Discussion in 'Training Logs' started by HST_Rihad, Jan 19, 2013.
It would be interesting to see if you're bigger than Brad when you are at his bf level.
Are you kidding? That's not even a contest. He's like 178 @ 8%. Lets just assume I'm not really 9%, we will say 10%. 220 @ 10% is 22 lbs of fat and 198 lbs of lean mass. There is no possible way for me to even get down to being as small as he is now at his bodyfat level without losing significant muscle mass while dropping the extra fat. You'd have to put me in a holocaust camp for a few months for me to lose enough mass to be as small as Brad Pilon.
Just deal with the fact that your messiah is a rather little guy using his own body as proof of his assumptions about building muscle. I am a significantly larger guy using my body as proof that HST works. He's barely any bigger than Lyle. I'm the size of three Lyle's. Brad hasn't always been natural either, just for reference.
Rihad, what are your goals? What are you doing to reach those goals? If you haven't been able to reach your goals with a sufficient amount of time doing what you are doing, seems you need to change things up, no?
This is like a dick measuring contest between a toddler and Ron Jeremy ...
Now that wouldn't even be fair. My girlfriend describes it as being like an infant's arm, holding an apple. It's a burden, really.
You know that my "if you're bigger than Brad" is an unfortunate choice of words, of course you (or someone) may be naturally taller/wider and thus carry more muscles. That's not a concern. What I meant was the size of the muscles in proportion to the body, the body looks we're after: lean & muscular. Are you sure you would compare favourably to Brad's looks when you're down to his photoshooting bf levels? Not theoretically doing some smart math on bf levels, but actually after naturally getting down to his levels?
This is a fair question. The thing is, I overate the first 3 1/2 years. Only on March 28 did I realize that it was enough getting fat while gaining muscle, and started dieting. So it's been less than 5 months, really. My goals are to gain some muscle while staying lean, starting from when I do get lean in the first place, of course. So now I've been semi-dieting most days, when I think it's time to go for muscle, I will start to eat at maintenance and keep my waist size in check.
So Totez has to lose muscle to get down to Brad's level ... ?
Might be enlightening to you on the reliability of photos.
He will shrink in size when he attempts to get at Brad's bf level. I'm not saying it will be contractile elements lost (after all, our muscles are 75% water, 20% protein, 5% glycogen/minerals/connective tissue, etc), but it will be a loss in size. It's really a matter of defining of whether they both reached their genetic potential yet or not, arguing who is bigger or looks proportionally better due to being taller/wider or due to genetic giftedness, where tendon is attached to the bone, etc is silly. An adequate person wouldn't brag about being able to walk faster than an ant, would he?
This is irrelevant. The point I brought up was that rowing IS a lat exercise because it IS lats pulling the load back for the most part. You saw the picture. Trapezius only move the shoulders. You aren't wrong in saying that rowing is also a good trap exercise. Heavy deads or rack pulls are believed to be one of the best exercises for the traps due to the heavy load alone, even though it's not them moving the load. This wasn't the point. Muscles targeted were. Not even mentioning lats is weird.
So, folks are working their lats dynamically for the side effect of straining their traps isometrically? Then Totentanz should probably go ahead and call deads a forearm exercise because it's arguably one of the smallest muscles at work there and load/fiber ratio is the greatest.
Totez is a far better and more accomplished phyisque than Brad, if size @ low bf% is what you're after. The steroids hitting his pecs is kinda obvious, but then I'm sure there's plenty of defenders who will argue they haven't.
Also ... protein is still ~25% composition for skeletal muscle. Take what you like though.
Having seen Totez diet down previously, his muscle loss would be minimal.
And re: genetic potential - that argument went out the window when Brad went cycling so often.
Brad taking steroids?! That's a bit far stretched, don't you think? Not being a user, from what I've read testosterone first hits one's delts&traps more than anything else, it's like a signature look for a steroid user and hard to hide. Nothing even remotely like that on Brad.
I'm happy to take Totez's word for it. You're happy to take Brad's presumably.
And yes, delts, trap and bi's first and foremost (more androgen receptors). However, there's a loooonnnngggg list you can go cycle with, they work differently for each person, if you use them 'correctly' that distinction will be minimised, there's plenty of variables to be considered from food and actual routine ... hell, if all you do is take enough to help recovery, prevent loss and lose fat whilst gaining then you're getting something a natural isn't.
That's what Tour de France competitors used it for, same for any # of professional cheaters (being paid sports men&women). It doesn't have to throw King Kong muscles on you for it be helpful, do the research, you'll find out.
It's Martin Berkhan, another IF follower, that clearly states on his site having used ephedrine back when it was legal, but I don't remember reading anything like that coming from Brad, or anyone else mentioning that (except for you and Totentanz). Care to site a reference? Sparing muscle boils down to restricting calories while resistance training, moving on to not overeating to stay at that bf level. Muscle still grows that way albeit the more you've already added the more slowly it grows. Brad mentioned having added 4 pounds LBM in the last two years that way while maintaining his BW. Clearly I don't see anything resembling a steroid taking user in Brad.
Ephedrine is not a breach of being 'natural'. Hell, if it was we'd need to count caffeine in the same boat.
As I said, I'm quoting Totez, which is enough for me. If he's wrong, I'm wrong.
You can't gain 4lbs and not adjust BW, unless you're swapping it for precisely 4lb of fat, which would seem to me to be a case.
You're also ignoring the range of effects steroids have - but that doesn't pertain about Brad specifically, or the discussion atm, it's just something you're not aware of.
Sure thing, nothing there to be made clear.
I haven't used steroids but that doesn't mean I can't read other people's notes about it Of course it has a myriad of effects not attainable naturally. Slow body recomp (swapping fat for muscle) isn't among them.
Not "swapping" ... sigh ...
Also, who mentioned you using/not using steroids ... ?
Please learn to read what's written, not imaginary statements.
Anyway, it's your log. I'll let Totetanz continue.
Really where did you write about me taking drugs? Nowhere. It's your imagination only, my steroid comments had nothing to do with what you wrote about me taking them, which you didn't.
Yes, fat for muscle swapping, which you yourself wrote. Next time you ask me to read carefully, think about that.
Ephedrine is on the list of banned substances, FWIW. Caffeine (black tea, coffee) isn't.
Had a whole thing written out ... but just not worth it.
Fanatics can't be reasoned with :/
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