Testosterone Replacement Therapy (TRT)

Discussion in 'Anything and Everything about dietary supplements' started by Calkid, Aug 11, 2004.

  1. Calkid

    Calkid New Member

    Let's talk about it here instead of going off-topic on the other thread.

    Here's an unbelievable resource I've found for info on TRT:

    http://www.sculptedbyiron.com/forum/forumdisplay.php3?&forumid=8

    It's moderated and has many informative posts from Dr. John Crisler, a pioneer of TRT and founder of allthingsmale.com

    Read the post "TRT: A Recipe for Success"
     
  2. Calkid

    Calkid New Member

    Okay, I got test results back. This is so weird.

    Serum testosterone: 599 ng/dl, which is towards the upper-middle of normal range.

    Thyroid all normal. Other tests pending.

    wtf? I mean, I guess it isn't that surprising that at age 20 my jewels are working the way they're supposed to. But what is surprising is that hypogonadism would have explained my symptoms to a T.

    argh.
     
  3. Well, that's great news Calkid, actually.
     
  4. BIZ

    BIZ New Member

    I met with my MD again today and was candid about my current behaviors. After some discussion, and some research, we both decided that I need to quit drinking, period. That is the first course of action to see if my biweekly binges is the culprit behind my low-T. I believe it is. My symptoms did not present until I began drinking to deal with stress of work, school, and family. My estrogen was in the low normal range, my thyroid was fine, my LHRH was fine, but my LH and FSH were both a bit off, which is another sign of alcohol induced hypogonadism. Considering my strength did not deminish and my muscle mass did not either, we feel that I had several acute bouts of low-T and happened to catch one on the blood test. I pray that my HPTA will rebound as I swear off alcohol for good.
     
  5. MrNasty

    MrNasty New Member

    Just curious, but have any of you used AAS in the past or present? No to pry, but it just seems odd that your HPTA would need a rebound, BIZ, from alcohol use alone. I feel there is a bigger issue here.

    What about PHs. They too can shut down your system. M1T is one I can think of, off the top of my head, which causes HPTA shut down.

    Unless stressed upon by outside forces (PH or AAS use), maybe old age, HPTA activity should be; how odl are you guys again?

    Yes, alcohol can lower T levels, but I doubt it would lower them enough to warrent any significant problems. One would have to be drinking pretty excessivly to induce this sort of stress to the system.
     
  6. Actually I saw one studie on alcohol on Serum Level and it reported as low as 72ng/DL as the recorded low, if I dig it up again I'll post it.
     
  7. BIZ

    BIZ New Member

    In the thread in the general training area I did relate this to possible AAS use, but that was over 12 weeks ago and had used PCT. For about 6-8 weeks I was drinking heavy. I have since quit hoping that I will rebound. I will see what happens in four weeks.
     
  8. Calkid

    Calkid New Member

    yeah I guess, but I'd almost rather it have turned out low so I could have an easy answer and an easy solution.

    Let's get some post-ups, how do people feel after going on HRT?
     
  9. Here's what I can say.

    Headaches, did occur but stopped after about 2 weeks on 5 Mg Androgel
    Fatique, seemed at first to diminish but I think the 5mg dose isn't enough as I currently have been fatiqued.
    Labido, same as fatique, it seemed to help at first but has dwindled.
    Good news, I have gained 5 lbs. Waist, abs pretty much stayed the same. Added .5 inch on abs, waist no change, which is a good thing :D
    Strength, no noticable effect.
    Other noticed changes, I have to urinate more, weird, I haven't canged my water intake at all.
    Fecal consistency has changed, again weird, don't know what to make of it.

    That's about it.
     
  10. Noticed rebound headaches, probably not correct term.

    Anyway due to some personal issues, son's wedding, mother inlaw moving (out of state) shucks [​IMG] yeah right ;), I had went off Androgel for 4 days. When I started again yesterday I got the worst headache I have had in some time, I wouldn't say it was stress, I am on SD and was just hanging around the house, cutting grass and watching the Olympics.
     
