What do you guys think

[Joe.Muscle]

I know that this is prob not the right forum to post but we dont seem to get answers as quick elsewhere. Anyway with all the steroid talk with palmeiro saying that he didnt take steroids but admits to testing positive to roids. Could this of come from a supplement?

Is there any supplements out there currently that give you those results, or has there ever been?

I know androstein was banned a while back...does the science support it being steroid strong?

Also how about the ########### cell tech rumor a year or so ago? They said there were possible traces of hormones in that supplement. What do you guys think?

B/c if there is a legal supplement that strong we all need to be on it!

Joe

 

[colby2152]

The news of Raffy was good in one aspect being that is was the first big name ballplayer that was caught.  The bad news is that fans and media that follow baseball did not believe Palmeiro was on the juice.

Quote[/b] ]We don't know, and Palmeiro has made a huge mistake in not disclosing it. He did say on a conference call, "You know it is a steroid because I have been suspended for 10 days." Early indications are that it was not nandrolone, the source of 73 positives in the survey testing year of 2003 but only one last year. So-called prohormones, such as andro and 19-norandro, so closely resemble nandrolone in structure that they are identifiable in the body or processed in the body as nandrolone. Even the smallest trace amounts will produce a postive. Such elements were known to show up in muscle-enhancing supplements, but they have all but disappeared from supplements this year because they have been given the same legal classification as steroids, which is to say they now are illegal without a doctor's prescription. Palmeiro's refusal to be forthright with his career reputation at stake allows all kinds of speculation, including the possibility that he took a more hardcore steroid.

I firmly believe that he wasn't shooting his @$$ up with needles, but he could have easily been taking some sort of supplement that contained an "illegal substance" that MLB was scanning for.

Barry Bonds was getting $hit for taking flaxseed oil.  However, his connection to roids is more evidential to the immense growth in his ballcap over a short period of time in the late 90's.

 During the steroid era, 100's of players used them.

Now, in connection to any supplement that is legal that we could use.  I'm not sure.  MLB officials have not released what was found in Raffy's test.

Also for those who are scoring at home.  Raffy is not guilty of purgery on March 17th during the hearings concerning MLB and steroid use.  The test was done in late-April, so there is no proof that he took anything before that date.  Rafael would be stupid and foolish to knowingly take anything in the past year with the dark cloud that is over baseball and his hall of fame canidatecy.

 He did indeed take something, and these players should know what's in their supplements before taking them.

-Colby

P.S. Wow, see how passionate I get when a post is something sport-related!!  

 

[Joe G]

" Testosterone poses an unique problem when it comes to drug tests. People naturally possess a certain level of testosterone. As a result, scientists had to come up with an accurate way of measuring naturally occuring testoserone levels. Scientists decided to use the ratio of testoserone to its epimer, epitestosterone (its chemical mirror image also produced by the testes) as the criteria for determining illegal steroid use. The naturally occuring ratio of testosterone to epitestosterone was set at 1:1. Due to the possibility if naturally occurring fluctuations in this ratio the testosterone to epitestosterone ratio for determining illiegal testosterone was set at 6:1. This means that an athlete can have over 5 times the normal testosterone level and still pass the test."

This is a qoute from "The Steroid Bible-Third Edition" written by Steve Gallaway.

I highly doubt that 41 year old Palmeiro who does Viagra commercials suddenly has more than 5 times the amount of naturally occuring testosterone for most men due to some type of supplement. There are clearly no supplements that give these results and if there were they wouldn't be considered supplements. They would be considered Steroids.
I think that Palmeiro should be ashamed of himself.

Joe G

 

[colby2152]

Quote[/b] ]I like what the NFL has done: licensed supplements. Look for the NFL approved logo on the package and you know the supplement will not turn a drug test positive. Anything else and you are risking your reputation. I think MLB should do it, or at least teams should give their players a list of approved products. But let me tell you, the "contaminated supplement" excuse is always thrown out there when an athlete tests positive, and the odds are extraordinarily high against such an event happening. Is it possible? Sure, but not every time an athlete is busted. Be very suspicious of such an excuse. And it does not seem to be in play with Palmeiro because of the nature of the steroid for which he was busted, which reportedly is Stanazolol.

Stanozolol is an anabolic steroid related to the natural hormone testosterone. Stanozolol is used to treat hereditary angioedema (episodic swelling of areas of the body).

Also known as Winstrol, sprinter Ben Johnson was stripped of his Gold Medal in the 100 meter dash in the 1988 Olympics for using the stuff.

After reading many articles written in baseball media on Yahoo, ESPN, and other sources as well as listening to many people critic Raffy's situation... I would say he is dumb as a brick for taking it. Sure it is legal to buy, but it isn't legal to take as a ballplayer. One with his stature of having 3,000 hits and 500 homers as well as being well respected (before last week) would find out what he is allowed to take and not allowed to take before putting something into his body.

I believe his new quote saying he didn't intentionally take steroids. He was being naive and ignorant of what MLB had banned in it's steroid/supplement policy.

If I was a H.O.F. voter I wouldn't let him in. I would vote in someone like Fred McGriff or Jim Rice before him.

-Colby

 

[Papillon]

Part of me would not like to see him get into the HOF; but then I think about the fact that he is only 1 of 4 guys ( I think anyway I did not check the stats) to hit 3000 and 500. Then I also wonder how many pitchers he faced that were/are juicing. Then I eventually think of Pete (not for roids of course): Ya he's a bit bull-headed and handled it wrongly but he needs to be in and i eventually think he will.
It really is a difficult situation but I think Raffy juiced. Even so 3000 and 500 is difficult to overlook forever. He wont be first ballad but he'll get in eventually------ I think.

In any case I am glad they are cleaning it up. It had to be done eventually. It was too late for Merris's record and might be too late for Aaron's which is a bloody shame.



P

 

[colby2152]

Well, the news of Raffy is still relatively new as the steroid that was found was just released yesterday. This is most likely his last year, and yes you are right - he is one of four players who have had 3,000 hits and 500 homeruns. He wasn't one of the greatest players of his generation mind you even with those numbers.

McGwire is eligible next year and he was definitely juiced even though there is no proof of it. Hopefully the voters will think twice before letting him in on the first ballot. If these guys (Sosa, Bonds, Mac, Raf, and others) get voted in, they need to have an asterisk next to them connecting them to steroids. I have a feeling none of this will happen and they will be praised as guys who saved the game after the strike in 94.

Roger's record is broken by steroid pumping goons such as Mac, Sosa, and Bonds. However, Bonds will not break the Hank's record of 755 homers. Alex Rodriguez (like Ken Griffey Jr) is a pure, excellent athlete who has a good shot at breaking the record. He is clean and has an amazing work effort. Hopefully he won't get the injury bug like junior did and will be the one who breaks Aaron's record.

-Colby