Deadlifting

Right, and in my opinion, it is the wiser man who chooses to wait for his forearms to catch up.

Having said that, after reading this thread, I may use a reverse grip as an absolute last resort occasionally during the end of the 5s instead of completely writing it off as I have all these years.

Will never use straps though.
 
If you're a bodybuilder, it just doesn't make sense and isn't prudent to not use straps while you wait for your grip to catch up to your back.  Why slow down progress on your back ?  You don't need to deadlift without straps to strengthen your grip.When I got up to 585 in deads my grip totally gave out and I had to work on it using static holds and grippers.  I used straps so my back would continue growing.  I've pulled 775 lbs in competition with no straps, and still use straps for heavy shrugs.   Don't understand guys who won't use straps if they need them, must some sort of pride thing, but...whatever floats your boat.
 
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(stevejones @ Nov. 21 2006,12:32)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">If you're a bodybuilder, it just doesn't make sense and isn't prudent to not use straps while you wait for your grip to catch up to your back. Why slow down progress on your back ? You don't need to deadlift without straps to strengthen your grip.When I got up to 585 in deads my grip totally gave out and I had to work on it using static holds and grippers. I used straps so my back would continue growing. I've pulled 775 lbs in competition with no straps, and still use straps for heavy shrugs. Don't understand guys who won't use straps if they need them, must some sort of pride thing, but...whatever floats your boat.</div>
I agree completely. It is stupid to compromise your progress on a major bodypart just because a very small muscle group cannot keep up with it. What do you expect? Your forearms are never going to progress as fast as your back for obvious reasons, unless you are a newbie. That's like expecting your neck muscles to progress as fast as your legs.
 
I've been reading the workout journal of a guy who pulls close to 600 at 5'8&quot; and around 180-190 lbs. He was injured for a while when he lost his grip on one side of the bar and didn't let go quickly enough with the other.

I have relatively small hands and one hand has an old injury to my fingers and will never be as strong as the other. Like stevejones, I do static holds and use grippers, then use straps when I need them. It's better than dropping a heavy bar and risking injury. For those who never use straps I guess they never do rack pulls or power shrugs for reps with more than they can deadlift.

I've gotta go with Steve and Tot on this one.
 
Am I only one that uses a completely underhand grip ( palms up)?? Only sometimes on deadlift, but I almost always use underhand for rows. Is this an issue?
 
My grip is insanely strong for my weight...rigth now it is my back and legs which give out, not my grip. I have seen guys dead-lift over 800 lb.s without straps. To each his own.
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(scientific muscle @ Nov. 21 2006,14:12)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I have seen guys dead-lift over 800 lb.s without straps.</div>
Overhand or over/under? Just curious.

I've looked at the video of Andy Bolton pulling just over 1000, and it sure looks like he used a mixed grip. I'm pretty sure that most heavy pullers use over/under, but as long as your grip is secure double overhand is great. If in doubt, though, opt for whatever is required for safety would be my recommendation.
 
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(Lifting N Tx @ Nov. 21 2006,17:02)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"><div>
(scientific muscle @ Nov. 21 2006,14:12)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I have seen guys dead-lift over 800 lb.s without straps.</div>
Overhand or over/under? Just curious.

I've looked at the video of Andy Bolton pulling just over 1000, and it sure looks like he used a mixed grip.  I'm pretty sure that most heavy pullers use over/under, but as long as your grip is secure double overhand is great. If in doubt, though, opt for whatever is required for safety would be my recommendation.</div>
Ain't no way it's double overhanded. No one can do that. Bolton's 1003 deadlift is definitely alternate grip. He's been competing that way since he was 20 yrs old, just like everyone else.
 
How do you guys work the grippers and static holds into your workout schedule? Do you do them at the end of your normal workouts or on off days? I need to work on grip strength and I'm not sure what the best way is to work them in.
 
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(Bulldog @ Nov. 21 2006,21:43)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">How do you guys work the grippers and static holds into your workout schedule?  Do you do them at the end of your normal workouts or on off days?  I need to work on grip strength and I'm not sure what the best way is to work them in.</div>
I do static holds at the end of my workout.  I stand in power rack with 70% of my max on deads and hold the bar double overhanded for as long as possible.  I do that about 3 or 4 times.  When i was trying to get my grip stronger, I got involved with grippers and it's a hobby of mine now.  I have a captains of crush collection and also like heavy grips.  I love gripping, but it's easy to overtrain it and hurt yourself, so I wouldn't recommend it more than 3 times per week for short sessions.  

Static holds will do more to help your deadlifts than grippers will.  There is some crossover strength from grippers to deadlifts, but gripping is primarily squeezing strength, not holding.  You can also pinch weights together, work with blobs...there's a ton of stuff out there, but IMO the best thing to help you with deads is static holds (and double overhanded deads or shrugs too).  Get yourself a pair of grippers and work with them from time to time.  They have to be something like captains of crush or heavy grips.  It will do you no good to go to dicks sporting goods and buy some plastic gizmo that you can squeeze 50 times

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4GzrW2-ovM  --- here's magnus samuelsson closing a captains of crush #4 TWICE....i can't tell you how unbelievable that is.  I doubt there are more than 10 men on earth who can do that...he might be the only one, actually.  Only 5 guys at ironmind are certified #4 closers.  Ok enough about gripping...you shouldn't have got me started on it.
 
