Max OT to HST - Some Advice please

Since you are pretty advanced, you may need to up the volume. How many sets are you doing? I try to get 20-40 total reps per muscle group per session. Something like 2x15, 3x10 & 6x5, for example gives you a total volume of 30 reps per exercise.
 
Thanks for your reply.

So I should increase volume? I have tried reading up on this, but Brian is not real clear on what to do. He does not seem to be updating any of the information either.

At the moment I am doing the following;

2 Sets - Squats
2 Sets - Military Press
3 Sets - 1 - Arm narrow grip bench for triceps
6 sets for biceps (these are my lagging body part)
3 sets for calves

So I should do more than this? My workouts are full on and I am wiped out big time at the end (today I struggled to complete the workout).

Thanks.
 
I am about 214lbs now. I have definitely become a little more pudgy. The waist has actually expanded 2". So maybe I am eating too much? I am not really calorie counting. I am not eating junk food either. My typical diet would be as follows;

Breakfast
Yoghurt and Almonds
Whey Protein Drink
Coffee

Morning Tea
Cottage Cheese
Almonds
Coffee

Lunch
Chicken Breasts
2 eggs
Whey Protein Drink

Afternoon Tea
Cottage Cheese
Almonds

Dinner
Stir Fry or Steak/salad or Chicken/vegetables

Before Bed
Whey Protein Drink

I limit sodas, chips and that sort of thing.

Thanks
 
You are gaining weight too fast. Cut back on the calories, since you are gaining bodyfat. I think you are being too impatient. HST is the fastest muscle growth training I know of, but it isn't magic. You have been training for 20 years, and now you have tried a HST program for a month or so, and you are disappointed???:rolleyes:
Someone as advanced as you are will be lucky to gain 5 lb.s of muscle in a year. A skinny beginner can easily put on 20 lb.s or more in a year, an intermediate bodybuilder, maybe 10-15 lb.s tops. An advanced bodybuilder with some established muscle size and years of training like yourself, will gain muscle very slowly, no matter how great the training and diet is.
Unless you are on a high-tech cycle of anabolic drugs, you are not going to gain muscle rapidly at this point, no matter what. And you will never have arnold-like arms, ever, since everyone has different muscle shapes and genetics. I am the opposite of you, in that my arms easily grow, even with no isolations, and yet I have to work my ass off to get my back and chest to grow! I wish I had the pectoral muscles you claim to have!
Anyway, at your advanced stage, you will have to train with HST principles for at least 6 months to a year, in order to gauge how effective it is for you.
Be patient. your training looks fine. As far as volume, in the HST FAQ, Bryan puts it nicely:

If you are doing HST properly you won't be able to just increase your volume at will. If you are doing HST properly you should already be using as much volume as you can reasonably handle and still feel healthy (no injuries etc).

HST builds strength sure enough, however, the actual manifestation of that strength depends on the recovery of the CNS (and other neuromuscular factors) from workout to workout. Sometimes a person will gain a little ground on their CNS recovery and their strength output will go up. Those who zigzag are more likely to experience significant "strength" gains mid cycle.

The size gains are dependant on what's happening to the tissue. This of course is dependant on the absolute load as well as the relative condition of the tissue at the time.

So, should you increase, maintain or decrease "volume" as the cycle progresses? It depends! I know how many people hate to hear that...but its true. Here is how you decide. Keep in mind that these factors are to considered “collectively”, meaning each factor must be weighted, not taken as an absolute indicator.

Increase volume if:

You are never sore
You are never tired
You are not growing

Maintain volume if:

You are slightly sore most of the time
You are tired enough to sleep well, but not so tired you lose motivation to train.
You are noticeably “fuller”

Decrease volume if:

You are experiencing over use pain, and strain symptoms in joints and/or muscles.
You are tired and irritable all the time, yet don’t sleep well.
Strength levels are significantly decreasing.

I said, “The number of Sets is determined by the minimum effective volume (this changes over time according to current load and Conditioning.)" You said, “I thought … that the expression of the hypertrophic genes was increased in proportion to time under tension, i.e. 'more is better' up to a rational point.”

If I understand correctly, you are concerned about the “minimum” effective volume part. Why should a person adjust the # of sets according to the minimum effective volume if “more is better”? Answer, because other factors such as Training Load and Training Frequency are inversely related to training volume. In other words, the higher the volume of exercise, the lower the Load and Frequency that can be effectively maintained over time. Likewise, the lower the training volume, the higher the Training Load and Training Frequency that can be effectively maintained.

It is just a matter of defining “minimum”. In this case, “minimum” means as many sets as you can do without having to reduce the Load from set to set and the without having to reduce the frequency beyond 48 hours.
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Thanks for getting back to me. I was just basing my results this cycle to last cycle, so I was a little disappointed based on that. I have trained off and on over 20 years, but would not say that I am a advanced. Maybe an intermediate.

I am going to cut back on calories and see how that goes.

Thanks.
 
