Customizing HST

[Curt]

I have read some of the threads on customizing HST and I have skimmed through the HST e-book. I understand a lot of it, but some of the terminology went way over my head. I understand why all the scientific reasoning behind the program is included, however I think it's safe to say that we believe that there is sound scientific evidence behind the principles of HST. I'd like to have a few things clarified - maybe some other people who don't have a university degree in kinesiology or the time to read through hundreds of pages of material can make some use out of this thread as well.

Exercise Selection
Here are the exercises I have selected for my next cycle:
Deadlift
Leg Curl
Leg Extension
Bench
Lat Pull Down/Bent Over Rows
Seated Shoulder Press/Lateral Raises
Incline Bicep Curl/Barbell Curl
Skullcrushers/Close-grip Bench
Calf Raises

With the exercises separated by a slash, I alternate between them each workout. Do all my exercises increase stretch with load? For example, I used to do tricep pushdown instead of skullcrushers. Any other changes that should be made? Am I hitting each muscle group adequately? Also, how does the order of the exercises look?

Sets per exercise
What I've been doing is 2 sets for compounds in the 15s, and 1 set for isolation. 3 sets for compounds in the 10s, 2 for isolation and 4 & 3 sets for compounds and isolations respectively in the 5s. Is this too many sets when I get into the 5s?

Frequency
No questions, I'll be doing 5x a week, once a day... all I have time for.

Metabolic Stress Techniques
This is where I am the most confused.
1) Loaded stretches and static holds are very similar, so it's only necessary to do one of them, correct? I know your supposed to hold the weight at a "stretched" position for as long as possible, but how do I know what this position is? Also what weight should I be using?
2) I know that pulsing is using a very short range of motion, however at what position is the ROM? Would it just be where the muscle is most contracted?
3) What weight do I use with the drop sets? Should I just use the highest weight that I can do 10 additional reps with? I've read that drop sets aren't very effective. Are they worth the time?
4) Any other techniques that I'm missing?

Negatives
If I don't have a training partner should I just forget about the negatives?

Other Questions
1) I read in the HST e-book that a contracted position > stretched position and concentric movements > static >
eccentric movements. I interpreted this to mean that I should focus on the concentric movement (long concentric movements, short eccentric), and hold the weight in the contracted position. Is this correct?
2) When should I introduce the metabolic stress techniques? Should I just do my 15s, 10s, 5s, then add 2 weeks of post-5s using my 5RM and the metabolic stress techniques? Also, should I use all the techniques for every exercise?

Wow, that was a lot of questions. I don't expect anyone to answer them all, but I'd appreciate any help that can be given. I want to make sure I have everything correct for my next cycle.

 

[imported_dkm1987]

Quote[/b] (Curt @ May 30 2005,11:44)]

Exercises look fine, yes in a respect every contracted lengthening is a stretch, it is not necessary to do loaded stretches. Loaded stretches do help though. Everything else looks fine.

Your body will tell you if the number of sets is too much. If you start getting overuse strain or burnout then it might be, if not you are probably fine. If you do experience overuse strain or start getting burnt out, just reduce the number of sets (I would suggest isolations).

Metabolic, this is where it does get confusing with all the techniques available. To be simple and brief, during the last week of 10's and last week of 5's throughout the negs, add either Drops sets or high rep sets to induce the metabolic signal.

Drops can be effective if you have access to either selctorized equipment or become very adept at stripping weight off the bar, if there is too much time between the strip (drop) then the signalling isn't as adequate. This is why I recommend a simple set of about 60% of the work set, repping out til a burn is acheived.

Burn sets can be used for every exercise but I would only recommend using them on exercise you can get a burn with. It's very hard to get a burn in the back muscles but a good high rep set with rows can help.

To decrease the time (Reps) needed to get a burn going you can use a peak contraction hold or pulsing (use a 10 to 20 degree ROM).

Negatives, only do the exercises you can do them safely with, IE Neg Chins, BB Curls, One Legged Calf Raise, Flys. If you do not have a spotter avoid trying anything that can get you hurt.

I haven't read the e-book so I will wait for someone who has to confirm your questions about what it says.

But as far as concentric>static>eccentric, I feel it's a little amiss, without getting all scientific I feel it's more like eccentrics>concentric>static as far as microtrauma is concerned.

