Training 6x a week

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9to5lifter

New Member
I am currently training 3x per week, full body workouts (classic HST). The problem is that I don't feel (even slightly) sore after my workout. I have completed the 15's phase and I am in my 10's now, however I have yet to experience DOMS. Maybe it's too soon (and I know DOMS is not necessary for muscle growth), but I am thinking of switching to training 6x per week for my next cycle in order to get more volume in. Since I cannot train twice a day, there are really 2 options:

A) Train 6x a week, using an upper body/lower body split (or any other 2-way split). Each body part gets hit 3 times a week and each exercise comprises, say, 4 sets.
B) Train 6x a week, full body workouts. Each body part gets hit 6 times a week but each exercise comprises, say, 2 sets only.

Which approach do you think would be more beneficial for muscle growth and why? Any help would be greatly appreciated, I am looking forward to hearing your insights.Thanks.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]however I have yet to experience DOMS. Maybe it's too soon (and I know DOMS is not necessary for muscle growth)
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With the exception of the first workout of the macro cycle, I never get DOMS and I rarely feel sore (save the last workout of each microcycle). But I have gained 40 pounds in 2.5 cycles, so yes, I would say its not necessary.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]but I am thinking of switching to training 6x per week for my next cycle in order to get more volume in.
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As far as frequency goes, I believe the greater the better, barring factors such as over tiring CNS and proper nutrition (I dont know for fact this is true, but it seems to follow the line of the principles of the program). I would think that if one could do something like 1 set of say bench press every hour during the day, progressing properly, and could eat enough, youd become a beast! But I just dont think this to be realizable for most people on a daily basis.
 
Frequency works because of elevated Protein Synthesis, but an often overlooked aspect is; when upping frequency more often than not you are also upping your overall volume in each RM phase.
 
One of the great things about HST is how it allows you to do things that aren't realistic with other systems. It's rather fun. ;)

Frequency is a really nice way to sneak up the volume without causing excessive fatigue. And it (probably) keeps protein synthesis levels higher than 3 or 4x-a-week training.

One of the first tweaks I recommend people is to increase their bodypart frequency up to 5-6x-a-week. They can choose to do their entire routine per session, or they can split their session as long as bodyparts get hit during both sessions (for example, dip on one day, incline on different day.)

My training methodology is pretty similar to O&G's. Keep each session relatively short and sweet. Then jack up the frequency as far as your time constraints, metabolism and food intake will allow you.

cheers,
Jules
 
Many thanks to all of you, you have really helped me a lot. When asking a question, understanding the reasoning behind the answer is just as important to me as hearing the answer. Knowing why you workout the way you do is a great feeling, it helps you stay focused and overcome any obstacles. Actually, after years of hearing everyone's guesswork about training ("rev up the intensity" or "you have to feel the pump", the usual stuff), it is the first time that I am able to get a sound explanation of why they recommend what they reccomend.

PS: precious_roy, 40 pounds in 2.5 cycles?!! I don't know how much of that is fat or if it is the first time you are training with weights, but this is amazing gains! Congratulations. It is thought-provoking that you have experienced such gains with little or no soreness...
 
I actually had the same query. I was not feeling sore at all from working out 3x week, M-W-F. So let's say I do 6 sets of squats per week, it would be better to train 6x a week, breaking it up into 1 working set per workout?
 
I wouldn't say that either, looking at soreness is tricky. You might not be sore because of various factors, only one of them being volume. Increment size could be one also. Before going to 6 days per week you might want to try increasing your increments. I've found with me that in most exercises going the 5% isn't enough to keep mild soreness sustained. So I upped my increments to 7.5%, 10% and 15% and duplicated some of the weights. At each increase I get some soreness and since I'm a masochist I love it. :)
 
6x a week hst? no more room for HIIT?
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[b said:
Quote[/b] (dkm1987 @ May 27 2005,9:43)]I wouldn't say that either, looking at soreness is tricky. You might not be sore because of various factors, only one of them being volume. Increment size could be one also. Before going to 6 days per week you might want to try increasing your increments. I've found with me that in most exercises going the 5% isn't enough to keep mild soreness sustained. So I upped my increments to 7.5%, 10% and 15% and duplicated some of the weights. At each increase I get some soreness and since I'm a masochist I love it.  :)
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I will try that thanks :D

I've been reading the FAQ on "Optimising HST" and Bryan seems to advocate AM/PM splits to increase frequency, with 2 different workouts (lower/upper, push/pull, etc...).

