1. DairyGuy

    DairyGuy New Member

    I've been reading alot of hype about the supplement CLA, improving simultaneous fat loss and muscle gain, and I'm thinking of giving it a go. However, I've noticed that in all the CLA supplements, the only ingredient is safflower oil. The retail price is around $20 for a moth's supply. Thus my question is, could I just buy some safflower oil ($7 for a half gallon) and take it instead? Thank you all.
     
  2. colby2152

    colby2152 New Member

    I see more benefit in the supplementation of EPA and DHA than Linoleic Acid.
     
  3. Aaron_F

    Aaron_F New Member

    CLA is not really plain jane linoleic acid

    and no, you cannot just buy safflower oil and use it, as the safflower oil used is not plain jane safflower oil, its isomerized bayyybe
     
  4. the_dark_master

    the_dark_master New Member

    Do "Moths" do HST? (come to think of it there are some mofo big antler moths, not so much the ol' carpet variety though)
     
  5. colby2152

    colby2152 New Member

    <div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">CLA is not really plain jane linoleic acid</div>

    Yeah, I saw that, but I still stand by my point.
     
  6. <div>
    (DairyGuy @ Sep. 23 2007,03:57)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I've been reading alot of hype about the supplement CLA, improving simultaneous fat loss and muscle gain, and I'm thinking of giving it a go.  However, I've noticed that in all the CLA supplements, the only ingredient is safflower oil.  The retail price is around $20 for a moth's supply.  Thus my question is, could I just buy some safflower oil ($7 for a half gallon) and take it instead?  Thank you all.</div>
    First you'd have to get some genetic therapy in order to turn into a rat. Then CLA would be AWESOME. If you want to hold on to your humanity, try getting obese, that's pretty much the single other population it works for. If you're neither a rat nor obese, save your money.
     
  7. TunnelRat

    TunnelRat Active Member

    <div>
    (Morgoth the Dark Enemy @ Sep. 26 2007,07:39)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">First you'd have to get some genetic therapy in order to turn into a rat.</div>
    Ouch...!
     
  8. DairyGuy

    DairyGuy New Member

    So, all the hype about CLA is really just nonsense. That's what I love about this forum, straight answers. And I wish I could do some genetic therapy, make them a bit more like Flex Wheeler's or Steve Reeve's. Thanks everyone.
     
  9. TunnelRat

    TunnelRat Active Member

    <div>
    (DairyGuy @ Sep. 26 2007,20:21)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">
    So, all the hype about CLA is really just nonsense.

    </div>
    Not quite, but plain ol' safflower oil is not gonna cut it...

    <div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">What Bryan uses

    I use (in order of priority):

    1) Protein powders
    2) Creatine
    3) EFAs (fish oil)
    4) 1/2 multi vit/mineral per day

    When I can afford it, I'll use:
    CLA</div>


    <div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">
    CLA can't exactly &quot;replace&quot; EPA as far as nutritional needs go. But it does do the same job on fat cells (through PPARs)

    It's going to take about 6-10 grams per day of CLA to notice any effect. If you use CLA while bulking it may help nutrient partitioning. CLA and Omega-3s should be taken &quot;all&quot; the time. They aren't supplements that you take every now and then. It has to be constant so that they can have time to change the environment within the body. This only happens as CLA are incorporated into fat cells. Unfortunately, the CLA is preferentially oxidized as it enters the liver, so you have to take enough to not only let the liver burn some, but also have enough to get into circulation and be deposited into fat cells.

    As with EFAs I suggest you take CLA with carbs (or after a meal). The rise in insulin may prevent the immediate oxidation of the CLA, and enhance the delivery of it to subcutaneous fat cells.

    The delivery of &quot;fat&quot; to fat cells may not seem like a good idea at first, but CLA and Omega-3s activate PPARs once in fat cells. This is good, and is what leads to the change in body composition over time.

    Regular use of CLA will change your &quot;tendency&quot; to gain and lose fat. It will basically make your fat cells act as if you had a genetic predisposition to leanness. The mechanism is pretty interesting.

