Amino acids
- Thread starter Morph
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Amino acids are very expensive, and less effective for building muscle than whole proteins. I would suggest using either food or whole protein supplements.
Lil Popa Pump
New Member
Bryan,
How do you feel about supplementing with BCAAs (+glutamine) during one's workout?
It seems as if many people notice benefits from this kind of supplement (BCAAs + glutamine) ( eg Glutacene, ICE, etc.).
How do you feel about supplementing with BCAAs (+glutamine) during one's workout?
It seems as if many people notice benefits from this kind of supplement (BCAAs + glutamine) ( eg Glutacene, ICE, etc.).
The body uses what little glutamine that makes it past the gut (about 10% of the dose) to replenish glycogen stores in the liver. You wouldn't really "feel" this though. Just drinking sugar would be MUCH cheaper.
There is a tiny bit of research on BCAA taken during exercise. For things like running or cycling they don't really do anything but increase the oxidation of BCAAs. There was one study on weight lfiting that showed that the muscle will use the supplemental BCAAs (7 grams taken before) to oxidize rather than those it has floating around already. That can be a good thing.
Simply taking a whole protein supplement that is high in BCAAs before exercise is just as, if not more, effective and more cost effective.
For example, in a 35 gram serving of Primer, you get 7.2 grams of BCAAs. This serving costs about $0.80 .
Now take a common BCAA supplement like Sportpharma's BCAA and 7 grams of BCAA costs $1.36, almost twice as much.
Not only that but Primer also supplies 7 gms of glutamine in the same serving.
If I would have thought BCAA+glutamine to be superior to the protein I put together for pre-workout, I would have simply put together BCAA+glutamine instead. But as I have also spent a lot of money on BCAAs and every other kind of AA in my lifting career, I thought I would spare people the expense, and at the same time give them something better. Unlike other companies, I won't sell anything I'm not willing to pay for myself.
There is a tiny bit of research on BCAA taken during exercise. For things like running or cycling they don't really do anything but increase the oxidation of BCAAs. There was one study on weight lfiting that showed that the muscle will use the supplemental BCAAs (7 grams taken before) to oxidize rather than those it has floating around already. That can be a good thing.
Simply taking a whole protein supplement that is high in BCAAs before exercise is just as, if not more, effective and more cost effective.
For example, in a 35 gram serving of Primer, you get 7.2 grams of BCAAs. This serving costs about $0.80 .
Now take a common BCAA supplement like Sportpharma's BCAA and 7 grams of BCAA costs $1.36, almost twice as much.
Not only that but Primer also supplies 7 gms of glutamine in the same serving.
If I would have thought BCAA+glutamine to be superior to the protein I put together for pre-workout, I would have simply put together BCAA+glutamine instead. But as I have also spent a lot of money on BCAAs and every other kind of AA in my lifting career, I thought I would spare people the expense, and at the same time give them something better. Unlike other companies, I won't sell anything I'm not willing to pay for myself.
Lil Popa Pump
New Member
Bryan, let me first say that your attitude is refreshing for this industry. I the next time I need to purchase protein powder, it will be HSN because I would like to support people like you (and this is not just based on this thread, but from everything I've read since I started lurking here).
I think you are probably right about the glutamine. However, people, myself included, have noticed a benefit from sipping 20g-30g of BCAAs throughout a workout. It seems that it would be difficult to ingest that much Primer pre-workout.
In the future this will be my plan: I am thinking Primer as a pre-workout supp, Glutacene during, Driver post. I will probably cut the Glutacene dose down because of the Primer (and to a lesser extent the Driver).
As far as research goes, there is quite a bit out there on the benefits of leucine (and I guess it is speculated that the others (BCAAs) work in a similar fashion:
The American Journal of Physiology, Oct 2002 v283 i4 pE824(12)
Tissue-specific effects of chronic dietary leucine and norleucine supplementation on protein synthesis in rats. (Abstract) Christopher J. Lynch; Susan M. Hutson; Brian J. Patson; Alain Vaval; Thomas C. Vary.
Diabetes, April 2002 v51 i4 p928(9)
Orally administered leucine enhances protein synthesis in skeletal muscle of diabetic rats in the absence of increases in 4E-BP1 or S6K1 phosphorylation. Joshua C. Anthony; Ali K. Reiter; Tracy G. Anthony; Stephen J. Crozier; Charles H. Lang; David A. MacLean; Scot R. Kimball; Leonard S. Jefferson.
The American Journal of Physiology, Sept 2001 v281 i3 pE466
Leucine and insulin activate p70 S6 kinase through different pathways in human skeletal muscle. JEFFREY S. GREIWE; GUIM KWON; MICHAEL L. McDANIEL; CLAY F. SEMENKOVICH
Granted these are just a few studies to support a "BCAA hypothesis", but interesting nonetheless...(and if you can cite studies on rats for creatine, I can do it for BCAAs!!
)
I think you are probably right about the glutamine. However, people, myself included, have noticed a benefit from sipping 20g-30g of BCAAs throughout a workout. It seems that it would be difficult to ingest that much Primer pre-workout.
In the future this will be my plan: I am thinking Primer as a pre-workout supp, Glutacene during, Driver post. I will probably cut the Glutacene dose down because of the Primer (and to a lesser extent the Driver).
As far as research goes, there is quite a bit out there on the benefits of leucine (and I guess it is speculated that the others (BCAAs) work in a similar fashion:
The American Journal of Physiology, Oct 2002 v283 i4 pE824(12)
Tissue-specific effects of chronic dietary leucine and norleucine supplementation on protein synthesis in rats. (Abstract) Christopher J. Lynch; Susan M. Hutson; Brian J. Patson; Alain Vaval; Thomas C. Vary.
Diabetes, April 2002 v51 i4 p928(9)
Orally administered leucine enhances protein synthesis in skeletal muscle of diabetic rats in the absence of increases in 4E-BP1 or S6K1 phosphorylation. Joshua C. Anthony; Ali K. Reiter; Tracy G. Anthony; Stephen J. Crozier; Charles H. Lang; David A. MacLean; Scot R. Kimball; Leonard S. Jefferson.
The American Journal of Physiology, Sept 2001 v281 i3 pE466
Leucine and insulin activate p70 S6 kinase through different pathways in human skeletal muscle. JEFFREY S. GREIWE; GUIM KWON; MICHAEL L. McDANIEL; CLAY F. SEMENKOVICH
Granted these are just a few studies to support a "BCAA hypothesis", but interesting nonetheless...(and if you can cite studies on rats for creatine, I can do it for BCAAs!!
)
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that BCAAs aren't great. I really do agree with you. I was just talking from a "cost" perspective.[b said:
In fact, my original plans were to add signifcant amounts of luecine to the Primer. But in the end I couldn't hide the taste... In the future I may still attempt to up the BCAA content, as long as it doesn't effect the price and taste too much.
Lil Popa Pump
New Member
My bad. I thought you were saying 7 is enough.
Taste is certainly an issue. However, those of us who used to buy the Weider weight gainers back in the 80's-early 90's might be able to stomach it better than others!
Taste is certainly an issue. However, those of us who used to buy the Weider weight gainers back in the 80's-early 90's might be able to stomach it better than others!