Optimal Cutting/Bulking PSMF/IF

Discussion in 'Diet & Nutrition' started by nkl, May 29, 2008.

  1. nkl

    nkl Member

    Well, the spokes are true:

    1) Nutrient cycling do change the oxidation rate of the nutrient being deprived, and also deplete the storage of the nutrient excluded.
    2) Excess protein cannot be stored. It is converted to urea, glucose and fat (oxidation and/or storage).
    3) Excess carbohydrades can be stored to a limit in muscle (oxidation) and liver (storage), and converted to fat in adipose tissue (storage).
    4) Fat will be stored in adipose tissue (storage) and muscle (oxidation).
    5) If insulin is present, more of the fat will be stored in adipose tissue, and less oxidized.
    6) Overall calorie intake affect basal metabolism in the long run and affect the amount of anabolic/catabolic hormones in circulation.
    7) Protein synthesis is stimulated by excercise and anabolic hormones.
    8) Protein synthesis is rate dependent on amount of available of amino acids, but is blunted if the amount is chronicly high.

    Bulking on a 24/24 (inside a larger bulking/cutting cycle) is still possible if you add more protein and fat on off-days, and add carbs and protein post-wo, but 24/24 more or less resembles nutrient cycling and you probably gain some fat because the weekly calorie intake exceeds your expenditure. Cardio steal calories = bad. The important thing is to go anabolic for the duration of the cycle, while lifting weights to stimulate PS and shift the p-ratio to our favor. Burning fat is the next step.

    During the cutting cycle 24/24 becomes a nutrient cycling thing again, but we cut down on the carbs as well as the fat. The benefits of cycling nutrients are that we do not completely deplete our storage of glucose, needed to lift heavy. The important thing is to eat less calories during the week than expended and keep a low fat intake during the cycle to burn fat, while providing protein and excerice to prevent catabolism of muscle tissue during cutting. Cardio steal calories = good.

    Do we call it 24/24 PSMF/IF? I'm not sure. It is more of a nutrient cycling thing. In an attempt to keep it 24/24 PSMF/IF, the caloric intake must be really high during the post-wo day to compensate for low calorie intake during the off-day, so the week total calories are higher than what you use. Do this mean I think total weekly calories are more important than short time deprivation? It would seem so.

    And what of the fear that the fast alterations of high/low calories may not be beneficial? Well, during the deprivation day, the stores of nutrient are shrinking, thus making room for more on the high calorie days, and thus the more you can eat before you are in the excess area. Cycling nutrients and lifting weights prevents insulin resistivity and other bad health effects coupled to pure bulking. On 24 hours you can eat the amount of food you need for bulking, so we do not 'explode' our gut either. For example, if you would need to eat 6000 calories over 48 hours, and the cutting day amounts to 1000 cals, then you have 3000 cals after workout (post-wo shake, late lunch, dinner and evening snack/shake) and another 2000 the next day (within 24 hours of workout - breakfast, snack/shake, lunch). That is similar to eating vanilla IF, but with a nights rest in between (8-10 hours fast).
  2. quadancer

    quadancer New Member

    Excellent overview, nkl, and I won't try to pick anything apart here...actually there's nothing I see questionable. Now we may want another on the 1w/1w for comparison, since you have nothing else to do... [​IMG]
    You said: <div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Second solution: Hm, shorten your cycle... For example, say 3 1/2 day/3 1/2 day - same as protein cycling. Not too long, not too short. Feast from wednesday noon to saturday evening (the second and third workout), then cut from sunday morning to wednesday noon (before workout). </div>
    It occurred to me that some will want a different start/endpoint, like us churchgoers who are forced (da debbil made me do it) to go eat tons of food with people who can really COOK...and the halfday mark may be harder to acheive than a full day, giving one a choice of perhaps a 3/4d or 4/3d PSMF/IF. I can see a choice there, the factor being wether you are cutting or bulking.
    Just another gear in the machine to spin.
  3. colby2152

    colby2152 New Member

    (scientific muscle @ May 30 2008,12:17)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"><div>
    (beingisbeing @ May 29 2008,11:53)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Can you guys give me ideas on calculating maintenance calories?</div>
    Yes. First: take a guess. Eat the same calories every day for a week or so. If you gain weight, your maintenence is lower than your guess, if you lose weight maintenence is more than your guess.

    Simple and very effective.</div>
    Or record the following each day:

    Calories consumed
    Calories burned in exercise
    Body weight

    After some time (at least two weeks), you will have all the necessary tools to figure out your BMR within 100 calories.

    The variable that is your BMR can be found each day by setting your weight change equal to the calories consumed - BMR - calories burned in exercise all divided by 3500. You can total or average these over a course of time for a much better number due to statistics (law of large numbers will give us a great result past a month of recording).

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