All heads

Stoked_on_HST

New Member
Hey I was wondering using the sample work out in the articles. When working say the bicepts by just doing the barbel curles and I neglecting the brachiles (sp?) also just push downs the tircept heads? So I guess what I am saying is by using a full body work out am I not hiting all the muscle groups? Should i rotate the movements each cycle to avoid this?
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]When working say the bicepts by just doing the barbel curles and I neglecting the brachiles (sp?)
you are not neglecting the brachialis at all. It is not possible to perfrom bicep curls or chinups or rows without using the brachialis.
You can use various exercise variations that emphasise brachialis work, but i really doubt they would provide extra hypertrophy.
Same goes for all compound vs isolation arguments.

Also, i almost forgot. it is important that you realise that the brachialis is not a muscle 'group'. The individaul heads of the tricep are not a muscle 'group'. etc. Note the word 'group'. the brachialis is an individual muscle that is one component of a muscle group that can be worked with simple bicep curls.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]you are not neglecting the brachialis at all. It is not possible to perfrom bicep curls or chinups or rows without using the brachialis.
You can use various exercise variations that emphasise brachialis work, but i really doubt they would provide extra hypertrophy.
Same goes for all compound vs isolation arguments.
You seem to be saying one can do without isolation excercises, which would mean one could do away with all bicep excercises. I'm confused on this topic, just like Stoked_on_HST. By including bicep curls, HST seems to admit there is a role for isolation movements. If they are needed, why aren't isolation movements for the brachialis needed? (And the forearms, etc.)
 
Bicep curls are better for your biceps than chins or rows because the muscle experiences greater stretch. So there is a role for isolation exercises, just not necessarily a role for additional isolation exercises to "hit every angle". There is no great difference between barbell-, dumbell-, and cable curls in terms of muscle growth.

Also read the 'selecting exercises' thread in the FAQ.
 
Bicep curls are better for your biceps than chins or rows because the muscle experiences greater stretch.

This is quite different fro AJ's good old beliefs. He assumed that the only way to use all the musclefibers of the muscle, one would need to get the fullest amount of contraction possible. And this should lead to increased growth over other exercises.

(i'm not saying you are wrong, i just thought this interesting)
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (jkismul @ May 28 2003,9:49)]Bicep curls are better for your biceps than chins or rows because the muscle experiences greater stretch.
This is quite different fro AJ's good old beliefs. He assumed that the only way to use all the musclefibers of the muscle, one would need to get the fullest amount of contraction possible. And this should lead to increased growth over other exercises.
(i'm not saying you are wrong, i just thought this interesting)
Just a comment or two:

All muscle fibers participate sequentially during even modest resistance muscle contraction. They just don't all fire at once. Not only that, but as fatigue sets in, more and more fibers will fire simultaneously. So you don't have to use heavy weights to activate all a muscle's fibers.

What determines whether the muscle actually grows or not depends on the ability of the fibers to resist and/or respond to trauma, assuming all other things remain equal (satellite cells, IGF-1, diet, etc)

Putting a muscle under stretch at the same time simply increases the absolute load experienced by the tissue...this in turn increases the anabolic potential of any exercise, even when less than maximum weight can be lifted using full such movements.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (stevie @ May 22 2003,5:46)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]brachialis is not a muscle 'group'. The individaul heads of the tricep are not a muscle 'group'. etc. Note the word 'group'. the brachialis is an individual muscle that is one component of a muscle group that can be worked with simple bicep curls.
Ok not a group FINE work with me here buddy. Kidding don't want to come off like a jerk. Maybe I was speaking over my head. Let me start over. Lets say that I do hammer curls in my routine for HST. Of my knowledge this will help with the "peak" of the muscle. Now obviously the biceps will be worked as will the brachial . If I would like a higher peak and wider bicep's (and really who wouldn't) would I be well advised to "cycle" my exorcizes. Like say in cycle one of hst I use one movement per day for bicep's. Preacher curls. Should I keep the grip the same through out the cycle and next time go closer on the grip to work on the width? Or is it irrelevant. Same with say Triceps. First cycle I do pushdowns
second cycle should I switch to say French curls? I guess I am just trying to avoid a "strange build" from using a "limited" routine.
Now all that said. Again I am not trying to come off as an A-hole. Just trying to learn so please if I am confused set me straight. If I am on the right track let me know. What do you all do keep the routine the same or switch up some of the exorcizes each cycle. Let me know I am a sponge fill me with weight lifting info.
worship.gif
 
It won't actually help your peak. Your muscle shape is mostly genetically determined; you can alter the size. As it gets larger, if you're the peaking type, it will peak. Doing the same exercise as someone who has good peaks won't help -- you need to get the same parents as the person with peaks.

Rotating your biceps exercises between cycle or within cycles WILL, however, reduce your chances of repetitive stress injury. They're all pretty well effective, so the important thing is to avoid an injury that will keep you from training; rotation is therefore a good thing.
 
Not completely on topic, but since we're talking biceps peaks here.. I was having a discussing with two physiotherapists the other day about bi&triceps peaks. My left and right are totally different (which of course is natural in a way, but..) my right is more completely developed from beginning to end. Whereas my left (and this counts for triceps as well) seems to peak a lot more.
I thought the reason could be the way exercises are performed (more cheating on the left; less complement range movement). However, they said range has nothing to do with development of muscles. Even if you would not complete the full range; development would be the same. Although the muscle has a "optimal loading point", and you could miss out on that which would lead to less development.
This would underline the selection of exercises has no effect on creating peaks.

Just some thoughts.

PPP
 
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