Single Set Training

Discussion in 'Basic Training Principles and Methods' started by DairyGuy, Jul 30, 2009.

  1. DairyGuy

    DairyGuy New Member

    I, personally, have never been into single set training, but I found this article an thought it looked interesting. I'd love to hear some thoughts on this.

    www.cbass.com/NEWEVIDE.HTM
     
  2. Lol

    Lol Super Moderator Staff Member

  3. RUSS

    RUSS Member

    Thanks to both Diaryguy and LOL for some interesting and thought provoking material.

                  At this point in my lifting journey I am quite convinced that if I was to go for an all out hypertrophy focus I would be able to put the most passion and focus into one all out top set after warm-ups as this satisfies something in my personality (or temperament as I call it when discussing lifting) that multiple med-high rep sets doesn't .
                 I am not  a "bodybuilder" but a "strength chaser" that has had "brief affairs" with hypertrophy that left me unsatisfied and inevitably dropping reps and increasing sets to get my "fix". So the idea of warming up and pulling out all the stops for that one set (probably over multiple angles/movements if hypertrophy WAS the focus) has an undeniable appeal to me.
                 I am just as convinced that some/many others that may get THEIR "fix" in the "battle" for rep number 10,11, and 12 of set # 3 , would perhaps hate single set training and thereby not thrive or even be able to sustain progress before mental stagnation/de-motivation set in.
                  I'm content with what I'm doing training wise now and not looking to change my focus or my methods (beyond the endless and obsessive "tweaking") but it is a fascinating subject nonetheless.
                  I apologize in advance if I'm rambling (it's been a long day)- and now back to your regularly scheduled programming... [​IMG]
     
  4. quadancer

    quadancer New Member

    Count out us older lifters...we allready suffer from Jointicide.
     
  5. ryolacap

    ryolacap Member

    All comes down to how many actual reps it takes to initiate a response, compared to how many your body needs.  Single sets can provide most with some stimulus, and the body can only handle so much at a time. Personaly I have always considered Sets an abstract idea and reps a concrete idea. Sets are only rest between reps, it just happen to be a little longer than the rest that must be taken between every rep. In retrospect.  I think a single set with little micro sets (myo-reps) is a great way to train.  Seems to make a lot of sense to me to reduce the amount of wasted reps, and the system can be integrated straight into all the other 'rules' to HST.  If the theory is correct one set with myo reps at the end, essentially 2 sets I guess) could have as much activation as multiple sets as in the range of 3-5 without the wasted energy that tends to reduce the effectiveness of multiple sets

    I am loving so far, here is how I set it up
    With the rules to HST; Below max weight, progression, frequency, mild volume with a high total weekly volume.
    12 +12 (4-3-3-2)
    10 +10 (3-3-2-2)
    8 +8 (3-2-2-1)
    6 +6 (2-2-1-1)
    4 +4 (1-1-1-1)
    ..or close to this
     
  6. quadancer

    quadancer New Member

    I think conditioning plays a large part in this. We mistakenly started myoreps with 100% of the 10rm...so today for fun I dropped to 80% and tried a set:
    NOT activated. I just can't see it. But we're on a strength cycle too, and that may be part of the reason I just couldn't feel it, didn't get a good pump, burn, or feeling for it. I also could rep more than 3-4 on every set if I'd wanted.

    If you're doing the double activation sets, aren't you just repping a lot without activation? I like the myo's for the efficiency, and I suspect that your TUT is improved also due to not wasting any energy trying to get activation.
     
  7. ryolacap

    ryolacap Member

    <div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">NOT activated. I just can't see it. But we're on a strength cycle too, and that may be part of the reason I just couldn't feel it, didn't get a good pump, burn, or feeling for it. </div>  

    Well if you are going for 'activation' aka fatigue, perhaps you are repping to quickly.  A little longer TUT might help get you there with sub maximal weight.  Use really s-l-o-w reps then use fast myo reps.

    This is an HST forum, which means you *MUST* believe gains can be generated with sub maximal weight, (J/K you don’t have to believe that if you don't want) any time I did a HST cycle 90-95% of the time I can rep out more than I actually do, it seems to be the way the system is set up.  Which is the reason I like MR, I can slow down the activation set then do the MR set (or sets, however it goes) and know I am doing some reps that are generating a response.  It's all about irritating the cell after all.
     
  8. leegee38

    leegee38 Member

    <div>
    (quadancer @ Jul. 31 2009,7:57)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I think conditioning plays a large part in this. We mistakenly started myoreps with 100% of the 10rm...so today for fun I dropped to 80% and tried a set:
    NOT activated. I just can't see it. But we're on a strength cycle too, and that may be part of the reason I just couldn't feel it, didn't get a good pump, burn, or feeling for it. I also could rep more than 3-4 on every set if I'd wanted.

    If you're doing the double activation sets, aren't you just repping a lot without activation? I like the myo's for the efficiency, and I suspect that your TUT is improved also due to not wasting any energy trying to get activation.</div>
    Quad, the whole point of the &quot;activation&quot; set is to train close to failure so that you insure all fibers are activated. There have been studies recently that show even a 30 rep RM can be effective as long as it is to failure. In theory as long as you can't do more than 6 reps on the following RP sets then all reps should probably be a full activation. So, if you are using 80% of your 10 RM for the activation set chances are should get somewhere around 12-15 reps with that set. Did you just stop at 10?
     