  11. Calkid

    Calkid New Member

    Daniel, does your doctor have you on HCG as well?
     
  12. No, he actually didn't think I needed Androgel but I pushed the issue.
     
  13. BTW, just Dan is fine.
     
  14. Would Primobolan (4-Androstenoldione Acetate ), not Methenolone, help with Androgel? Since it is taughted as a steroidal aromatase inhibitor that inhibits estrogen biosynthesis.
     
  15. OK, went back to get new bood work done, actaully did it twice, because the first showed it higher (by 4 ng/dl) than my first time. So i did a few tricks and got it down again, anyway it was low enough (268ng/dl) this time for my doc to prescribe 10mg doses of androgel, so far, been 5 days, headaches didn't happen yet, noticed I have the midnight urination thing happening again, weird, and haven't slept well so far (toss and turn all night long). So far that's it.
     
  16. Old and Grey

    Old and Grey Super Moderator Staff Member

    Leave it to the old guy to top all you young whippersnappers. Tested today at 1880 ng/dl.Yup! No wonder I feel so good. Now for the history.

    I normally tested about 350, 450 with Tribulus, but last year I started slippingway below 200. I went on 5 mg of androgel in May and tested at 258 which still sucked. The Doc raised me to 7.5 mg per day and around August 1 I raised it myself to 10 mg per day. Obviously that did the trick. It took a full 2 weeks for me to feel the full effects of the higher dose.

    Now for the bad news, for the first time in almost 60 years my PSA came in above 1.0...actually at 2.2. It usually came in about .6 to .8. Not a good trend. So, I am going back to 7.5 mg per day but won't be tested again until February. Obviously Androgel does not cause cancer but it can accelerate the growth of any existing cancer so I just want to be cautious. I don't wake up in the middle of the night to pee si I don't think there are any problems going on.

    With the reading of 1880, I feel great, my bf% is much lower (about 8% with no special diet) but I look bigger due to added musculature and cuts. I am hitting all time personal records by my 3rd workout of 5's. Hopefully, I will be able to maintain this feeling with the decrease to 7.5 mg. I also can say that my experience has been that alcohol can severely depress the production of testosterone.

    As for the sexual side effects, I'll just say it is lucky that I raise horses and not sheep. However, my grapefruits are now peanuts! Anyway, who needs the traitorous little buggers anyway? Gotta run. I see Mrs. Grey sunning herself by the pool!
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  17. 1. Great news

    2. Uh Oh, I was told I need a PSA check next time, so having to tinkle in the middle of the night ain't a good thing [​IMG]

    3. Run Mrs. Grey Run, the Stallion is out of the Barn [​IMG]
     
  18. bilknu

    bilknu New Member

    I am also getting up there in years so I've done some research on TRT. I checked out Andrew Shippen's book 'The testosterone Syndrome' and highly recommend it. Dr. Shippen says estrogen must be checked as well as total testosterone and free testosterone (which the body can use).

    He said estrogen can counteract TRT and there are factors which cause estrogen to rise among them alcohol, obesity, and lack of zinc. Normal total testosterone range is 350-1200 ng. Free testosterone should be 2 to 3% of total.

    testosterone prevents bone loss in men, artherosclerosis, loss of muscle and energy.

    An interesting web site is www.dimfaq.com. Dim is an extract found in cruciferous vegetables (broccoli) which metabolizes harmful estrogen.
     
  19. Calkid

    Calkid New Member

    Dude... 1880 is practically steroidal! No wonder you're kicking @$$ in all categories!

    My situation still hasn't resolved. I got a doctor to test for T, and it came out 599 on an 830 scale. Pretty decent. But I'm still rarely if ever horny and have erectile issues [​IMG]

    So I got referred to an endocrinologist. FINALLY! Somebody who will run enough labs to know what's actually going on. However, they called me back 2 days after the appointment to tell me they were canceling it. And the guy only comes in once a month, on a morning when I'm in chem lab for 4 hours.

    I can see the guy at his office, but insurance won't cover it.

    blah.
     

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