I still go to school so it's not practical for me to train AM/PM, instead, so I'm really leaning towards training 6x a week, full body, just breaking up the sets.

If I understand correctly, the bottom line is, more frequency is better as long as volume doesn't increase?

If I do decide to workout 6xweek, full body, would the following day's workout be a "repeat" of the past day, with no increment increase until the next "proper" workout?

For example, I workout on Monday, then Tuesday would be a repeat of Monday, but then on Wednesday, the increments would increase? I.E, the weights would still only increase every 2 workouts?

Sorry for all the questions, but I just really want to get the best out of my next cycle    
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 ;)
 
Hangi, preferably do a different workout on the second day. You hit the same muscles but with different exercises. Therefore, you are incrementing every day.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Old and Grey @ May 28 2005,9:36)]Hangi, preferably do a different workout on the second day. You hit the same muscles but with different exercises. Therefore, you are incrementing every day.
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So basically, full body again, but with different exercises? Because I workout at home and only have a barbell, my exercises are a bit limited, how does this look to you (for 15 reps):

Workout 1

Squats x2
Calf Raise x1
Bench Press x2
Chins x2
Bent Over Rows x2
Barbell Curls x1

Workout 2

Stiff Leg Deadlift x2
Calf Raise x1
Close Grip Bench Press x2
Military Press x2
Dips x2
Barbell Curls x1
 
Yes, full body workouts alternated. You don't have too. I had good success with this program 5xweek Mon - Fri.

Squats
Deadlifts
Bench (or other chest movement)
Chins
Flys
Clean and Press (or other shoulder movement, this gets traps thoug so that's a plus)
Incline Curls
Overhead DB Extensions
Calf Raises

I didn't change exercises and things went fantastic with that routine, i'm having a hard time changing it because it's worked so well.

But if you were to alternated, i'd say just put together 2 full body workout routines, and just alternate them. You only have shoulders and tris getting hit every other day. You don't have to change all your exercises. I'd put your shoulder and tri move into both of your full body routines. Or you can change the exercise used, but you're limited to your equipment.
 
Hangi, I would suggest changing your chins to workout #2 so you are hitting you lats everyday. You could also eliminate curls for that workout since chins will provide all the work needed for biceps. Add shrugs to workout #1 to hit your traps.

You new scheme would be more balanced, at least in my opinion, and look like this:

1:
Squats x2
Calf raise x1
Bench press x2
Rows x2
Curls x1
Shrugs x1

2:
Stiff Leg Deadlift x2
Calf Raise x1
Military Press x2
Dips x2
Chins x2

You won't need the close grip benches with military presses and dips as they will work your triceps pretty good. Throw in some AB work instead.

Steini, some studies have shown that cortisol levels rise after working out for more than 45 minutes. Other studies show that your body can become used to that and the cortisol levels will eventually decrease. I find that working out for more than 45 minutes is, well, just plain too much work. I prefer to go with short workouts, more frequently. The short workouts are more effective and more energizing for me.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Old and Grey @ May 29 2005,9:13)]Hangi, I would suggest changing your chins to workout #2 so you are hitting you lats everyday. You could also eliminate curls for that workout since chins will provide all the work needed for biceps. Add shrugs to workout #1 to hit your traps.
You new scheme would be more balanced, at least in my opinion, and look like this:
1:
Squats x2
Calf raise x1
Bench press x2
Rows x2
Curls x1
Shrugs x1
2:
Stiff Leg Deadlift x2
Calf Raise x1
Military Press x2
Dips x2
Chins x2
You won't need the close grip benches with military presses and dips as they will work your triceps pretty good. Throw in some AB work instead.
Steini, some studies have shown that cortisol levels rise after working out for more than 45 minutes. Other studies show that your body can become used to that and the cortisol levels will eventually decrease. I find that working out for more than 45 minutes is, well, just plain too much work. I prefer to go with short workouts, more frequently. The short workouts are more effective and more energizing for me.
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Thanks I will try your suggestion, except I really want close grips, from my experience, they are good for putting mass on your arms :D

So I think I'll move shrugs to workout 2 but add close grips to workout 1. I'm thinking of also adding weighted ab work (about 2 sets) to each workout, how does that sound? Thanks for the advice so far BTW.
 
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