Strong enough with compounds yet to see good HST results?

C

ClevDawg802

New Member
Hey all...new here to the forums. For the past 6-8 months I've been working with Rippetoe's Starting Strength and have since moved to the MadCow 5x5 routine. I started bulking with these programs, having never lifted weights before in my life, as a start to get my strength up as much as I could (without getting too chub) before moving to a more bodybuilding-hypertrophy type routine to gain size.

Unfortunately, my diet has not been great and I've gained more fat than I would have liked too and have lost speed in my drumming from all the low rep/hvy weight movements (slow/quick twitch stuff? idk)... and only have a few months left before I would like to start cutting. I started at 6'1, 170lbs - and I'm now around 215lbs. My diet is now in order, and I'm curious if my strength is high enough to where I would see more gains if I switched to HST for a few months OR if I won't see much more size gains from a ramping weight 5x5 strength routine as my lifts aren't that big yet. I would have liked to have higher strength #s in these lifts, but I've been getting bogged down with stalling and my drumming has been hurt from all the low rep work. Here are my compounds at my current 5 RMs from madcow.

Squat - 235x5
Bench - 185x5
Deads - 255x5
Row - 150x5
OH Press - 115x5

I understand I am still a "beginner" from these number...but will I see MORE size gains from HST for a few months with a solid diet even though I don't have large lifts yet? Would I be better served sticking to the ramping weight 5x5 as the size gains won't be much less?
 
I absolutely think you'll see gains with HST regardless of your current 5 RMs. With your diet in check, a cycle predominantly or solely using compounds will do wonders if you stick to the HST principles. The higher-rep work alone will be a massive change to what you've experienced in the 5x5 world. If you really want to push the strength aspect of HST, make sure you extend past the 5's and do either negatives or maybe even 2's. No matter what you decide, you will be successful strength-wise using HST - but your diet is vitally important to the overall success of your end line results.
 
Hey ClevDawg802,

First off, welcome! :)

When I started HST my numbers were similar to yours. I made some great gains over the following year so I don't think you need to worry too much about your potential for improvement.

A few things to think about:

1) After doing SS and MC 5 x 5 for some time, HST's 15s might be a bit of a shock to your system, so take things steadily to allow your body time to get used to the metabolic demand imposed by high-rep. This is particularly true of squats and deads. So, for your first cycle or two, don't push as hard during 15s as perhaps you feel you could - particularly as you approach your 15RM workout.

I only mention this because a couple of guys I know have suffered from severe headaches when pushing for big loads during 15s in their first cycles. They've been taller than average too, like you. Not sure if that makes headaches more likely or not, but it's not worth finding out. Should you feel one coming on, rack the bar immediately and take a breather.

2) HST is not magic but it will work very well for hypertrophy if you set up your cycle correctly and eat in excess of maintenance calories (ie. hypercaloric) with a decent ratio of macros.

3) Once you have a handle on how HST works, have a read through the Simplify and Win thread (link in my sig) for some good ideas to help in setting up your cycle.

4) Practice your rudiments daily throughout your cycle - (SAID principle!) ;)

Have fun and all the best for your 1st cycle.
 
Thanks guys..I have another question/two if either of you are still lurking this thread (or others):

Ive noticed being on a routine focusing on compounds, that I've gotten pretty fair gains in my chest/back/shoulders/legs etc...but my arms don't look as proportional to the rest of my body. So -

-Since being on the MC 5x5s, I do EZ or BB curls for bi's once per week. Should I up my bicep work to twice per week on HST or keep it to 1x weekly.

-Also, when doing bent BB rows, I have recently switched to a thumbless grip (thumbs not wrapped around bar). I find that this grip engages my lats more and takes some of my biceps out of the excercise, even though I cant move as much weight with the biceps not being as activated. However, should I go back to normal full grip if I wanted more arm growth or should I stick to focusing on my lats/back rather than killing two birds with one stone?
 
On the bicep work - you may find that the increased volume really taxes your bi's and tri's when doing regular compounds. If they aren't, there's no reason why you couldn't do a couple sets of the iso work. The main rule is that isos cannot impact compounds. If your arms are completely unaffected, 2-3 mildly-heavy sets of 6-8 reps should do the trick. BUT - be mindful that arm iso work could impact your drumming, which you mentioned in your original post.

On the rows - training your back is much more important than training your biceps when doing BB Rows. If you have found that you can pull heavier weights with the thumbless grip, use the thumbless grip.

Best of luck as you get going!
 
ClevDawg802 said:
Ive noticed being on a routine focusing on compounds, that I've gotten pretty fair gains in my chest/back/shoulders/legs etc...but my arms don't look as proportional to the rest of my body. So -

-Since being on the MC 5x5s, I do EZ or BB curls for bi's once per week. Should I up my bicep work to twice per week on HST or keep it to 1x weekly.
Click to expand...

If you want your arms to grow, I would suggest training them 3x/week. Keep the volume low, but train them more often. A set or two of bis and tris after back and chest would do the trick.
 
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