 

[imported_dkm1987]

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Quote[/b] (dkm1987 @ May 30 2005,7

9)]I haven't read the e-book so I will wait for someone who has to confirm your questions about what it says.

Wait a minute, are you talking about the E-Book by Ridgely or the Doc/PDF of Viscious' Customizing thread?
Tell you what read FAQ on
Drop Sets and High Rep sets
Rep Speed
Negatives/Eccentrics

 

[vicious]

Quote[/b] ]With the exercises separated by a slash, I alternate between them each workout. Do all my exercises increase stretch with load?

I probably wouldn't bother alternating (except the pull down and bent-over rows) with your isolation movements.
You need some form of leg press or squat movement. Much preferable over leg extensions.

Quote[/b] ]What I've been doing is 2 sets for compounds in the 15s, and 1 set for isolation. 3 sets for compounds in the 10s, 2 for isolation and 4 & 3 sets for compounds and isolations respectively in the 5s. Is this too many sets when I get into the 5s?

It's a little high given the frequency. I probably wouldn't do more than 2 proper work sets per exercise, especially if you want to add in the techniques.

Rule of thumb is to keep at least the same # of sets as the previous phase. If you feel you can do one more set for the next phase, then go for it. If you realize you can't, then just keep the same # of sets. Don't worry about fnishing your 2nd, 3rd and so on sets. Finally, don't do any isolation movements for the 15s, especially if you're doing the movements that increase stretch with load.

If you want to include lateral raises, perform them across your body.

Quote[/b] ]1) Loaded stretches and static holds are very similar, so it's only necessary to do one of them, correct? I know your supposed to hold the weight at a "stretched" position for as long as possible, but how do I know what this position is? Also what weight should I be using?

Try LS with stretch-point movements first. That is, try them at the bottom of the skullcrusher, incline curl near lockout, lateral raise across body, and calf raise below the block. Use the weight you're currently working with, and hold for at least 15-30 seconds until you feel the muscle starting to resist. Make sure not to overdo it. Start LSing at some point during 5s.

Quote[/b] ]2) I know that pulsing is using a very short range of motion, however at what position is the ROM? Would it just be where the muscle is most contracted?

Yes. And, in your case, you would do this with normal lateral raises, machine bicep curl, tricep pushdown, leg curls, leg extensions, and calf raises at the top of the movement. You choose a light weight, around the 15s-ish level, where 10-15 pulses would generate a good burn. Wait until 5s before doing this.

Quote[/b] ]3) What weight do I use with the drop sets? Should I just use the highest weight that I can do 10 additional reps with? I've read that drop sets aren't very effective. Are they worth the time?

You could just do your 15s set. Do the burn sets and pulses at the end of your routine, after the normal work sets and stretches. Wait until the 5s to add this in.

Quote[/b] ]If I don't have a training partner should I just forget about the negatives?

If you have access to dumbbells, you can perform unilateral negatives. Otherwise, don't sweat it -- just stick with your 5RM weight or try to find your new 5RM weight. Safety is most important.

Quote[/b] ]I interpreted this to mean that I should focus on the concentric movement (long concentric movements, short eccentric), and hold the weight in the contracted position. Is this correct?

I wouldn't worry about that. That's specifically for the pulses and creating burn.

Quote[/b] ]2) When should I introduce the metabolic stress techniques? Should I just do my 15s, 10s, 5s, then add 2 weeks of post-5s using my 5RM and the metabolic stress techniques? Also, should I use all the techniques for every exercise?

Here's the usual schedule:

15s -- Basic core movements
10s -- Core + Stretch-point isolation movements
5s/post-5s -- Above + LS + Metabolic Stress Techniques (including burn sets and pulses)

cheers,
Jules

 

[shakeel]

If you want to include lateral raises, perform them across your body

what do you mean by that?can you explain it?

 

[vicious]

Hmm, probably should lock this thread, since this thread has been moved to the General Training section.

Shakeel, I'll answer your question there.

cheers,
Jules

 

[Dood]

This is actually a different thread Jules, this is customizing for dummies

 

[vicious]

Ah, crap. You're right. Shaq ... look in that other section anyway for the answer, mm kay?

