cutting the crap!

L

lcars

New Member
although many of you disagree with some of martins comments on the low carb theory, ive decided to give it a go. ive been on moderately low carbs for a while and ive noticed some fat loss already,i look leaner too. however ive been doing some light cardio which i guess would change the results slightly.

im gonna give it a go for the next few months and see what happens.im not cutting carbs totally as i feel this would be a bad idea,but lowering them slightly.

ill keep a log and post the results.
 
Low carb diets work excellently at fat loss. I don't think anyone here has argued against that. But calories count too.
What I find great about low-carb diets is that what you can eat is fairly limited (almost everything has carbs) so calorie restriction while maintaining high protein intake is pretty easy.
My rule of thumb while trying to lose fat while maintaining muscle is to try to eat only foods with significant protein, while of course restricting overall calories to a deficit.
 
lcars sucks and he is buying into the low carb diet fad...he'll never make it...LOSER

haha, seriously though, I'm thinking about giving it a try also.
 
<div>
(scientific muscle @ Apr. 27 2008,3:09)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Low carb diets work excellently at fat loss.  I don't think anyone here has argued against that.  But calories count too.</div>
Yup, when I was cutting from 14%+ bodyfat down to single digits (okay, single digit...), I made it a point, as part of my diet, to keep my carbs well below 100 grams/day. Many days I consumed 30 grams of carbs or less. I do not doubt that my low-carb diet, combined with cardio and heavy lifting, had a lot to do with my successful fat loss.

However, I just cannot get myself to go along with all the over-the-top statements that Martin likes to make. Eventually his illogical responses and crude language led me to the &quot;Ignore&quot; button that has markedly cleaned up some threads.
 
<div>
(lcars @ Apr. 27 2008,3:02)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">although many of you disagree with some of martins comments on the low carb theory, ive decided to give it a go. ive been on moderately low carbs for a while and ive noticed some fat loss already,i look leaner too. however ive been doing some light cardio which i guess would change the results slightly.

im gonna give it a go for the next few months and see what happens.im not cutting carbs totally as i feel this would be a bad idea,but lowering them slightly.

ill keep a log and post the results.</div>
The light cardio will not change the results that much. It will, however, make you more hungry. Hunger is the primary regulator of food intake.

If you experienced a quick weight loss immediately after you cut carbs, it comes from the loss of water that was needed by the glycogen. As you spent the surplus glycogen, that water is not needed anymore and so is excreted. While this looks like cutting carbs does not work to lose fat immediately, it shows that you are cutting enough carbs to begin using your glycogen reserves. After those are gone, stored fat inevitably follows.
 
lcars, to improve the result of your test could you maintain your actual daily calories intake by replacing the carbs with fat or protein or what that be asking too much?
biggrin.gif
 
<div>
(lcars @ Apr. 27 2008,3:02)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">although many of you disagree with some of martins comments on the low carb theory,</div>
Try it if you wish but honestly this has been researched quite well and no matter what Taubes says (obviously one of Martin's heroes) isn't going to change anything.

Now if you want to try it and in order to prove anything you should be eating well above total daily energy needs (remember it's not energy excess that causes obesity, so you shouldn't get fat  
rock.gif
) and replacing the carbs with fat. So if your normal macro % was 50-30-20 (carbs-fat-protein) then your new intake should be 80-20 or heck even 70-30 (fat-protein). Say 500 kcal above daily needs should work just fine.

If you're reducing your intake by elimainating carbs you are missing the point.
 
<div>
(Dan Moore @ Apr. 27 2008,7:07)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"><div>
(lcars @ Apr. 27 2008,3:02)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">although many of you disagree with some of martins comments on the low carb theory,</div>
Try it if you wish but honestly this has been researched quite well and no matter what Taubes says (obviously one of Martin's heroes) isn't going to change anything.

Now if you want to try it and in order to prove anything you should be eating well above total daily energy needs (remember it's not energy excess that causes obesity, so you shouldn't get fat  
rock.gif
) and replacing the carbs with fat. So if your normal macro % was 50-30-20 (carbs-fat-protein) then your new intake should be 80-20 or heck even 70-30 (fat-protein). Say 500 kcal above daily needs should work just fine.