    Here is a bit of info on CLA.

    CLA is a naturally occurring fatty acid found primarily in beef and dairy fats. The reason that it is found primarily in beef and dairy products is because CLA is formed from linoleic acid by bacteria in the gut of cows (or herbavors). The cows then absorb the CLA and it becomes incorporated into lipids in the cows, including milk lipids.


    How does it work?

    CLA increases fat oxidation.
    (West, D. B., J. P. DeLany, P. M. Camet, F. Blohm, A. A. Truett, and J. A. Scimeca. Effects of conjugated linoleic acid on body fat and energy metabolism in the mouse. Am. J. Physiol. 275 (Regulatory Integrative Comp. Physiol. 44): R667-R672, 1998)

    CLA has been shown to increase certain enzymes responsible for fatty acid beta-oxidation. This means that the body’s ability to burn fat goes up significantly with CLA supplementation.

    Inhibition of triglyceride uptake into fat cells.
    (Park, Y., K. J. Albright, W. Liu, J. M. Storkson, M. E. Cook, and M. W. Pariza. Effect of conjugated linoleic acid on body composition in mice. Lipids 32: 853-858, 1997)

    The best way to get fat is to send the fat you eat straight to the fat cell to be stored. This is generally what happens when we eat fat, however CLA supplementation has been shown to decrease the enzyme necessary for fat cells to take up fat and triglycerides from the blood. This fat is then more apt to be taken up by muscle tissue where it can be burned for fuel. In fact, CLA also increases the muscles ability to burn fat as fuel as mentioned previously.

    CLA increases insulin sensitivity
    (Houseknecht, K. L., J. P. Vanden Heuvel, S. Y. Moya-Camarena, C. P. Portocarrero, L. W. Peck, K. P. Nickel, and M. A. Belury. Dietary conjugated linoleic acid normalizes impaired glucose tolerance in the Zucker diabetic fatty fa/fa rat. Biochem. Biophys. Res. Commun. 244: 678-682, 1998)

    The reason CLA has been labeled a “partitioning agent” is because of its ability to shift the flow of nutrients away from fat tissue and towards muscle tissue. So you are starving the fat and feeding your muscle, the end result being an increase or maintenance of muscle and a reduction in fat.

    CLA acts to reduce body fat stores by chronically increasing metabolic rate.
    (West DB, Blohm FY, Truett AA, DeLany JP. Conjugated linoleic acid persistently increases total energy expenditure in AKR/J mice without increasing uncoupling protein gene expression. J Nutr. 2000 Oct;130(10):2471-7.)

    Treatment with CLA chronically increases basal metabolic rate. Over time this elevation leads to significant reductions in fat mass. The exact mechanism by which CLA raises energy expenditure has yet to be elucidated but could act through PPARs.</div>
     
  10. There's the minor aspect that Bryan wrote that quite a while ago. No recent, proper research shows anything worth writing home about CLA. Some study I've seen last year(although a bit older than that) showed that it generated abou 6lbs of fat-loss in about 18 months-I think that with some effort, one can achieve 6lbs of fatloss with a trip to the toilet.

    It's also been shown to do about jacksquat in lean individuals, and the dosages where it seems to do anything at all in humans are fairly cost-prohibitive. Beef and dairy have some small ammount of CLA, and those are far more fun to eat, not to mention far more useful in the long run.

    Bryan wrote what he did when he did(about 5 years ago if I'm not mistaken, maybe less), based on the research available then. Lyle advocated the use of some supplements(think Glutamine) in his ketogenic diet book, although they haven't panned out in the real world and he shuns them now. As human beings there's no way of peering into the future and seeing how something that's only being researched now will pan-out in the real world.
     
  11. Aaron_F

    Aaron_F New Member

    There is one piece of research with CLA and resistance training that showed a significantly increased gain in muscle mass, or soemthing like that, I am too lazy to find.

    Ruminant CLA is not the same as the most efficious isomer of CLA
     

Share This Page