 

[Curt]

Quote[/b] ]I probably wouldn't bother alternating (except the pull down and bent-over rows) with your isolation movements.
You need some form of leg press or squat movement. Much preferable over leg extensions.

Alright, I'm replacing leg extensions with squats. The reason I was alternating is because I'm doing a 5x a week schedule, and since I can't lift huge amounts, it's difficult to increment every workout. I guess I'll just repeat weights. If I only do lateral raises for shoulders, won't my anterior deltoids lag behind?

Quote[/b] ]It's a little high given the frequency. I probably wouldn't do more than 2 proper work sets per exercise, especially if you want to add in the techniques.
Rule of thumb is to keep at least the same # of sets as the previous phase. If you feel you can do one more set for the next phase, then go for it. If you realize you can't, then just keep the same # of sets. Don't worry about fnishing your 2nd, 3rd and so on sets.

So it's ok to do the same number of sets for isolation and compound? How does 1 set for 15s and 2 for 10s and 5s sound?

Quote[/b] ] lateral raise across body, and calf raise below the block.

What do you mean by this?

Quote[/b] ]Yes. And, in your case, you would do this with normal lateral raises, machine bicep curl, tricep pushdown, leg curls, leg extensions, and calf raises at the top of the movement. You choose a light weight, around the 15s-ish level, where 10-15 pulses would generate a good burn. Wait until 5s before doing this.

Pulsing is better with machine bicep curl and tri pushdown than with incl. bicep curls and skullcrushers? Should I do both during the 5s? If I'm switching leg ext. out of my workout, should I still use them for pulsing?

Quote[/b] ]You could just do your 15s set. Do the burn sets and pulses at the end of your routine, after the normal work sets and stretches. Wait until the 5s to add this in.

I do my core and stretch sets first... then what exercises do I do burn sets with? I really want to hit my arms this cycle.

Quote[/b] ]If you have access to dumbbells, you can perform unilateral negatives. Otherwise, don't sweat it -- just stick with your 5RM weight or try to find your new 5RM weight. Safety is most important.

Yes, I have access to dumbells. Unilateral means with one side, so I can use my other side to support it, right? What exercises can I do unilateral negs with? Also, I'm not sure exactly how to do negs

(The FAQ says to do 1-2 concentric reps and 3-4 eccentric.. how do I do a eccentric without doing a concentric rep!?)

So at what point during the 5s should I start using the techniques (I'm doing 4 weeks of 5s)? Do you think hitting the biceps during the 5s with the regular set, LS, drop set, and pulsing would be too taxing on the muscle? Or is that the point?

So my workout during the 5s using techniques would look like this?:
Deadlift - 2 sets
Squat - 2 sets
Bench - 2 sets
Lat Pull Down/Bent Over Rows - 2 sets
Leg Curl - 2 sets, Pulsing
Lateral Raises - 2 sets, LS, Burn Set
Incline Bicep Curl - 2 sets, LS, Burn Set
Machine Bicep Curl - Pulsing
Skullcrushers - 2 sets, LS, Burn Set
Tricep Pushdown - Pulsing
Calf Raises - 2 sets, LS, Pulsing

Seems like a lot, anything I should cut out/add? Am I using burn sets with the proper exercises?

Sorry if all these questions are annoying... I'm probably paying more attention to detail than necessary, but I want to make sure I have everything right.

Thanks alot dkm and vicious for your responses, you guys really know your stuff.

I'd appreciate any more help you can provide.

 

[Curt]

During my 15s, if I'm only doing basic core lifts, and only one set of each, my workouts will be VERY short. I have to take public transport to get to the gym, which takes a lot of time, not to mention the cost adds up. I've read the benefits of 15s are debatable.. It hardly seems worth it.. can I cut 15s out or should I just suck it up and go to the gym anyway?

 

[Curt]

Bump... is it alright if I do 3-4x a week for 15s then increase the frequency to 5x a week for 10s and 5s?

 

[kfd]

I think it's fine.

 

[vicious]

Quote[/b] ]The reason I was alternating is because I'm doing a 5x a week schedule, and since I can't lift huge amounts, it's difficult to increment every workout.

On a high frequency routine, you actually increment every other workout. For certain movements, you may only do 2 or 3 increments per 2 weeks.

Quote[/b] ]If I only do lateral raises for shoulders, won't my anterior deltoids lag behind?