If you're reducing your intake by elimainating carbs you are missing the point.</div>
Exactly, low-carbs generally work well because its hard to eat an excess of calories that way, not because carbohydrates are evil-magic as Taubes would have us believe! Which I why I posted this:

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">My rule of thumb while trying to lose fat while maintaining muscle is to try to eat only foods with significant protein, while of course restricting overall calories to a deficit. </div>

This way I have enough building blocks to maintain muscle, while staying hypocaloric.
 
I'm currently cutting and my diet is about 3k calories. I think it would be pretty difficult to eat 3k calories of proteins and fats. I did the Atkins diet with almost zero carbs about 10 years ago and lost a huge amount of weight (both muscle and fat...I wasn't working out). I tracked my calories one day (average day for me) and my intake was 1200 cals, and I felt very full. I was just hardly ever hungry on an extremely low carb diet.

Another concern is that you must take supplements to get necessary vitamins when you're on a low carb diet. Think nature might be telling you something there.
 
All I have to say is that this last bulk was the first time I actively tried to consume more carbohydrates than normal. Until now, I've always eaten relatively few carbs and took in more fats and proteins. I figure my daily totals usually ended up with carbs around 20-30%, nothing super low, ending up around 200 grams of carbs per day.
Anyway, this time around, I intentionally pumped up my carb intake significantly and lo and behold, I had some of the best strength gains of my life. Coincidence? Not really.

Obviously I'm discussing bulking rather than cutting, but I think it still goes against the &quot;no carb&quot; theory about how carbs are poison.
As a result, I now believe that carb intake is a lot more important than some people might think. I don't believe I will be restricting carbs significantly on any future cuts. Carb intake seems to be strongly linked to strength and performance, at least for me, and that is not something I want suffering during a cut.
 
Carbs are very helpful when one is bulking for hypertophy. Most nutrition experts (fitness gurus Lyle Mcdonald and Bryan Haycock among them) recommend the majority of the diet to be carbohydrates when bulking. Something like 20%P/20%F/60%C would be good for bulking and can be adjusted for the individual.
 
<div>
(stevejones @ Apr. 27 2008,7:32)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I'm currently cutting and my diet is about 3k calories. I think it would be pretty difficult to eat 3k calories of proteins and fats. I did the Atkins diet with almost zero carbs about 10 years ago and lost a huge amount of weight (both muscle and fat...I wasn't working out). I tracked my calories one day (average day for me) and my intake was 1200 cals, and I felt very full. I was just hardly ever hungry on an extremely low carb diet.

Another concern is that you must take supplements to get necessary vitamins when you're on a low carb diet. Think nature might be telling you something there.</div>
This is interesting. We've been told for years how cutting fat would cut total calories. And you come along and tell us that not eating carbs while eating fat/protein makes it very hard to get in a lot of calories because you were not hungry. Something is amiss with the old anti-fat advice, don't you think?

The Inuit do just fine on meat alone. If there is any concern, it's to take too much supplements when cutting carbs out. Refined carbohydrates somehow inhibit nutrient absorption and utilization. This includes protein, fat, vitamins and minerals. There may be a period of adaptation where one could lack some nutrients but this is transient at worse and things go back to normal quickly enough.
 
<div>
(Dan Moore @ Apr. 27 2008,7:07)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"><div>
(lcars @ Apr. 27 2008,3:02)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">although many of you disagree with some of martins comments on the low carb theory,</div>
Try it if you wish but honestly this has been researched quite well and no matter what Taubes says (obviously one of Martin's heroes) isn't going to change anything.

Now if you want to try it and in order to prove anything you should be eating well above total daily energy needs (remember it's not energy excess that causes obesity, so you shouldn't get fat
rock.gif
) and replacing the carbs with fat. So if your normal macro % was 50-30-20 (carbs-fat-protein) then your new intake should be 80-20 or heck even 70-30 (fat-protein). Say 500 kcal above daily needs should work just fine.

If you're reducing your intake by elimainating carbs you are missing the point.</div>
I concur. If the OP wants to cut the crap, as the title says, then that advice is exactly what he should follow. It would prove, or refute as the case may be, anything I and most proponents of the PCB hypothesis wrote on the subject. If not to us, at least to the OP himself.

Cut the carbs out entirely. Eat only fat and protein with a ratio of about 80/20 fat/protein. Eat more than calculated caloric needs. Further, the OP should consider that it takes between 4 to 20 weeks to fully adapt to the high fat diet. At least if one was adapted to a high carb diet before switching. So the OP should anticipate that his strength and overall performance will drop for a time and then pick back up as he fully develops the ability to use fat as fuel.
 
