AAS and HST
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scientific muscle
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(Blizz @ Nov. 21 2007,21:36)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I don't think any AAS suplementation will have any benefits when working with submax weights but that's just me.
Blizz</div>
Wrong.
AAS can have significant anabolic effects even with NO training.
HST works well with or without AAS as it is, if anything the submax weights are more of a negative factor for natural trainees, not AAS users.
(Blizz @ Nov. 21 2007,21:36)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I don't think any AAS suplementation will have any benefits when working with submax weights but that's just me.
Blizz</div>
Wrong.
AAS can have significant anabolic effects even with NO training.
HST works well with or without AAS as it is, if anything the submax weights are more of a negative factor for natural trainees, not AAS users.
You would. Instead of progressing, say at a rate of 10 lbs. per workout on legs, you might find yourself going up at 15.
And food, being the main anabolic substance we use, has limits. Increase those anabolic limits and you have increased your rates of growth, regardless of changing routine. That has been proven over and again by everyone who had a dialed in diet/workout scheme and added AA's.
But again, your tendency would be to increase the loads or work, because you can easily do so.
With HST, you set your own increments anyway. With AA's you'd just set them higher.
And food, being the main anabolic substance we use, has limits. Increase those anabolic limits and you have increased your rates of growth, regardless of changing routine. That has been proven over and again by everyone who had a dialed in diet/workout scheme and added AA's.
But again, your tendency would be to increase the loads or work, because you can easily do so.
With HST, you set your own increments anyway. With AA's you'd just set them higher.
scientific muscle
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(ilalin @ Nov. 22 2007,10:39)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">You don't have to change rep/freq scheme, just increase the volume by increasing number of sets.</div>
Agree. Increasing volume is best for AAS-tweaking HST according to what I have read. Increasing load is not recommended because the muscles may become too strong while the tendons do not catch up that fast...very dangerous!
(ilalin @ Nov. 22 2007,10:39)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">You don't have to change rep/freq scheme, just increase the volume by increasing number of sets.</div>
Agree. Increasing volume is best for AAS-tweaking HST according to what I have read. Increasing load is not recommended because the muscles may become too strong while the tendons do not catch up that fast...very dangerous!
scientific muscle
New Member
....plus since AAS is such a potent hypertrophy stimulator, there is no need to go heavy. A sub-max load will have just as good results, given volume is proper. Now if pure STRENGTH is your goal while using AAS, then that is a different story. Then it would be wise to push the loads up, but CAREFULLY so as not to tear something!
Not only that, but during PCT, you do not want to reduce the weight you are using much, if at all. If you go too heavy while on AAS, obviously your strength will go down when you come off and you won't be able to maintain those weights, which could mean loss of muscle and strength during PCT.
I would personally push for new PRs but don't let it get way out of hand, so you at least have a good chance of maintaining your new strength during PCT.
I would personally push for new PRs but don't let it get way out of hand, so you at least have a good chance of maintaining your new strength during PCT.
Is it really, Tot? I would think that pushing just as hard as you can would equate to actually lifting those PR's for maintaining the gains. I mean, submax HST works from deconditioning, so to the muscle, the load is heavy anyway.
I may be wrong, but just thinking aloud.
Sci is right about the strength/tendons issue. The tendon points of insertion take much longer to strengthen than the muscle, and I didn't mean to infer that one should go heavy as possible; just that most guys tend to because it feels good.
Don't it though!
I may be wrong, but just thinking aloud.
Sci is right about the strength/tendons issue. The tendon points of insertion take much longer to strengthen than the muscle, and I didn't mean to infer that one should go heavy as possible; just that most guys tend to because it feels good.
Don't it though!
You should treat PCT like you would treat a cut.
You will have pretty much no testosterone for a while, so you'll want to work with heavy weights. If you go too heavy on cycle, you won't be able to maintain that strength come PCT. AAS increases strength considerably beyond what it would be if you weren't on AAS, so obviously when you come off, there is going to be a drop in strength.