Keep in in mind that the anterior delt is a tiny muscle. Heavy pressing movements in an incline or shoulder angle will do plenty.

Quote[/b] ]So it's ok to do the same number of sets for isolation and compound? How does 1 set for 15s and 2 for 10s and 5s sound?

Sounds good. If you find the sets too easy, you can always increase as you go through your cycle. Basically, the idea goes that you don't ever decrease the # of sets as you progress through the cycle. Thus, if you add another set, that becomes your new minimum for the rest of the cycle.

Quote[/b] ]What do you mean by this?

Lyings lateral raise is an example of lateral raises performed across the body. You can do a search on exrx. Also, you can do horizontal-ish cable laterals but across the body.
Calf raises should be done on a block or raised platform. When you lower, the heel should go below the platform or the block. While doing this, the toes should be curled in.

Quote[/b] ]Pulsing is better with machine bicep curl and tri pushdown than with incl. bicep curls and skullcrushers? Should I do both during the 5s? If I'm switching leg ext. out of my workout, should I still use them for pulsing?

Pulse is better with machines because the direction of resistance is correct at peak contraction (where the burn is worst.) Leg extension is great/ungodly for pulsing.

Quote[/b] ]I do my core and stretch sets first... then what exercises do I do burn sets with? I really want to hit my arms this cycle

You perform 15-rep burn sets with the compound movements. It's up to you how many compound movements you want to "burn", but ideally it would be at least one movement per major bodypart. If you want to emphasize arms, then in addition, you perform pulses with machine bicep curls, tricep pushdowns, and (very optionally) machine lateral raises. Basically, set the arms on fire.
Note: the more metabolic stress you add, the more calories you need to eat. The post-WO carb intake needs to be very, very aggressive. It's not unreasonable to chug down 800-1000 calories of carbs alone within the 2-4 hour window.

Quote[/b] ]Yes, I have access to dumbells. Unilateral means with one side, so I can use my other side to support it, right? What exercises can I do unilateral negs with? Also, I'm not sure exactly how to do negs

You use both sides to raise, one side to lower. Basically, any movement you can do this with are candidates for negatives. Obviously deadlifts and squats are not a candidate for negatives.

Quote[/b] ]Seems like a lot, anything I should cut out/add? Am I using burn sets with the proper exercises?

1) You burn set with compound movements, NOT the stretch point movements.
2) For now, shoot for just one set with the stretch point movements (skullcrushers, bicepcurl, etc.)

Quote[/b] ]It hardly seems worth it.. can I cut 15s out or should I just suck it up and go to the gym anyway?

Leave 15s in and use this as a time to increase on carb intake. This will help with your results later on. High frequency is hard on the joints. But go 3-4x-a-week if time isn't permitting.

BTW, you gotta eat big on high frequency. A lot. A whole lot. Don't be afraid to have that pizza!

cheers,
Jules

 

[Curt]

Quote[/b] ]Keep in in mind that the anterior delt is a tiny muscle. Heavy pressing movements in an incline or shoulder angle will do plenty.

Do you think I should switch my flat bench to incline? I've read that flat bench is more of an ego exercise than anything, but I've already started the flat bench for 15s. Would it be alright to do incline for 10s and 5s? Also, is there any way to estimate incline based on your flat bench?

Again, when should I start adding metabolic stress techniques during the 5s if my schedule looks like this:
2 wks 15s - Core
2 wks 10s - Core + Specialization
2 wks 5s - Core + Specialization + Metabolic Stress Techniques
2 wks Negatives
Do I just add them in as I feel it's appropriate?

During the negatives do I also metabolic stress techniques? Do I just keep adding weight as I normally would each workout until I can no longer control the weight?

I've been reading about clustering, and from what I understand it's just dividing your total number of reps into smaller sets, but using the same original weight (right?). I haven't been doing clustering during the 15s, so can I do it for the 10s and 5s or should I just save it for my next cycle? Also, do I combine it with the other metabolic techniques?

Quote[/b] ]Note: the more metabolic stress you add, the more calories you need to eat. The post-WO carb intake needs to be very, very aggressive. It's not unreasonable to chug down 800-1000 calories of carbs alone within the 2-4 hour window.

