Elliot Hulse's Advanced 5x5 - Thoughts?

Discussion in 'Strength-Specific Training (SST)' started by Browner, Feb 9, 2015.

  1. Browner

    Browner Well-Known Member


    I was wondering if any one had seen, tried, or has any thoughts on Eliot Hulse's advanced 5x5 program. Sample program attached.

    I'm currently running it for a few cycles to see if I make any strength gains from it.

    Attached Files:

  2. Totentanz

    Totentanz Super Moderator Staff Member

    I don't really like it that much to be honest. I generally don't like DB exercises if your primary goal is raw strength. If the goal is something else, then yeah, DB exercises have their place and some exercises are pretty great with DBs (DB Rows) but I don't like anything where you put a DB over your head, seen two bad accidents with that which is two too many. Some people say that single arm DB presses are good for balance, but I think if you want balance then there are much better ways to get that.

    But. All that aside, you will most likely make some strength gains on this. I think there are much better strength programs out there though and I believe that a properly laid out HST program would be superior.
    Browner likes this.
  3. Browner

    Browner Well-Known Member

    Thanks Tot

    Its good to get someone elses feedback, and yours is one I certainly respect. Until this week i have been running HST over the last year, and made some really good progress, both in strength and size, so just fancied a bit of a change. My main goal is strength, however I am not a powerlifter or strongman, and I work out purely as a hobby, so it is not essential that I make massive gains in strength, although it is always nice. Im going to stick with it for 3 months, and see what progress I make. I may substitute the DB lunges and DB step ups with Barbell Lunges and Barbell Step ups instead though based on what you have said above.

    My current 1 rep maxes are;
    Deadlifts : 205kg
    Squat: 155kg
    OHP: 74kg
    Bench: 115kg

    I'll test them again in a few months to see how much progress I made on this program.
  4. Mattonaise

    Mattonaise Member

    Totentanz how would you adjust HST to develop better strength gains? Since you think a properly laid out HST program would be better.
  5. Totentanz

    Totentanz Super Moderator Staff Member

    Pretty simple. Skip 15s, add 3s after the 5s and do max singles on the big three the last couple weeks of the cycle. Keep volume a little more conservative and keep load a little closer to the RMs. Don't do unnecessary stuff like curls or tricep kickbacks, choose lift selection with strength gains in mind. I can flesh out an actual program later.
    Browner, Mattonaise and leonardopm like this.
  6. Mattonaise

    Mattonaise Member

    So two weeks in 10s, to weeks in 5s, two weeks of 3s, then two weeks of max singles? And keep the increments smaller like 2.5-5 pounds. Sounds interesting.
  7. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    I wouldn't take Hulse's advice on anything. He's strong but the guy has stated multiple times that he values anecdotal experience over empirical evidence, not to mention he peddles all of that "body spirit energy" shit (does paid seminars on it now).
  8. Mattonaise

    Mattonaise Member

    Didn't he quit YouTube because of the backlash against him over that spiritual stuff? Maybe it was just hearsay. He had some solid advice from time to time, not all the time, but occasionally.
  9. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    He preached all this "don't care what other people think" stuff and then some of his videos get lambasted by a couple of fitness commentators and he quits Youtube and now does body energy seminars.

    Snake-oil salesman if you ask me.
  10. Jester

    Jester Well-Known Member

    He quit because he went from using science to using anecdotes.

    I have no beef with someone who has evolved their beliefs, but that doesn't mean that evolution is necessarily positive.

    I don't think he did it for money - he'll be making less of it doing what he is doing now.
  11. Browner

    Browner Well-Known Member

    That would be awesome if you could. My goal this year is quite a simple one. Deadlift 500 pounds, Squat 400 pounds and Bench 300 Pounds. If always trained for Hypertrophy, but this year I wanted to see how strong I can get.

    My current 1 Rep Maxes are;
    Deadlift - 460 lbs
    Squat - 350 lbs
    Bench - 260 lbs
  12. TangoDown

    TangoDown Member

    Oh, I don't think he did it for the money. He probably makes less considering his Youtube monetization (of course that may have not ended as people still watch his videos...don't know Youtube's policy on inactivity from partners), but at the same time, straying from an open forum like Youtube gets rid of dissenting voices.

    The main problem I have with him is his marketing of bioenergetic analysis as a way to treat people's depression and anxiety. Sure, just believing that something will provide relief is a strong placebo, but then he's "rainmaking" people
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2015
  13. Browner

    Browner Well-Known Member

    I am going to continue this Eliot Hulse 5x5 until the end of the first cycle, as I don't like switching programs, however I have penciled out the following program based on your points above;

    Day 1 (Mon)
    Military Press
    Lat Pull Down
    Close Grip Bench

    Day 2 (Tue)
    Front Squat
    Barbel Step Ups

    Day 3 (Thur)
    Incline Bench
    Military Press

    Day 4 (Fri)
    Front Squat
    Leg Press
    Barbel Step Ups

    The reps and sets I would run would be;
    Main lifts - Bench/Squat/Front Squat/Incline Bench/Military Press/Deadlift;
    • Weeks 1 -2 - 5x5 (Starting with 80% of 1RM)
    • Weeks 3 - 5 - 5x3 (Starting with 85% of 1RM)
    • Weeks 6-7 - 5x2 (Starting with 90% of 1RM)
    • Week 8 - 5x1 (Push for new 1RM's)
    Assistance - Lat Pull Down/SLDL/BB Step Ups/Leg Press;
    • Weeks 1 - 2 - 2x12
    • Weeks 3-5 - 2x10
    • Weeks 6-8 3x6
    Would be interested to know your thoughts, my aim for this program is purely for strength, and to get the 1RM of the "Big 3" up. Also if you feel this is a good layout, I would run for a number of cycles.

  14. leonardopm

    leonardopm Member


    If you allow me a question ...if your goal is purely strength why don't you do a DUP program? There are studies supporting undulating periodization as being superior to linear programs. And it's less boring...
  15. Mattonaise

    Mattonaise Member

    I've heard similarly. I think there was a post on here not to long ago but is it possible to combine HST with DUP? The constant progression in weight in an HST program seems to run against DUP.
  16. Browner

    Browner Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the suggestion, although what is a DUP program? Do you have an example of one? Thanks
  17. mickc1965

    mickc1965 Well-Known Member

    Browner likes this.
  18. leonardopm

    leonardopm Member

    Google "dup bodybuilding" and you'll get on the first page some good sources for an overview. There are some example routines on most of these sites.
    Browner likes this.
  19. adpowah

    adpowah Active Member

    @mickc1965 @Browner I updated my logs with my current progress and workout setup. So far I have really enjoyed DUP. Not that HST isn't great but DUP just fits my personality a little better.
    Browner likes this.
  20. Browner

    Browner Well-Known Member

    Thanks to everyone for their input, really appreciate that. I am almost finished the Eliot Hulse 5x5 4 week cycle, I posted above, and it has left my CNS fried. I am going to take a week off (SD if you will) and have a think what program to go for next, whether it be HST, DUP, 5x5 or Wendler. I am leaning towards a Wendler 5/3/1 or DUP program. But what ever I choose, I will stick with for the next 6 months.

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