Need the Veterans help

J

Joe.Muscle

Active Member
Hey guys...well many of you have known me here for a while. That being said out of all my years of training 16 years now...I have never really trained to get stronger only bigger.

I think its time to do a strength training cycle or two and well were do you guys suggest I start?

The only think I want to point out is due to a pec tear / bicep tendon tear years ago...I do not want to go heavier than a 5 rep max?

I don't know if I will be able to get stronger or truely do a strength training routine without going below a 5 rep max if that is the case then I want do a cycle...my joints and health mean more than strength.

But if there is a way to get stronger using 5-8 reps then I am all ears...even if it takes me longer than normal.

Thanks
 
what do you want to get stronger in,deadlifts,bench-press,squat, or olympic lifts like snatches,clean and jerks, 5x5 is a good strength routine.
 
I guess I should specify what I want to get stronger in...to be honest I hadn't really deteremined a given bodypart...I just thought I needed to get stronger all over.
 
Wendler 5/3/1 would be a possibility, as would the Starr 5x5, or even the triples routine that Russ lays out here on the site (10x3;4x6;2x12). If you can't find it, I have a template in Excel that I'd be happy to send; I've to date done 4 triples cycles with the best strength gains I've ever had in my 17 years of training. Whatever you decide Joe, good luck.
 
Joe,

Few questions:

Have you decided that you are big enough now or are you still hoping for a little more hypertrophy? Or have you given up trying to get bigger as a natty?

How strong are you these days? Eg. in terms of bw, what can you squat, deadlift, bench, etc?

What are your anthropometry related strengths and weaknesses?

Increasing strength, without increasing bw, is going to mean focusing on neural efficiency, but you know that already. That's generally going to mean working with loads that are a high %age of your 1RM (often 80% 1RM and over). You'll also need to have some sort of periodisation setup so you don't burn out.
 
I would like to get bigger but after bulking and cutting my lean mass stays about the same???. I can add a inch to my arms and chest with no problem when I bulk and it looks real good with clothes on nice atheletic bulk...but when i cut down for summertime or whatever I don't see that much gain. Maybe a little but its not much. So to answer your question maybe I am close to my genetic limit naturally.

My goals are to be stronger and fit...in other words be healthy at this point in my life. I am really leaning toward as cheesy as this sounds trying to lift and eat now days to healthier and disease free later on in life.

That being said I have had random thoughts about trying something new like CROSSFIT...but I have heard conflicting advice on that...so thats when I decided that I like my fullbody workouts so why not try to get stronger at them.


As far as my strenght Lol...I will answer the best I can. I don't do deadlifts hardly ever, and I don't do flat bench press because of my injury. I also don't got below 5 rep max because of injury. And I will NOT even consider going below my 5 rep max.

So here is my current stats.

Dumbell bench press 80 pound dumbells for 5 reps. ( I might could do more?)
Squat 250 pounds for about 10 reps
Back Rows about 210 pounds for 5 reps
Shoulder Press dumbell press 45 pound dumbell for about 6-8 reps

I am currently 190 pounds at 13-14% bodyfat...I use to be leaner about 12% at this bodyweight when I was younger??? (that bothers me?).....and other than that I need work work to get stronger.

I am notorious for taking short rest breaks about 1 minute between sets so I am sure I could improve some of the above numbers with 3 minute rest periods.

Help me out guys....:)
 
If you're concerned about injuries, I'd definitely avoid Crossfit. I started doing Crossfit way back--around 1998 I think? I don't konw anyone who was doing it back then who didn't end up quitting due to injuries. I've got buddies who are USA Special Forces, who are about as fit as anyone on the planet, who shy away from Crossfit becuase of the wear and tear, particularly on shoulders. If you're really wanting to do Crossfit, Rob (Moore, I think) has taken Crossfit principles, added a meso-cycle approach with progression plus an absolute emphasis on durability (not getting hurt) and posts great workouts at militaryathlete.com. I think he now charges for the site, but I can personally vouch for it as a fantastic overall strength and fitness program. It's also really fun--he uses frequent 50 pound rucks, for example, and heavy sandbag work. Rob's smart and he's a great guy--very nice "atmosphere" to the program and the site.

I'm definitely not a veteran here and so I hope you'll forgive me, but based on your numbers I think you'd do well to buy Ripptoe's book and just spend about 6 months doing the Starting Strength program. He'll never ask you to go heavier than 5RM. With overall fitness as a goal, you could add bi-weekly tabata squats for about 7-10 sets if you want, although that'd probably cut into your strength gains. Or maybe some sprint intervals, if you've got good knees and ankles.
 
Joe.Muscle said:
My goals are to be stronger and fit...in other words be healthy at this point in my life. I am really leaning toward as cheesy as this sounds trying to lift and eat now days to healthier and disease free later on in life.
Click to expand...
I totally get this. The whole healthy thing...

OK Joe - try a slow bulk; eat slightly above maintenance and do any of the suggestions mentioned here in regard to programming. I agree with twindeltatandem about Ripp's Starting Strength. It's a great program for strength. On the health side, add some cardio to the mix. You don't have to do a lot, but you should do some to keep your heart good and healthy.
 
Joe:

How old are you now Joe? I'm 45 and still making progress; but then I haven't been lifting consistently for anywhere near as long as you have. I don't know, but I just feel that you should still be able to make some solid progress in both size and strength.

Crossfit is great for GPP but, like twindeltatandem says, it will likely be very hard on your shoulder joints if you just dive straight in - they program tons of pull-ups and pressing overhead. If you scale the weights you should find that you can toughen your joints up a great deal before you start to increase the loads.

As I get older, thorough warmups have become more and more important so that my joints don't hurt so much after training so I think that might help with the Crossfit workouts. I'll probably switch to more of a CF type thing once I have attained all my strength goals.

Ripp's SS is a great program but you won't be learning anything new; as you are probably aware, it's basic compound lifts for sets of 5 using linear progression. Doesn't really cater for the metabolic end of the scale which I think you will need/enjoy.

I reckon what might help you is a way to spice things up mentally. Maybe adding a new movement or two would help? I see you don't do deads much but have you ever learnt to clean correctly? Cleans are all about power output (once you have the technique down). The loads will be lighter than for deads but you will be working the same muscle groups, and then some, getting the bar racked on your shoulders. Try a session where all you do is cleans, working up in sets of 5 to your top weight and then doing three or four sets with that. If you also learn good jerk technique you will benefit from the extra work and enjoy the satisfaction of holding a heavy bar overhead as well. C&Js make for an awesome workout.

Have you done a pure HST cycle recently? It would seem to me to be ideal for you as you don't want to go heavier than 5RM. The 15s should kick your butt and help with GPP and then the 10s and 5s will give you plenty of progression. Once you are at the end of the 5s you can continue using the same 5RM loads but switch to triples so you can do more work without much more central fatigue. You could try adding in some metabolic work after the heavy stuff too, if you don't normally bother with that.

Another thing that would be worth trying would be paused reps. Eg. For my squats yesterday I used my 15RM load for sets of 5 but I paused each rep for a good second in the hole. I performed four sets. The last one was pretty tough going and I could really feel the muscles working hard. I followed that with 15 reps at only 90kg and today my legs are really feeling the effects. This seems like a great way to add extra TUT without having to do endless sets. Getting the extra strain in the full-squat position is the most effective position too. You could do the same for other push-type exercises.

Borge's Myo-reps would be another protocol worth looking at. You could easily work within your 5RM limit using that.

Anyway, I'm sure you'll figure something out but I'll be interested to hear what you decide to do.
 
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