Tangodown's 2015 Log

Discussion in 'Training Logs' started by TangoDown, Feb 5, 2015.

  1. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    Here's the video.

    Lighter than 3RM works anyway as the heaviest I was planning for was 90%, which is about a 4RM. Moderate day pressing movement is programmed at 85% which is about a 6RM.

    How's this look? Need more anterior delt work?

    Heavy Day (Dips): 4-6x2 @ 90% (progress to 3-5x3) RPE 9-9.5, followed by workdown sets of 3x3 @ 85%
    Moderate Day (Dips): 3-4x4 @ 85% (progress to 3-4x5) RPE 9-9.5, followed by workdown sets of 2x5 @ 80%
    Light Day: Spoto Press 3x8 @ 70% RPE 6-8ish
    Recovery Day: Spoto Press 3x5 @ 80% RPE 7-8ish

    I figure a spoto press is a good exercise to increase stability and will keep bench primed. I'm sure I can still see overall increases in bench strength from significant strength increases from dips. I bench 235-240lb, not 335-340lb.
  2. Jester

    Jester Well-Known Member

    I think doing any kind of pressing movement is going to assist bench in the long run, so long as the load and tonnage go up in a cyclical fashion.
  3. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    Only issue with progressing dips in that fashion is that body weight increases too during bulk and isn't static within a 24 hour period. But I'll figure it out. You still think a 1lb-2lb/week weight gain is still necessary?

    Yeah, that makes sense, though I won't have to relearn the bench press with a spoto press (ROM difference is 1-2") and the lighter load facilitated by the light and recovery days and the pause off the chest will teach me to stay tight.
  4. Jester

    Jester Well-Known Member

    Honestly I don't think your BW is an impediment to monitoring the progression or weight used.
  5. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    Well that's assuming progress is faster than weight gain, which I hope.

    Final Q before I'm outta here:

    For your primary exercises, you tend to be around RPE 9. Do you try to keep every cluster/set at RPE 9 or do you have some of your clusters/sets towards the end routinely hitting RPE 10 (but not failure)?
  6. Jester

    Jester Well-Known Member

    Somewhere in between? I'm fine with RPE 10 if I didn't fail on that rep. I try to avoid true grinders because of the recovery impact. I'm not too worried about neural coding for bad motor patterns etc. That only happens if you're doing it wrong day-in, day-out.

    RPE 9 is simply because I'm lifting heavy.

    e.g. if I do 3x5 @ RPE 7, then I'm using what, 7RM ? Not exactly where I want to be for my central movements (most of the time).
  7. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    Decided to run the DUP program while still cutting to get a feel for it. Started today with the recovery day. Supposed to be 3x5 on everything, RPE 7-8ish.

    5'8", 166lb

    Spoto Press (NEW, 3 minutes b/w): 180lb x 5, x 5, x 5

    Definitely a different feel which I'll need to learn.

    Chest got real pumped after this. Bad movement pattern on the first set which made it RPE 9.5, but the other two were spot on at around RPE 8. Controlling and not letting the bar sink into the chest or slight bounce off the chest is something I need to get used to. Switched back to heels on floor.

    ATG Beltless Paused Squat (NEW, 4 minutes b/w): 225lb x 3, 210lb x 3, 190lb x 4

    First time doing beltless squats, let alone doing them paused (and I haven't done a pause squat in forever and a day). Humbling. Gonna back the weight down to 205lb next recovery session.

    Weighted Pullups (80%, 3 minutes b/w): Belt + 55lb x 5, x 4, x 4

    RPE 7-8 across the board.

    Explosive Rear Delt Rows (NEW): 75lb DB x 10, x 10

    Tried face pulls and couldn't stop falling forward. I don't know how to do these. Decided to do some rear delt rows instead. Didn't do them strict - rather a bit like a Krok row but not super body englishy.
  8. _tim

    _tim Well-Known Member

    Careful with your form given the newbie beltless squat experience. It may take a while for your core to get up to snuff - you don't want to risk injury, TD.

    How were you doing face pulls if you were falling forward?
  9. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    I was doing them normally. The weight itselt was easy. I just dont know how to do them without being pulled forward by the cable. Leaning back didnt help.
  10. _tim

    _tim Well-Known Member

    Well - could be a couple things. Hand placement/grip could be one thing, and another could be your upper body alignment. OH grip with the wrists slightly bent should fix that. For the other, once you've sat back with the load, set your shoulders like you would for bench. Pull your shoulder blades back and keep them there. That should fix ya.
  11. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    5'8", 166lb (-0lb)

    Gonna give myself another week on 2200 cals/day and if I don't lose weight, I'll lower again.

    Sumo Deadlift: 385lb [~90%] 8x1

    Focused on pulling the slack out of the bar instead of yanking. Made the pull off the floor harder but made things feel better.