Yeah, HST uses submax weights after deconditioning, but there is a difference. When you do this with HST, you have normal (probably) testosterone. During PCT, you do not. If I were in PCT, cutting back the load I am using would be the last resort. First, I would cut volume back. I would only cut back the load if I really, really had to.
You will have pretty much no testosterone for a while, so you'll want to work with heavy weights. If you go too heavy on cycle, you won't be able to maintain that strength come PCT. AAS increases strength considerably beyond what it would be if you weren't on AAS, so obviously when you come off, there is going to be a drop in strength.
Yeah, HST uses submax weights after deconditioning, but there is a difference. When you do this with HST, you have normal (probably) testosterone. During PCT, you do not. If I were in PCT, cutting back the load I am using would be the last resort. First, I would cut volume back. I would only cut back the load if I really, really had to.
youll need to start dropping the volume over a period of say two weeks after your last shot(i presume your using enanthate)as your test levels drop off, you will notice some degree of strength loss and possible joint pain.
like tot said, try and go as heavy as possible durin pct. its been a year or so since i did my cycle but i remember saying to myself i wouldnt go too heavy durin the cycle, in reality this is seldom a promise you can keep.i went as heavy as possible without injuring myself and i payed for it after the cycle, for a couple of weeks at least.
so try and take extra care with your joints, ive heard peolpe recommend creatine after the cycle(as u go into pct) this helps and gets some extra fluid in to the tendons etc.
like tot said, try and go as heavy as possible durin pct. its been a year or so since i did my cycle but i remember saying to myself i wouldnt go too heavy durin the cycle, in reality this is seldom a promise you can keep.i went as heavy as possible without injuring myself and i payed for it after the cycle, for a couple of weeks at least.
so try and take extra care with your joints, ive heard peolpe recommend creatine after the cycle(as u go into pct) this helps and gets some extra fluid in to the tendons etc.
You just verified one of my points. When you feel like a bull, you want to charge like a bull.
But I guess you could try and use "laziness" mentality, and keep the weights down a bit, but satisfy your urges with the volume as Tot suggested. I just remember the joy I had on PH's when my strength went thru the roof. Wow. That was a great high, and I wish I had known to lift heavy afterward...I lost 80% of my gains the first time. A similar high, but with a lot more effort was created with the Madcow 5x5 routine towards the end.
I suppose during a cycle one could also focus on strictest of form as a measure that would add difficulty with a payoff later.
But I guess you could try and use "laziness" mentality, and keep the weights down a bit, but satisfy your urges with the volume as Tot suggested. I just remember the joy I had on PH's when my strength went thru the roof. Wow. That was a great high, and I wish I had known to lift heavy afterward...I lost 80% of my gains the first time. A similar high, but with a lot more effort was created with the Madcow 5x5 routine towards the end.
I suppose during a cycle one could also focus on strictest of form as a measure that would add difficulty with a payoff later.
So if you need to drop the volume 2 weeks after the last AAS shot then how would that look within the HST format? COulod it work in a HST format?
Could I just string out the 10's for 3 weeks, the 5's for 3 weeks and then the Negs for 3 weeks and have the last administration during the first week of Negs? or something like that? Even string each of the rep ranges out to 4 weeks by doing each weight level twice or possibly using 2 different workouts (different excercises) and instead of having 3 increments (like you would in normal HST) have 6?
Cheers
Could I just string out the 10's for 3 weeks, the 5's for 3 weeks and then the Negs for 3 weeks and have the last administration during the first week of Negs? or something like that? Even string each of the rep ranges out to 4 weeks by doing each weight level twice or possibly using 2 different workouts (different excercises) and instead of having 3 increments (like you would in normal HST) have 6?
Cheers
personally i wouldnt worry too much about the increments when on aas, i think being so precise becomes less important. as long as you increment in a progressive fashion then thats all you need imo.
id just do a standard hst routine and just extend the 5's and the negatives.i sd,d after the last shot for 1 week and then returned to a more "normal" volume in my workout.
id just do a standard hst routine and just extend the 5's and the negatives.i sd,d after the last shot for 1 week and then returned to a more "normal" volume in my workout.