Yeah, natural bodybuilding just takes time. It sucks, but once we get past the beginner stage to intermediate/advanced, it just takes a long time to build muscles. This is why so many people keep looking for the magic training formula, or just go to steroids.
Keep chugging at it. You might want to do dips and chinups, they ahve always been the BEST arm-builders for me, plus you will get some work for your chest and lats. Right now you have nothing for your pecs or back muscles, which you may end up regretting.
 
With my Pecs, they just grow so fast. SO fast. I decided to back off on them this cycle because I felt they were causing a big imbalance in my physique.

At the moment, I am doing 1-arm reverse grip dumbbell rows (for my biceps as I cannot do many chin ups) and I feel this works my back as well. With my Pecs, I am doing 1-arm bench presses with arms close to my side to work triceps, but I feel this works my lower pecs too. I have not been a big fan of dips and my wrists are an issue too.

Next week when I get on my 5's, I will try and start introducing some chin ups. It may mean I cannot do the chin ups until the 2 weeks of the 5RM's and where I try to add 10lbs over those 2 weeks. For some reason I have always struggled to do many chin ups.

I like keeping my exercise selection small as it means I can get through the work out quick with good intensity. If there is any improvements to my exercise selection, please feel free to comment.

I workout at home with basic free weights. My chest is the fastest responding body part, just need a little more work on lower pecs. Size wise, they are big enough.

Thanks,
 
Exercises should be fine. Try to include chinups. If you can work up to 20 straight underhand, close grip chinups, your biceps will be huge! good luck renky. Maybe start a HST log. It helps motivation.
 
This may sound a bit silly to ask, but...

I feel I need to start looking into making my routine an am/pm setup. Currently what I have now goes too long and is just too exhausting on me.

So here is what I am thinking and would welcome any feedback;


AM

Chin Ups - 2 sets
Hammer Curls - 2 Sets
Dumbbell Curls - 2 Sets
Calf Raises - 3 Sets
Narrow grip bench for triceps - 3 Sets

(I may be doing too many sets for biceps, so I may cut this back a little)


PM

Bench Press - 1 Set
Military Press - 3 Sets
Hack Squats - 3 Sets

I am keen for a second opinion. Thanks.
 
Hm. There are many options I think.

Whats up wth a push/pull split? Also I miss some rowing.

For example:
AM:
Push:
Hack squat
Bench PRess
Military Press
Narrow grip bench
Calf Raises

PM:
Pull:
Leg Curls or Romanian Deadlift
Chin up
Row Variation (Bent over, Dumbell,Cabel)
Hammer Curl
Dumbbel Curl
Crunch

REgarding Curls stuff:
Some need isos. Some not. I need them too.
Also if somebody argues with the point that when rowing with 100´s of pounds he or she might have great bizeps.
THATS true.
But isos will you get faster there instead waiting some years before chinning 90´s plates for reps.
 
I strongly disagree that iso's will increase progression more quickly than compounds. If anything, IMO, iso's for the arms are only of any real value if/when you start to plateau from compounds only.

Bicep curls are great for increasing tendon strength however, but if you can find me 5 people who can do strict repetitions at their 5RM I'll be mightily impressed. Heavy chins, supine rowing and metabolic work from iso's (8reps at minimum, 10-15 is better).

When you see a natural lifter with magnificent guns, chances are they're from deadlifts, presses, chins, rowing and dips.
 
I think it depends how much tensions the target muscle gets.
If you do really correct rows to target the lats/middle back you pull with the elbows and the back to move the weight.
Of course the biz. will get stimulated too. But they would get MORE stimulated if you row with your biceps. (which is not the goal of course).
It depends I think how much stimuli a person needs for growth. When bodyparts are seriously lagging I would suggest to specialize on them or incorporate some isos.
Because even when getting stronger on the compounds-the weakest link will always be the weakest link in the chain and less stimulated than other bodyparts involved in the exercise.
And the guns don´t come from the deadlift. Except the trainee is curling the weight.

I agree on the rest though. I am also fine with metabolic work regarding the isos. This way the joints will also thank you.
 
You can't do pulling movements without bending your arms. It's that's simple. You can't do pushing movements without straightening your arms.

Deadlifts will absolutely build your biceps, better than any curl, no matter how concentrated or isolated you think it is. The tension being placed upon the muscle is simply greater. I would recommend doing 15's just to get concentric metabolic work done, that's where curls (isolation movements) can be useful.

However, anyone doing DB curls with 25kgs and expecting growth to be larger than doing chins, deads and rows is in for a rough surprise. Don't waste your time on them.

Please point me to the empirical evidence that suggests that the least strong muscle in a compound will be less stimulated for hypertrophy than the stronger muscles? And then the evidence suggesting isolations can 'make up' this difference? It's simply doesn't add up with the evidence supporting heavy compounds producing the most hypertrophy in natural//unassisted lifters.
 
