Is HST good for newbie
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Bulldog
Active Member
I would recommend a 5x5 or Rippetoe's Starting Strength routine because you will develop more strength quicker that way.
http://www.amazon.com/Starting-Stre...=1398085383&sr=1-1&keywords=starting+strength
http://www.amazon.com/Starting-Stre...=1398085383&sr=1-1&keywords=starting+strength
TangoDown
Member
Due to the intervals required, I'd assume that HST would put some of your starting weights very low (especially in the 15s). You could do it but I don't think it'd be optimal.
Your primary goal should be to get used to the core lifts of strength training: squat, deadlift, bench, and row, and take full advantage of the neural adaptation that is going to rapidly occur.
So like Bulldog said, 5x5 or SS would be best. I have a friend who took the vanilla 5x5 program through about a year and he went from squatting the bar to squatting 280lb x 3.
IMO, do SS first and read Rippetoe's book or at least read the FAQs on his website.
Your primary goal should be to get used to the core lifts of strength training: squat, deadlift, bench, and row, and take full advantage of the neural adaptation that is going to rapidly occur.
So like Bulldog said, 5x5 or SS would be best. I have a friend who took the vanilla 5x5 program through about a year and he went from squatting the bar to squatting 280lb x 3.
IMO, do SS first and read Rippetoe's book or at least read the FAQs on his website.
adpowah
Active Member
I don't necessarily disagree with the above, but I chose to start with HST and made some good strength and size gains. I may have done better using one of the more strength based programs but you will still grow in size and strength on HST and it teaches you some basics in programming (standard deconditioning, using higher reps for recovery and when to use them in your cycle, etc) that will carry over to other programs you may use in the future. One thing I appreciate with HST is that it is a concept that you can employ for your entire lifting career even if your goals change.
Bulldog
Active Member
^^^ This is really all that needs to be said. After thinking about it a bit more I really shouldn't have even recommended a 5x5 for a beginner. It doesn't need to be that complicated and it is inappropriate for someone just starting out anyhow.
Read up on Rippetoe's Starting Strength. Buy the book and learn to perform the lifts properly BEFORE you get strong. A couple years from now you will be glad you did.
TangoDown
Member
5x5 and SS are essentially the same program, no? SS is just 3x5 and has cleans in it.
Don't think 5 sets is really necessary for a beginner though. Sort of overkill.
Any 3x5 or 5x5 with cleans is for athletes (explosiveness - cleans, slightly lower volume).
5x5 is pure hypertrophy and grind-it-out strength focus.
Personally, I'd keep it really simple and do this:
M & F:
3x5 Squat
3x5 Bench
3x5 Rows
3x5 OHP
W:
Same but add in:
1x5 Deadlift
5x5 is too much volume IMO. The difference in volume has been proven not to give more hypertrophy (3 sets vs 5).
Do that for 6-12 months, then move onto HST.
5x5 is pure hypertrophy and grind-it-out strength focus.
Personally, I'd keep it really simple and do this:
M & F:
3x5 Squat
3x5 Bench
3x5 Rows
3x5 OHP
W:
Same but add in:
1x5 Deadlift
5x5 is too much volume IMO. The difference in volume has been proven not to give more hypertrophy (3 sets vs 5).
Do that for 6-12 months, then move onto HST.
HST_Rihad
Active Member
If your goal is bodybuilding, or looking good with visible muscle separation etc, before even thinking of building new muscle you should lean down to a starting level of no more than 12% bf, better yet 10%. And no matter what you do then, don't fall into the trap of gaining body weight at a fast rate (the so called "bulking"), because more often than not it's nothing more than lying to yourself about the progress you're making. Of course you should be eating enough for muscle to grow, but do so by constantly checking the amount of fat you're gaining. An easy check would be being able to see at least the upper two rows of your abs while eating for growth. If your goal is getting stronger and not looking good, then please disregard this post.
mickc1965
Well-Known Member
Looks like I will set up my 16 year old son with this routine, just need to get him squatting correctly
The good thing about the extra sets is that it's great form practice for beginners. Especially a program like Madcow 5x5 where the sets ramp up (it has 3 warmup sets basically) and if the routine is set up correctly, the lifter stays far away from failure for many weeks which further helps with technique.
IMO, have him squat light, say 50% RM or even less. This way it's easier to concentrate on the movement part instead of just "trying to get the weight up". He has his whole life to get strong might as well have him learn it correctly from the get go.
mickc1965
Well-Known Member
IMO, have him squat light, say 50% RM or even less. This way it's easier to concentrate on the movement part instead of just "trying to get the weight up". He has his whole life to get strong might as well have him learn it correctly from the get go.
I have got him just squatting with bar atm so he gets form correct before progressing
Proper warm ups will do this. Every warm up set should be done using the same form as is intended for work sets. The extra volume just doesn't add anything in terms of hypertrophy, according to pretty much every study there is. Not without some gear, and at 16, obv. No gear required.
@mick - get him onto loads ASAP, IMO. Once he has the form for bar-only down pay , his strength gains will necessitate load to maintain form. And feed him like crazy!
My philosophy is to keep it simple. Don't add any exercise to your routine until you have the basic movements well drilled: back squat, deadlift, press, bench press, bent-over row, chin, dip. Then you can get into more ancillary lifts or more technical lifts.
Whatever form of programming you decide to use, you want to be lifting as efficiently as possible and you want your form to be consistent.
This is not a quick thing. It will take months to really find out what works best for you as there are many variables to play with, plus you have your very own anthropometry to learn about and flexibility to develop.
There are many variations on the basic power lifts that you can try once you have more experience. Eg. High-bar back squat, low-bar back squat, front squat, hack squat, Bulgarian split squat, sissy squat etc. Then there are ROM considerations. Your mobility and flexibility will dictate your form to some extent. If your mobility is limiting your ROM or your ability to assume correct positions, you will need to work on this also.
To get the best out of any routine, including HST, you have to have these things sorted to some extent. However, they will always be a work-in-progress so don't feel you have to have everything just right.
As has already been mentioned, you could do a lot worse than getting hold of a copy of Rippetoe's Starting Strength and swatting it up. Its a good place to start.
Whatever form of programming you decide to use, you want to be lifting as efficiently as possible and you want your form to be consistent.
This is not a quick thing. It will take months to really find out what works best for you as there are many variables to play with, plus you have your very own anthropometry to learn about and flexibility to develop.
There are many variations on the basic power lifts that you can try once you have more experience. Eg. High-bar back squat, low-bar back squat, front squat, hack squat, Bulgarian split squat, sissy squat etc. Then there are ROM considerations. Your mobility and flexibility will dictate your form to some extent. If your mobility is limiting your ROM or your ability to assume correct positions, you will need to work on this also.
To get the best out of any routine, including HST, you have to have these things sorted to some extent. However, they will always be a work-in-progress so don't feel you have to have everything just right.
As has already been mentioned, you could do a lot worse than getting hold of a copy of Rippetoe's Starting Strength and swatting it up. Its a good place to start.