P/C/F and Kcal per Lb ratios

psychonaut

New Member
Im just starting to take dieting seriously and learning (finally!)the importance of caloric intake and P/C/F breakdown. Theres a couple of things ive had trouble getting my head round;

It seems that a lot of Bodybuilers have a preffered P/C/F that they keep the same throughout the dieting cycle, Is this always advisable?

If someone has excessive body fat would it make sense to subtract the fat from their total weight before working out their caloric intake?

Finally, when on an SD is it ok to drop calories below your usual cutting ratio or would you risk losing muscle unnecessarily?
 
Dear psychonaut,

There are two protocols really, for bulking or dieting.
When bulking, protein is kept at about 15% of calories with carbs forming the bulk of the remainder of calories. Fat should be about 20% of calories.

When dieting, protein can increase up to 30% of calories (although some would take this to an extreme depending on the diet protocol). An increase in protein intake has an increased in metabolic cost for processing and ridding the excess protein.

Thus, bodybuilders should not have the same ratios all year round. Their bulking cycles should be matched with an appropriate bulking diet, and their cutting cycles should also be matched with an appropriate cutting diet.

For more information on macronutrient ratios, have a read at the FAQS. More information can be found there :)

2. If someone has excessive body fat would it make sense to subtract the fat from their total weight before working out their caloric intake?

>>> This might be a good idea, but it could mean too drastic a cut in calories and this can have an immune-shocking effect to the body. Cut calories gradually, and keep a log of it. Drop 200 calories per day for the first week. See what happens. Then drop another 200 calories per day for the next week and see what happens. Weight-loss should be no more than a kilo (two pounds) per week. Any faster than that and you'd risk losing muscle. I've heard of miracles occuring from protein-sparing modified fasts but those are painful and near insane to follow. It needs to be doctor-supervised anyway.

Losing fat ultimately means being in calorie deficit. This can occur via elimination of protein, carbs or fat from the diet. Because of its caloric density, it is easier to cut calories by cutting fat. Going fat-free isn't the best way to go, since you need EFAs all the time. And thus, it would be better to enhance thermogenesis, and at the same time go into calorie deficit by cutting some carbs. Nothing drastic though. The other side of the cutting-coin would be to increase activity.

3. Finally, when on an SD is it ok to drop calories below your usual cutting ratio or would you risk losing muscle unnecessarily?

>>> During SD, go on maintenance calories and keep the ratio favourable to cutting. Because no training is carried out, some actually engage in a low-carb diet during SD. If calorie balance is kept in check, this is probably unnecessary, depending on your body-type, and sensitivity to insulin. Are you the sort of person who gains weight just by the smell of food? Or are you the type who can eat like a horse yet not gain an ounce of weight? Unfortunately, most weight-loss conundrums arise from the former, and I dare say that people of this category are less insulin sensitive than their skinny counterparts. For such cases, maintaining a cutting ratio at maintenance calories but low-carb might be a good idea.

Godspeed, and happy HSTing :)
 
thanks a lot for the replies, ive been reading up on this all weekend. Not sure how i missed that FAQ
blush.gif
answers my question about fat, even got its own acronyn.

I think ill start with 11Kcal per Lb for my cut. im 170lb, 17-19% fat atm, i thought i had a fairly high metabolism but perhaps at 25 im starting the slide downhill. Ive worked out a PCF breakdown of 36 / 38 / 25 (25% fat, 1gram Protein per lb, remainder carbs)

4 quick ones;

- Ive been off weights for about 12 days now and suspect i was eating quite poorly (not enough) - now im getting nagging 'weak' muscular sensations. Could it just be from inactivity?

- I avoid sugars anyway, but drink a lot of milk - should the sugars be counted as carbs? If i rest / go to sleep immediately then they'll surely turn straight into fat anyway right?

- Should i be taking fast carbs immediately pre-workout and not recording them (as they get burnt straight away)?

- Im short of fat intake - is it safe to eat large amounts of (freshly ground) flax seed? I ask because i notice fish oils also contain high EFAs and have a lot of Vit A and D, which presents an overdose danger.


thanks again :)
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Ive been off weights for about 12 days now and suspect i was eating quite poorly (not enough) - now im getting nagging 'weak' muscular sensations. Could it just be from inactivity?

Maybe, but I wouldn't worry about it.


[b said:
Quote[/b] ]- I avoid sugars anyway, but drink a lot of milk - should the sugars be counted as carbs?

Yes.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]If i rest / go to sleep immediately then they'll surely turn straight into fat anyway right?

Um, why would they do that? Despite what muscle mags and John Berardi would have you believe, there's no magic about eating certain foods at certain times. Eating carbs at night or whenever isn't going to make you fat. It's calories in versus calories out. That's what matters.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]- Should i be taking fast carbs immediately pre-workout and not recording them (as they get burnt straight away)?

Again, calories in versus calories out. If you eat it, count it.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Im short of fat intake - is it safe to eat large amounts of (freshly ground) flax seed?

Yes.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]I ask because i notice fish oils also contain high EFAs and have a lot of Vit A and D, which presents an overdose danger.

It presents an overdose danger only if you're eating retardedly high amounts.
 
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