  9. quadancer

    quadancer New Member

    Actually, I did, but the subsequent sets didn't really get anything going either.
    I've also read and understood the MR principles, read and understood the HST principles (long ago) and we do know that if you're say, in your 5's, your 15's aren't gonna do you a lot of good, and that was like going backwards.
    Perhaps it's just where I am in my program, but 100% seemed about perfect. next, it's time for 105% or another ten lbs or so.
    I don't recall reading anything about going beyond 11 reps for the activation set, unless I missed it. I did sorta speed read most of it.
     
  10. CoolColJ

    CoolColJ New Member

    your supposed to stop 1-2 reps from failure. leaving more is way too much

    for example I left my dip belt at home, and I did 35 reps on dig shrugs before doing a 35+3+2 on my a myo-rep set [​IMG]
    Worked just as well, those 3 and 2 rep mini-sets felt like a 90% effort level lift!
    I started at 12+3+3+2+2 on that exercise with just bodyweight for example and then dropped to 20+3+2 and now ended to at 35+3+2!

    Evidently I got a lot stronger in those 2 months....
     
  11. ryolacap

    ryolacap Member

    I am wondering , if doing a 1 set program how many days a week could you work out. Say 2 full body (6 exercises) workouts rotating 5 days a week or 3. I would like to do it 5 but dont now if it is too much.
     
  12. CoolColJ

    CoolColJ New Member

    if your not getting stronger every workout, it's too frequent IMO [​IMG]
    And you'll find as you get stronger you can't train as frequently

    but no more than every 5 days
     
  13. DairyGuy

    DairyGuy New Member

    Reading the above articles, I can't help but wonder what would happen in you took a program like Smolov, in the base mesocycle, and instead of doing multiple sets and just did single sets. For example, on day 3, instead of squatting 7 sets of 5 with 80% of your 1RM, just do one set. According to those studies cited, it should work just as well, if not better. It would definately make Smolov less daunting.
     
  14. quadancer

    quadancer New Member

    <div>
    (ryolacap @ Aug. 04 2009,4:58)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I am wondering , if doing a 1 set program how many days a week could you work out.  Say 2 full body (6 exercises) workouts rotating 5 days a week or 3.  I would like to do it 5 but dont now if it is too much.</div>
    I did a 7 exersize program on a 6-7 day rotation, and all it seemed to do for me was maintenance. I was working daily as a carpenter though, and that may have something to do with the failure of the program.

    Cool: what is a dig shrug?
     
  15. ryolacap

    ryolacap Member

    <div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I am wondering , if doing a 1 set program how many days a week could you work out.  Say 2 full body (6 exercises) workouts rotating 5 days a week or 3.  I would like to do it 5 but dont now if it is too much.</div>

    Let me state that better, I mean an A &amp; B workout (Myo-Reps) 1 set + Myo-Reps, 6 exercises, fullbody, Progressive load HST style with rep ranges 12+12,10+10,8+8,6+6,4+4

    Mon A
    Tue B
    Wen A
    Thr B
    Fri A
    Mon B

    Or...

    Mon A
    Tue
    Wen B
    Thr
    Fri A
    Mon B
     
  16. CoolColJ

    CoolColJ New Member

    <div>
    (quadancer @ Aug. 04 2009,8:34)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Cool: what is a dig shrug?</div>
    whoops typo

    dip shrug [​IMG]
     
  17. CoolColJ

    CoolColJ New Member

    <div>
    (ryolacap @ Aug. 04 2009,8:55)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"> <div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I am wondering , if doing a 1 set program how many days a week could you work out.  Say 2 full body (6 exercises) workouts rotating 5 days a week or 3.  I would like to do it 5 but dont now if it is too much.</div>

    Let me state that better, I mean an A &amp; B workout (Myo-Reps) 1 set + Myo-Reps, 6 exercises, fullbody, Progressive load HST style with rep ranges 12+12,10+10,8+8,6+6,4+4

    Mon A
    Tue B
    Wen A
    Thr B
    Fri A
    Mon B

    Or...

    Mon A
    Tue
    Wen B
    Thr
    Fri A
    Mon B</div>
    I would try and insert a rest day inbetween every A+B cycle, because you will have system CNS fatigue as well, not just local muscular

    so 2nd  setup would be better
    but trying to follow a 7 day week setup isn't always the best way to do it

    for example when I train every 3+4 day for a 7 day cycle, there is no difference in gains to every 4+5 day for a 9 day cycle, but I start to fall apart doing the former after 2 weeks.
     
  18. ryolacap

    ryolacap Member

    I guess what I am getting at is, CNS fatigue might be limited enough in 1 set training to do even more frequency. I only say this because I noticed many do multiple sets with HST (2-3) With 1 se and limited exercises you could go everyday, with weekends off to recuperate.

    I don't know, the principles of HST seem sound but just seems here is something a little off with the program.
     
  19. CoolColJ

    CoolColJ New Member

    if your weak, yes you can get away with it. Not if your stronger though

    Myo-reps is equivalent to hard set of 5x5 when done like 300x8+3+3+2+2
    in terms of effective reps, maybe more, because I never got gains like I did with with Myo-reps when doing 5x5
     
  20. RUSS

    RUSS Member

    I would assume that if one were to do single set training that they would probably expand the number of movements per muscle group as opposed to a lifter doing a 5x5 on&quot;just&quot; flat bench our &quot;single set guy&quot; would most likely be doing Flat,incline, perhaps decline etc. resulting in some what similar volume, just spread over more
    movements.

    &quot;our single set guy&quot; MIGHT actually be doing MORE volume if you add to the equation the additional and more extensive warm ups that a single higher intensity set would necessitate (depending on how he were to go about this). Of course where on the percentage of 1rm spectrum this additional volume would be concentrated and what benefit this would bring would again depend entirely on the routine programming and not the method itself.IMHO of course. [​IMG]
     

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