Protein Intake

Discussion in 'Diet & Nutrition' started by Lance, Aug 24, 2004.

  1. Lance

    Lance New Member

    Bryan suggests eating 1g/lb of protein, 25% calories from fats, and the rest from carbs. Lyle also suggests this for the majority, but says some rare people actually do benefit from higher amounts of proteins.

    I'm wondering if there is any reason not to take more than 1g/lb of protein, considering you could possibly be giving yourself more muscle building potential.
     
  2. This really interested me. It is from the Diet and Nutrition FAQ

    also

     
  3. Lance

    Lance New Member

    Hmmm ...

    I wonder about protein alot. Some say to take alot, some, like Bryan, say 1g/lb is plenty. You know how we bodybuilders are, allways looking to optomize (spelling?) and get the best results.

    I guess i have two questions quite simply. While natural, is Bryan's recommendations perfect? (Lol, sounds overboard, but maybe i should have said optimla instead)

    And the second would be, while on AAS (b/c i may do a 2 weeker during my next HST cycle) what is the optimal amount.

    Thanks,
    Lance
     
  4. From what I have seen Bryan's plan is optimal, it compares to just about everything else I've read, quite well BTW, and easier to compute.

    As far as AAS, I really wouldn't know. I think in that same FAQ, it is mentioned that Steroid use does the effect of being able to parition food better so more calories can be ingested with less additive fat. But off the top of my head I don't remember exactly, you probably should read it before taking my word for it.
     
  5. I knew I had seen this somewhere. It was in THinkmuscle #24 Q&A
     
  6. Tom Treutlein

    Tom Treutlein New Member

    Supposedly, an individual can't utilize much more than 0.8-1.0gP/lb-BW. I don't know how true this or or whatever, but supposedly 15-20% total cals from protein is ideal. That does end up being 0.8-1.0gP/lb.

    Bryan and Lyle tell us how the excess protein burns calories that could've gone towards growth. Maybe this is why we see people who consume tons of calories make gains slowly, whereas you have people who diet more or less half-assed, but don't overdo the protein and still make results.

    I say this based on what I have seen. I know a bunch of people in my HS (yes, we're still young, but some of these kids are on their way, rather, big, and certainly not making newbie gains) who don't take dieting to extremes. Now, I'm sure they would make better gains if the calories were a bit higher, but with their diets they don't seem to be getting tons of protein, yet they grow. Optimal or not, I can't say because I'm not dissecting them.

    Still, you have people who eat extreme amounts and make gains that look like they should be on someone else. Moderation is definitely key with things, so maybe the whole idea of limiting protein intake is correct. Hey, I can deal with a few more cups of pasta.
     
  7. Lance

    Lance New Member

    Whenever i experiment with a very high protein intake, the results are phenomenal. I say experiment b/c it allways lasts a week at the most ... it's hard to stay on those diets. Just dang hard. You get MAD cravings for terrible carbs after a while.

    Anyways ... these are usually lower carb, not low carb, but the extra protein substitutes for the carbs. 2g/lb is as high as i've gone.

    Results: I allways drop bodyfat, harden up, get more ripped, see muscle separation that i havn't before and those little muscles (brachaii for one) that you don't allways see, and seem to also thicken up definately. Pretty much at bodybuildingworld.com they swear by a high protein, lower carb, med fat diet, 50%/20%/30% actually, at a higher calorie level for lean gaining. Allways works when i try it, and their clients and people on their message board (MANY MANY competitors) SWEAR by their nutritional wisdom. They go more by their clients progress, rather than studies, and follow alot of old school mentalities. Rheo Blair, Arnold, the ironagers, actually, with some new age such as proper EFA's.
     
  8. Tom Treutlein

    Tom Treutlein New Member

    I want to hear what Bryan has to say about your supposed greater results from higher amounts of protein.

    Bryan?
     
  9. BoSox

    BoSox New Member

    just more anecdotes. I don't know what you'd expect him to say.

    I could just as easily say "when I eat potato chips, my 10 rep max in bench press gets doubled" and we could ask for Bryan's opinion on it.

    Now, I'm not mocking Lance's assertion at all, in fact, I believe him. But there's really no way of evaluating it. Too many factors. There's not much anyone can really say.
     
  10. Calkid

    Calkid New Member

    I came to a realization the other day...

    I was cooking up a rather large batch of chicken on my foreman grill (which I cannot endorse enough. Buy one, especially one of the big ones).

    All in all, 2-3 pounds of chicken. This was a pile of chicken the size of one of my pecs.

    I was looking at this enormous pile of chicken, and thinking about how, over the next four days, I would eat all of it. And then I was thinking about how that would only comprise 1/3 of my total protein intake.

    And then I pondered, "what if I converted all this chicken muscle to human muscle in myself? I would be huge!" But then I remembered, however, about how increased protein intake just leads to increased protein turnover to maintain homeostasis.

    That chicken incident reinforced intuitively what I already knew academically:

    The vast majority of protein we intake does not build muscle. The VAST majority! Otherwise to gain 1 pound of muscle a week I would eat 1 pound of chicken a week. Instead I eat it in a day, and a whole lot of other things.

    The body usually isn't hurting for protein, especially the way we eat. So what keeps that protein from becoming muscle is the anabolic environment in our body.

    Something needs to tell the cells to grab protein and use it for more muscle. Here are a few things that do that:
    -Working out
    -Large calorie surplus
    -Exogenous hormones

    So if you're already working out and already eating a lot, piling on more protein won't help you much beyond that it's extra calories.

    However everybody downplays how much of a role anabolic hormones can play in growth. Most boys put on 10, 20, 30 pounds of muscle during puberty, largely from sitting around and overeating. And most steroid doses far exceed the pubescent hormonal cascade.

    So I would certainly recommend steroid users to up intake. Everybody else, remember the chicken incident -- the vast majority of that pile I just finished eating I'll soon be excreting.
     
  11. Lance

    Lance New Member

    With my way of bodybuilding i basically jump from research backed diets and then instinctive based diets.

    Research backed, just read up on Bryan or Lyle's studies and practices.

    Instinctive, well, trust in yourself. Try new things without asking why. Dave Draper allways followed this and the man looks great at his age. (52 or 62, i can't remember, old, lol). He has allways realized through the practice that increased protein intake just does things. The old diets of meat, milk, and eggs just seemed to add muscle and minimize fat. He says himself, don't ask how it works, it just does.

    So i jump between the two. Test new theories, old ones, and my own. I'm just giving an example of something i tried. I still havn't had the chance to try it for a 'long' period, like a whole HST cycle, which i would love to do! Basically because i havn't fined tuned it yet to where i can stick with it. It takes alot of preparing time, money, etc. for all that meat.

    Really does.
     

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