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(Bulldog @ Nov. 22 2006,02:43)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">How do you guys work the grippers and static holds into your workout schedule?  Do you do them at the end of your normal workouts or on off days?  I need to work on grip strength and I'm not sure what the best way is to work them in.</div>
you can also try using an extra thick bar,or wraping something around the bar to make it thicker,
another way is hanging from a pullup bar for as long as you can.
 
Steve and Tot,

For me it isn't a pride thing. I was taught this it sets up a potential for injury to happen.

In the case of a mixed grip, the torque caused by the grip could result in injury, especially on the last reps of a heavy set when form starts to fail.

In the case of straps, well, you are strapped in and can't let go when you might need to.

I do hear what u guys are saying about neglecting the back. Just that nothing is worth it if u get inured and can't work out at all while recovering.

However, if the safety issue is complete and total bull, I would sure like to know and start incorporating these tricks into my routine.
 
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(stevejones @ Nov. 21 2006,22:20)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">
Bulldog said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4GzrW2-ovM  --- here's magnus samuelsson closing a captains of crush #4 TWICE....i can't tell you how unbelievable that is.  I doubt there are more than 10 men on earth who can do that...he might be the only one, actually.  Only 5 guys at ironmind are certified #4 closers.  Ok enough about gripping...you shouldn't have got me started on it.</div>
the guy is strong but his form sucks. I guarantee he couldn´t curl 140kg ONCE without swinging the weight. 50% of his curl strength comes from the momentum generated by the swing.
Click to expand...
 
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(nipponbiki @ Nov. 22 2006,03:40)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Steve and Tot,

For me it isn't a pride thing. I was taught this it sets up a potential for injury to happen.

In the case of a mixed grip, the torque caused by the grip could result in injury, especially on the last reps of a heavy set when form starts to fail.

In the case of straps, well, you are strapped in and can't let go when you might need to.

I do hear what u guys are saying about neglecting the back. Just that nothing is worth it if u get inured and can't work out at all while recovering.

However, if the safety issue is complete and total bull, I would sure like to know and start incorporating these tricks into my routine.</div>
I've done singles with my 1 RM and never had any problems. As long as your form doesn't go to crap, I don't see it being a problem. I don't use straps yet, but I do use a mixed grip. Once I get to 500 lbs, maybe I'll have to start using straps, and I definitely will once grip strength becomes an issue. However, I just don't see it being a safety issue as long as you pay attention to form. You shouldn't be deadlifting if your form isn't good... and if you think about it, going by all this reasoning, deadlifting in itself would be a safety issue.
 
definitely if you cannot deadlift properly, don't...you will hurt yourself.

No can lift a weight that is physically impossible for the individual...so if you know you can lift it and your form is good...then lift...but if your grip gives in, then use alternate grip or straps.

Straps is not going to allow you to lift more than you can pull off the ground!
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(drpierredebs @ Nov. 22 2006,03:53)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"><div>
(stevejones @ Nov. 21 2006,22:20)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">
Bulldog said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4GzrW2-ovM  --- here's magnus samuelsson closing a captains of crush #4 TWICE....i can't tell you how unbelievable that is.  I doubt there are more than 10 men on earth who can do that...he might be the only one, actually.  Only 5 guys at ironmind are certified #4 closers.  Ok enough about gripping...you shouldn't have got me started on it.</div>
the guy is strong but his form sucks. I guarantee he couldn´t curl 140kg ONCE without swinging the weight. 50% of his curl strength comes from the momentum generated by the swing.</div>
Yeah, but I don't care about the curls. The point was to show his grip strength.
Click to expand...
 
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(nipponbiki @ Nov. 22 2006,03:40)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Steve and Tot,

For me it isn't a pride thing. I was taught this it sets up a potential for injury to happen.

In the case of a mixed grip, the torque caused by the grip could result in injury, especially on the last reps of a heavy set when form starts to fail.

In the case of straps, well, you are strapped in and can't let go when you might need to.

I do hear what u guys are saying about neglecting the back. Just that nothing is worth it if u get inured and can't work out at all while recovering.

However, if the safety issue is complete and total bull, I would sure like to know and start incorporating these tricks into my routine.</div>
A double overhanded grip with straps is actually very safe. It's safer than an alternate grip because with an alternate grip you risk tearing a bicep (so I've been told by other p'lifters anyway). You can release the weight immediately with straps as long as you don't do something crazy like wrapping the strap around the bar.
 
Bulldog, I don't pull anywhere near as heavy as stevejones, but pretty much do the same. Moderate work with grippers that are strong enough to be fairly difficult for me to close on off days. After I do power shrugs or deadlifts I'll put the weight on the pins of my power rack. I'll lift it a couple of inches with a double overhand grip and just hold it as long as I can. I usually do 3 sets like that. Seems to be helping.

Steve and Sci Muscle, thanks, I was pretty sure that almost everyone doing really heavy deads used an over/under grip. Was just verifying what Sci was saying based on some of the discussion about double overhand.

Interesting what leigelord brought up about the hook grip. I wonder how the grip required for a world class Olympic lifter to clean 550lbs plus compares to what is needed to pull in the 900-1000 pound range. It's a lot less weight, but a lot more acceleration. The really critical part of a clean pull is after the bar passes the knees, which is a really strong pulling position.

I may play with the hook grip a bit. Unfortunately my injured hand can only use my index finger to secure the thumb, so it won't be as strong as with both index and middle fingers on the thumb.
 
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