscle groups, as i avidly believe that with a large chest and shoulders come large triceps (and same for the back and biceps)

thx!</div>
it sounds like you've done prev. cycles of hst. if you did a similar amount of volume on major musc. grp. before than your prog. seems ok.
your wanting to stay with core moves and maj. muscle groups is good idea. my only caution would be if this is a serious jump &quot;up&quot; in your program. doing squat, leg press, sldl, and deadlift to start your w/o is challenging not to mention the other exer. if your used to it and ready, go for it. for some its the only way to train, but if it is a serious jump you may just hit a wall 1/2 way thru 1 w/o (i know i would). i use all the exer. you mentioned but on diff. days and with hitting each musc. group 3x a week i know im getting a good w/o.

either way its your program. ive done many prog. over the yrs and its all personal trial and error (mostly error). but now i know what works for me and what doesnt.

good luck
 
I believe rather firmly that instead of alternating exercises like that, one should endeavor to condition themselves to the point where they can handle both in the same session. Maybe some of you will disagree with me on this, but I know that myself and others here, including Lance for instance, enjoy doing a lot of these lifts in the same session...
For instance, Deadlifts and Squats, I always do them together and I have no problems. I also do chins and rows in the same workout, when I do incline bench, I do it in the same workout as dips. There is nothing special about me that allows me to be able to handle this. Admittedly, it was a bit hard when I first started doing these things, but I'm quite used to it now.
 
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(Totentanz @ Mar. 14 2006,16:10)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I believe rather firmly that instead of alternating exercises like that, one should endeavor to condition themselves to the point where they can handle both in the same session.  Maybe some of you will disagree with me on this, but I know that myself and others here, including Lance for instance, enjoy doing a lot of these lifts in the same session...
For instance, Deadlifts and Squats, I always do them together and I have no problems.  I also do chins and rows in the same workout, when I do incline bench, I do it in the same workout as dips.  There is nothing special about me that allows me to be able to handle this.  Admittedly, it was a bit hard when I first started doing these things, but I'm quite used to it now.</div>
have you ever been in the market for a car or truck and your friends found out. the only vehicle for you in their eyes is the type they currently drive.

by all means take this prog. out for a test drive see what you think.  the only opinion that really matters is yours
 
My point of view is that I would rather stick to one major compound exercise per muscle group which allows me to do more sets of it instead of dividing it up among similar exercises such as rows and chins. I also been using AM/PM splits in my past two cycles, so it works a lot better alternating (squats in the AM, leg press in the PM, etc..) the exercises.

As far as the squats/deadlifts discussion goes... that's always a debate around this forum.

Listen to your body - especially once you hit the 5's.

-Colby
 
Tot: That's interesting. Last cycle I found my lower back was fine all the way up to mid 5s. After that it started to give me too much bother the day following training, which was more of a nuisance than anything else. By alternating deads and squats for three weeks to the end of the post 5s, I found my lower back took less of a hammering which made life away from the gym more pleasant.

My squat and deadlift poundages have increased really well doing this so far, so alternating doesn't seem to be having a detrimental effect. I also find that by alternating my heavy deads and squats I have a lot more energy left for the rest of my workout (which includes bench, dips, pulldowns and bent over rows).

Perhaps as time goes by and as I get more conditioned to training, these two issues will go away. At the end of the day, though, we're all after progress so, I suppose, it's whatever works for you, keeps your training productive and keeps you enjoying your workouts.
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thx for the replies guys!

this is actually my first hst cycle i will b going under and have thought about the energy needed to do squats, leg presses, sldls, and deadlifts in the same workout. However, I really dont want to leave sldls out of my workout, as i think they are the only 'real' hamstring developers. this leaves into account the question of placing deadlifts into my routine; when exactly would u guys recommend incorporating these?

i want to develop a good lower back, but I dont know if i would be gettting the same stimulus with sldls opposed to regular deadlifts.
 
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(B.b. in stress! @ Mar. 14 2006,22:35)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">thx for the replies guys!

this is actually my first hst cycle i will b going under and have thought about the energy needed to do squats, leg presses, sldls, and deadlifts in the same workout.  However, I really dont want to leave sldls out of my workout, as i think they are the only 'real' hamstring developers.  this leaves into account the question of placing deadlifts into my routine; when exactly would u guys recommend incorporating these?

i want to develop a good lower back, but I dont know if i would be gettting the same stimulus with sldls opposed to regular deadlifts.</div>
try different combo's and certainly try all 4 in 1 w/o. since its your 1st cycle you will surely refine things for #2 etc so experiment and see what feels good to you.

as far as low back goes i think the above approach thru 15s-10s will give you an idea of how much is too much for your back. ive done hyper-ext. w/medicine ball in the past with good results but only when i was not deadlifting seriously. if your going to pursue all 4 lifts i think you have low back covered.

good luck
 
I really dont understand y u guys alternate between squats and deadlifts...I mean, aren't deadlifts supposed to target the lower back as the primary muscle? I hardly ever feel my legs getting worked during deads-not till the point where theyre exhausted, but just semi-worked.

so if i choose to alternate between the two, would this look okay?:
one session:
squats, slds,

leg presses, slds, deadlifts

i really dont know how i would carry this out
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more help needed! thx
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I really dont understand y u guys alternate between squats and deadlifts</div>

Pretty simple - for some of us, it is simply too much for our lower backs.
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You are welcome to put them all in one day, really! Just don't come and ask us later how to get rid of lower back pain
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I always found (at least fro myself) that if you are lifting on the region of 100 Kg plus for both of those lifts, it just gets too much, however you do get some tough cahracters who do it anyway!
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i think fausto put it pretty well. you have to find out what does or doesnt work for you.

for me its a matter of energy output and less about low back strain. i keep my rest at 90-120 sec btw sets and find that the 4 done in the same w/o taxes me to the point of affecting the rest of the w/o. i agree that DL works back more than legs (maybe 60%-40% depending on grip) but its 100% effort no matter how you slice it.

i wouldnt worry too much about trying to get the program just right to start. it sounds like you know what your talking about and have a good plan in mind. just take notes as you go along to refine your prog. and in no time you'll be shopping for new clothes (or whatever your goal is).
 
i have to say, i appreciate the advice for the lower back conflict of mine, but u never answered my original question.
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should i lower the volume on arm work and increase the volume on the large muscle groups?
 
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(B.b. in stress! @ Mar. 13 2006,23:27)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">if i were to do this, should i just eliminate direct arm work and increase the volume for the large muscle groups?

my main goal for this hst cycle (actually for lifting in general) is to focus on my large muscle groups, as i avidly believe that with a large chest and shoulders come large triceps (and same for the back and biceps)

thx!</div>
? ? ? ? ?

you did ask that question in the 1st sentence.

you also answered it in the second one.

if after a few cycles of core moves your bi's and tri's arent keeping pace then think about adding some direct work. you must have had some good results in the past if your an avid believer.
 
My two cents on the deadlift for legs issue. I recently started using Sumo style dead's on my alternate day for squats. Absolutely blasts my legs, more noticeably in the hammies. Which is good for me as I feel the squats much more in my quads.

By alternating these two, I feel like my legs get thoroughly worked with just two exercises.
 
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