I'm going to give it a go too.  I will count calories and make sure I get at least 3200 calories per day, which will be 200 more than I should get to be cutting.   If I am low in calories for the day (which I&quot;m sure I will be), I'll just drink olive oil (1920 calories per cup) until I reach my 3200 cals.   Other than that, the only thing I will monitor is my protein intake (getting 1g per lb).  I'll make sure I don't consume more than 20g of carbs per day, which will probably come from mixed nuts (about 20 grams carbs per cup).  
Meats
Cheese
Nuts
Oils
Eggs
Water
I'll dedicate 3 months to it and see where I stand.
 
<div>
(stevejones @ Apr. 27 2008,11:34)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I'm going to give it a go too.  I will count calories and make sure I get at least 3200 calories per day, which will be 200 more than I should get to be cutting.   If I am low in calories for the day (which I&quot;m sure I will be), I'll just drink olive oil (1920 calories per cup) until I reach my 3200 cals.   Other than that, the only thing I will monitor is my protein intake (getting 1g per lb).  I'll make sure I don't consume more than 20g of carbs per day, which will probably come from mixed nuts (about 20 grams carbs per cup).  
Meats
Cheese
Nuts
Oils
Eggs
Water
I'll dedicate 3 months to it and see where I stand.</div>
You'd better supplement with some vegetables or at least some fiber capsules or you are going to be seriously constipated on such a diet.
laugh.gif
 
<div>
(stevejones @ Apr. 27 2008,11:34)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I will count calories and make sure I get at least 3200 calories per day, which will be 200 more than I should get to be cutting.</div>
I applaude the effort Steve but in essence you will be eating maintenance which won't prove much. In order to show that excess caloric consumption, when ingested as fat, will not cause increased adiposity you will need to eat above maintenance. And since the time is restricted (3 months) you will need to eat &quot;well&quot; above maintenance, or not work out for 3 months (something I do not advise). Actually I don't advise this no carb nonsense either but ...................
 
Yeah, but I'm not doing this to be a part of some clinical study. I'm doing it for my own peace of mind. I've cut enough times at this level of bodyfat to know what the difference in cals does for me. If I eat maintenance and lose bodyfat at the same pace or faster during the three months, that will prove enough to me, especially since I will keep the cals at 3.2k instead of lowering them as I lose bodyfat (which is my usual program)
 
Hey Steve, I would suggest spending a few weeks gradually reducing carbs rather than just knocking them on the head. It'll be interesting to see how you get on strength wise.

Senna pod 'tea' might also help if you do get a bit 'stuck up.' It's an old remedy and would add very little in the way of carbs. According to Wiki &quot;Senna acts on the lower bowel, and is especially useful in alleviating constipation. It increases the peristaltic movements of the colon.&quot;
 
<div>
(Totentanz @ Apr. 27 2008,8:18)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">All I have to say is that this last bulk was the first time I actively tried to consume more carbohydrates than normal. Until now, I've always eaten relatively few carbs and took in more fats and proteins. I figure my daily totals usually ended up with carbs around 20-30%, nothing super low, ending up around 200 grams of carbs per day.
Anyway, this time around
, I intentionally pumped up my carb intake significantly and lo and behold, I had some of the best strength gains of my life. Coincidence? Not really.

Obviously I'm discussing bulking rather than cutting, but I think it still goes against the &quot;no carb&quot; theory about how carbs are poison.
As a result, I now believe that carb intake is a lot more important than some people might think. I don't believe I will be restricting carbs significantly on any future cuts. Carb intake seems to be strongly linked to strength and performance, at least for me, and that is not something I want suffering during a cut.</div>
first off thanks for the input guys, its good to get a mix of opinions. i will be increasing my fat and protein intake to compensate.im not expecting much growth with this type of diet, but just to lean out a little for summer.

i have a freind who did the no carbs, high fat and high protien diet, he felt like crap for a while until his body started using his fat intake in an efficient manner.he leaned out a little but only did it for a few months so the results werent conclusive.

im not cutting carbs out altogether, im just halving the portions i have now.

@tot i can concur about the improved strength gains on carbs, i dont think anyone would dispute that they are great for bulking.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top