    Deficit Deadlift (workdown set after sumos):
    305lb [~84%] x 3, x 3

    Weighted Dips: Belt + 72.5lb [90%] x 2, x 2, x 2, x 1, Belt + 65lb [~80%] x 3, x 1

    A new exercise. A little trouble balancing with the weight swinging back and forth on my belt. Already fatigued, that made the work down sets way too hard. Don't know how to mitigate this other than putting a dumbbell between my legs or buying a new belt.

    Machine Rows: 210lb x 3 [90%], x 2, x 2, x 2, x 2, x 2, x 2

    Squat: 265lb x 2 RPE 10

    Good lord...I guess I can't use the same work set for squats that I'd use if fresh even if I leave squats plenty of time after deadlifts. So I suppose I'll consider 255lb 90% whilst fatigued from heavy deadlifts. Frustrating.
  12. Lol

    Lol Super Moderator Staff Member

    If you did front squats instead, on deadlift days, the fatigue from the deads would have less carry-over to the squats.
    Or, alternate which exercise you do first.
  13. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    What do you think of beltless paused squatting all sessions of the week as opposed to regular squatting on heavy/moderate days and paused squatting on light and recovery days? Since theyre basically the same movements, I'd assume carry over would be significant.
  14. Lol

    Lol Super Moderator Staff Member

    TD, are you planning on competing in a PL meet?
    If not, I would think that HBBS would sit better in your schedule than LBBS, whether you decide to pause or not. Some extra quad strength and power is always useful for breaking the bar off the floor, but I don't think LBBS is going to give you that in the same way that full-depth HBBS is going to.
    Certainly worth trying paused HBBS. When performed correctly, I feel the extra TUT can definitely help build quad strength. You could try them for a month and see if there's a decent carry-over to deads.
  15. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    Yeah, eventually. Maybe in a couple of years.

    @Jester gave the opposite argument, that LBBS is superior to HBBS in my case. I did give HBBS a try for a couple of weeks and felt almost as strong because my LBBS stance is very narrow (which I'm going to fix), but was compelled to switch back. I think one of the reasons why my LBBS felt so week last session was because I was only 3 sessions into relearning it again after a couple week break doing HBBS.
  16. Lol

    Lol Super Moderator Staff Member

    Really, the issue is whether you can train deadlift and LBBS effectively in the same session. It may turn out that you can; but if it turns out that you are never able to train LBBS effectively because you are always too fatigued following deads, then you'll either have to alternate which lift you do first each session or switch out LBBS for HBBS on deadlift days (or do lighter, paused reps). It'll really depend on how well things pan out for you.
    Personally, I think it might be good to focus on building your squat numbers for a while and see how well this carries over to your deads as I don't think your squat is up there with your deadlift right now. (Hope my memory is correct! :))
    Last edited: May 4, 2015
  17. Jester

    Jester Well-Known Member

    It's worth bearing in mind the difference is going to be minimal most likely, and that;

    - We're talking at best about where they lie on a good-better-best curve.
    - You need to determine whether your primary factor to consider is recovery, or load carryover (LBBS being a heavier lift than HBBS).
  18. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    I'll see how things go over the next couple of weeks. I should be able to develop the necessary work capacity, especially when I finish this cut. I'm young and healthy and usually get my 8 hours (despite insomnia issues here and there). Like I said, I have to take into consideration that this was my 3rd time LBBSing after a couple of weeks of HBBSing only. It might take a few more sessions to get back to where I was.

    There's always room for adjustment while I test out DUP while in a state where strength isn't going to come anyway (cutting). If I find that heavy squatting isn't going to work out on the same day as heavy deadlift, I suppose there's a way to adjust program-wise. I'm going to bring my stance out as it's always been horribly narrow for a LBBS and see how things go.
  19. Jester

    Jester Well-Known Member

    I think your biggest issue is endlessly changing your stance and positioning for bench and squat. You should be using it for 3-4 months, not 3-4 sessions or 3-4 weeks before making a change, unless there is a glaring issue.
  20. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    Things were.pretty consistent thro the bulk form wise. Ive been experimenting.more.now.as.ive cut down. Only thing that changed on squat was experimenting w hbbs and bench grip.was.only.changed.once to how it is.now.

    EDIT: off of phone now: I tried benching on toes but rack height really does prevent me from getting my scapulas back and being able to unrack the weight, even when I have someone unracking it for me. So I switched back to heels on floor for spoto press.

    And I did try squatting in flat shoes a couple of times but that didn't work out. But point is , everything's been pretty consistent throughout these last 3 month because all but the benching on toes deviation only lasted a couple of sessions before I switched back to how I've always done things.
    Last edited: May 4, 2015

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