That's been my main shortcoming since starting HST.. I've been eating very clean, but not nearly enough. So should I just focus on eating as many calories as possible, and not worry as much as to where they're coming from?

Again, thanks a lot for your help!

 

[imported_dkm1987]

Quote[/b] (Curt @ June 17 2005,10:16)]Again, when should I start adding metabolic stress techniques

During the negatives do I also metabolic stress techniques?

I've been reading about clustering, and from what I understand it's just dividing your total number of reps into smaller sets, but using the same original weight (right?).

In the late 10RMs or early 5's

Yes

Not right, clustering only helps if you are using beyond your RM or with very high volume, as a way to manage fatique, lift heavier or keep TUT the same throughout the cycle.

If this is your first go around with HST I would recommend, not clustering, keeping it simple and give yourself some time to undestand how and why your body is responding to HST. After you get this down then, if needed, start adding some of the techniques that Vicious has told you about to compliment your HST cycles.

 

[Old and Grey]

My own experience, which may not be typical, is that clustering results in more fatigue and not much else unless you happen to be a highly trained assisted lifter. Clustering seems to belong more with EDT than HST. In fact, I don't think it has anything to do with HST at all and changes a great program to a mediocre program, at best. I wouldn't advise anyone to do it who doesn't have at least 5 years of experience under his belt. And even then, I would say to use clustering only with machines as the opportunity for injury is high, unless you take quite a bit of time between sets. I would rather see someone fail on a machine than a freeweight. Clustering is to HST as mercury is to fish!  

 

 

 

 

 

Incominggggg!    

 

[Curt]

Alright I have just a few more questions.

If I did flat bench for the 15s, can I switch to incline for the 10s and 5s? Is there any way to estimate your incline max based on your flat bench max?

Can I do squats and deadlifts in the same workout? I did this during the 15s to no ill-effect. Also, I don't really want to hit the glutes too hard

I got lateral raises mixed up with upright row. Is upright row as effective for the lateral deltoids as lateral raises, and I can I perform loaded stretches and pulsing with upright row? If so, how?

 

[vicious]

Quote[/b] ]If I did flat bench for the 15s, can I switch to incline for the 10s and 5s? Is there any way to estimate your incline max based on your flat bench max?

Incline is usually "pretty" close to the flat bench. Probably one or two increments less than flat. Though it does beg the question as to why you want to switch midroutine.

Quote[/b] ]Can I do squats and deadlifts in the same workout? I did this during the 15s to no ill-effect. Also, I don't really want to hit the glutes too hard

Sure, but IMO it's tough to do both together. My advice is to alternate the order between squats and deads session to session, and cluster whatever movement you're doing 2nd. Key thing really is to make sure you don't sacrifice your form, which is often the case when people try to do both in the same session.

Quote[/b] ]I got lateral raises mixed up with upright row. Is upright row as effective for the lateral deltoids as lateral raises, and I can I perform loaded stretches and pulsing with upright row? If so, how?

Lateral raises, the traditional lateral raise that is, are not a very good developer for the delts. Lateral raises across the body (such as lying lateral raises), however, works pretty well. I would use traditional lateral raises for pulsing.

Oh, I would never pulse with upright row. It's too dangerous. Basically, you want to avoid using ROM above your waistline in order to prevent that cuff rotation. Besides, working above your waist doesn't that much for microtrauma. The LS with upright row is to simply hold the weight behind your back, lean a little forward, and hold at full stretch. I imagine you can do partials this way, if you wish, but I feel the movement is a touch awkward that way.

cheers,
Jules

 

[Curt]

Quote[/b] ]I would use traditional lateral raises for pulsing.

At what part of the ROM do you pulse for lateral raises? At the top?

Quote[/b] ]Oh, I would never pulse with upright row. It's too dangerous. Basically, you want to avoid using ROM above your waistline in order to prevent that cuff rotation. Besides, working above your waist doesn't that much for microtrauma. The LS with upright row is to simply hold the weight behind your back, lean a little forward, and hold at full stretch. I imagine you can do partials this way, if you wish, but I feel the movement is a touch awkward that way.

So for the LS the bar is being held behind my back and I let the weight hang down below my waist so I feel a stretch?
I've felt some pain in my left shoulder while doing benches, so my shoulders might be susceptible to injury. I guess I should cut out upright rows after this cycle.