Ok. regarding the deadlift:
The primary role of the bicep is to supinate the forearm, and secondary function to aid the brachialis flex the arm, and the third function is to pull the humerus/upper arm upwards.
The second and third functions are activated in deadlifts through stabilising the arm position in an isometric contraction. The muscle tenses against the resistance but doesn't shorten.
So they do get worked but only isometric. They don´t work in their complete function.
Its like working the shoulders and triceps only with overhead squats.

I beg my ass that when somebody is just doing deads and NOTHING else compared to s.b.who deadlift AND curl that the second guy will have larger guns.

Of course compounds are the bang for your buck. I did Cable Crosses 10 years ago.
It depends how the tension is getting distributed. Of course this depends on leverages of the person in question too.

LEts take bench for example. Close Grip vs. regular bench. In the close Grip the tricpes is in an advantaged position to push. Also the pecs get worked but to a far lesser degree than regular benching. The tricpes takes the main load.
And I don´t regard a close grip bench press as the best chest builder.

Reverse in regular benching: Here the chest gets mainly worked and the tricpes too-but the chest takes the main load.
And i would regard close grip benches a better tricpes builder than regular bench because the tension and the load is more focused on the triceps.

I don´t want to say that compounds doesn´t work-they do but I don´t think each compound is similar optimal for each person.
The muscle which takes the main tension and load will also grow the fastest and the most. Thats just logical.
This doesn´t mean that other parts won´t get stimulated. But at a lesser degree. And how good they grow depends on their threshold they need. Also this is different from person to person.

In my case my triceps grows much faster when including triceps work. Be it close grip bench or nosebreakers-but I need more load and tension on the triceps.
Regarding my delts: Laterals are not needed. They always grew fine on Dumbbell Presses. No problem here-but only benching for delts (which of course are also involved in benching) is too less.
I need the Shoulder Presses for added tension and overloading the shoulders but no lateral raises.

So in my eyes the basics should always be the compounds. And regarding the results you tweak compounds to focus on the weaker muscle groups (regular bench-->close grip bench) or add isolations. (scull crushers)
 
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I came up with my AM/PM model based on lagging body parts being trained in the morning and the remaining being trained at night.

I workout alone and at home with a limited weight set, so the exercises I listed work really well.

Did my model of the AM/PM seem ok?

Thanks.
 
I like compounds for their efficiency in hitting a lot of muscle at once, but there is plenty of EMG evidence that isolation exercises are also just as effective.
 
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Sci said:
I like compounds for their efficiency in hitting a lot of muscle at once, but there is plenty of EMG evidence that isolation exercises are also just as effective.
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I've read that (or at least what was available when I read it), but I still can't anything that says isolations are necessary if you're already doing the compounds (ala the effect isn't cumulative). It would be awesome if it were the case but frankly, I haven't found anything that says they contribute to hypertrophy once you're doing compounds. The best things I'll say about isolations are these:

-They're great for injured bodyparts. You can train the non-affected side whilst the injured recovers and it's also a good way to re-introduce tension before restarting compounds.

-Fantastic for metabolic work. High-rep work for compounds definitely hits the major muscles in a disproportional amount to the minor muscles (high rep rows will exhaust the lats and traps more than bi's and forearms).

-V.good for joint health

-V.good for burning excess calories. This is often theorised as the reason that 60s-70s 'volume heavy' BB'ers displayed a markedly different physique to those in the 80's and early 90's. Clearly pharmaceutical improvement are relevant too, but you do rarely see a 70's era lifter who carried the extra fat.



@CG bench being a triceps isolation exercise - it is absolutely not an isolation exercise. It obviously utilises the triceps in greater proportion to the chest and anterior delts, compared to a 'regular' or wide grip but it's a compound and not an isolation. Personally, my opinion is that the reason it is so effective for the triceps is because of its compound nature which enables a greater load compared to skullcrushers or rope-pulls or triceps extensions.

There is always a minor variance across each person, some people have unnatural deltoids (hello Dwight Howard), others have ridiculous biceps peaks without assistance (Karl Malone etc), symmetrically shaped abs/not symmetrical etc. Muscle still grows the same way.

Re: tension on biceps in the deadlift - it doesn't shorten, but concentric work is not the be all of muscle growth. Similarly, your triceps and delts WILL respond to overhead squats (obviously not to the same degree as performing a pushing press, just like biceps need the pulling motion of rows and chins to get concentric work done).
 
Renky said:
This may sound a bit silly to ask, but...

I feel I need to start looking into making my routine an am/pm setup. Currently what I have now goes too long and is just too exhausting on me.

So here is what I am thinking and would welcome any feedback;


AM

Chin Ups - 2 sets
Hammer Curls - 2 Sets
Dumbbell Curls - 2 Sets
Calf Raises - 3 Sets
Narrow grip bench for triceps - 3 Sets

(I may be doing too many sets for biceps, so I may cut this back a little)


PM

Bench Press - 1 Set
Military Press - 3 Sets
Hack Squats - 3 Sets

I am keen for a second opinion. Thanks.
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I would add a 3rd set of chins. Other than that, I like it for an AM-PM split. I do a similar thing w/chins in the morning and the rest (pushing muscles upper body in the evening).
 
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