200, 300, 400, 500 - A quest for greatness

<div>
(mikeynov @ Oct. 04 2008,8:22)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">It is also clear to me that the old mantra of &quot;get stronger to get bigger&quot; is fundamentally flawed, that adding substantial strength past some point requires growing substantially more, which facilitates you getting stronger, not the other way around.</div>
Which is where Bryan was coming from with his development of HST.

It's also clear that in my case I am not able to maintain strength (let alone get any stronger as some seem to have managed) as I lose weight. Some of my strength loss has to be due to loss of muscle along with slight decreases in mechanical advantage due to muscle bellies also decreasing in diameter from fat loss.

So far I have reduced my starting bodyweight by about 11%. In most of my main compound exercises my strength has dropped off by around 9-10%. I'm pretty confident I can get it back quite quickly once I start eating over maintenance again (especially going by your recent experiments) but it still sucks.
 
<div>
(mikeynov @ Oct. 04 2008,2:22)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">It seems extremely clear to me at this point that &quot;strength training&quot; that does not represent a sufficient acute stimulus is not capable of driving progress in muscle mass for many, many trainees.

It is also clear to me that the old mantra of &quot;get stronger to get bigger&quot; is fundamentally flawed, that adding substantial strength past some point requires growing substantially more, which facilitates you getting stronger, not the other way around.</div>
I agree with this and think that I'm at that point for pressing strength now.

However, don't you think it's possible to gain size with a caloric surplus and have at least a fair amount of it be sarcoplasmic? Seems like Dan once said that rep ranges wouldn't affect the ratio of sarcoplasmic to sarcomere, though. If you can rely on a reasonable amount of any size gains being sarcomere, I suppose the question becomes one of when the increased size will drive increased strength. Given the way you've set things up, with low and high rep days, I'd think your neural efficiency would allow demonstrating increased strength in low rep ranges fairly quickly if you're truly adding sarcomere hypertrophy. Even with a standard HST setup, I've always heard that those who kept gaining were able to keep increasing their RMs pretty much each cycle. Since my focus is more on strength than size I guess I'd rather measure the desired end result, and I'm assuming that if I maintain decent neural efficiency increases in size ought to drive strength increases quickly.

Lol, I've been able to lose over 40lbs with no strength loss as a generally intermediate level lifter, but did so over a long period of time. I did lose size though I stopped keeping measurements. Perhaps that's part of the reason that, while I agree that size increases are now needed to get stronger, I'm skeptical about relying on size alone and assuming that I'll get stronger without proving it to myself.
smile.gif
Note that I'm talking about maintaining strength such as a 3RM, not strength-endurance such as 5 sets of 10.
 
Today actually went pretty well, bench in particular felt pretty light.

I'll just use Layne's original nomenclature for the days, I suppose.

Upper Body Power Day

Bench

Warmed up to 245 for a paused single, then back down to 210 for 5 sets of 5, first reps paused.

This was not so bad, I really didn't even need a spotter.

Cable Rows

5 sets of 160 for 5.

Press

These I did at home along with chins.

Wound up at 130 for 5 sets of 3.  Challenging, but definitely not limit weights.

Chins

Me + 80 lbs for 5 sets of 3 reps.

High Rep Cooldown

A set of 35s for 35 reps in dumbbell incline bench, then a set of 35 reps in my weenie lat pulldown station at home.
 
Pretty solid day.

Lower Body Power Day

Squats - oly shoes + loose belt

Warmed up to 285 for a single (felt okay), then back down to 245 for 5 sets of 5.

Definitely challenging by the end, but manageable, and this is tied with the most weight I've ever done 5 sets of 5 with.

Deadlifts - oly shoes + loose belt

Warmed up to 325 for 2 sets of 5.  Weirdly, the second set actually felt better than the first.

Again, challenging, but manageable.

Calf Raises in the Leg Press

3 sets of 3 total plates (2 plates on one side, 1 on the other) for 12 reps, then I realized I had intended on doing 2 plates per side, and added a plate for my last set of 12.

High Rep Cooldown

A set of leg presses @ 2 plates per side for 35 reps.  Mad leg pumps.
 
The glycogen retention effect of the &quot;bodybuilding&quot; training is already starting to become noticeable, as I'm looking thicker/poofier than I remember looking in quite a while.

Mad pumps, brah!
 
I failed to achieve back/biceps DOMS last week (unacceptable!), so I scheduled it first this time around.

Back/Biceps

Wide Grip Lat Pulldowns

120 x 12,12,10,9

Close Grip Cable Rows

120 x 12
100 x 12,12,12

Hammer Pulldown

55 x 12
50 x 12,12,12

Life Fitness Row

70 x 12
50 x 12,12,12

Standing DB Curls

30's x 12,12,12

Life Fitness Preacher Curl machine

55 x 12
45 x 12
50 x 12

Again, ridiculous pumps that enormously impacted strength after a few sets such that working weights were incredibly light.  I kept form strict as per usual, so the TUL for each given set was pretty high.

Still, not that &quot;hard&quot; in the conventional sense, just very fatiguing to my muscles.
 
Upper Push/Triceps

I actually started off the session by warming up to a paused single of 225 in the barbell bench, to see if it helps me keep a groove for my power day.

DB Bench

60s x 12,12,12,8

Seated DB Shoulder Press

30s x 12,12,12,10

Machine Flies

40 x 12,12,12,12

Lateral Raise

12s x 12,12,12,12

Dips (bodyweight)

Me x 12,9,8

Machine Triceps + Cable Triceps

100 x 12,12 in the machine, another set of 12 on the cable using a little v bar.
 
Man, I was a bit tired going into today, quads in particular still felt kind of fatigued.

Legs

Hammer Linear Leg Press

Warmed up to 6 plates per side for a single, back down to 4 plates + 5 lbs per side for 4 sets of 12.

I was feeling rather drained by the end.

Leg Extensions

4 sets of 75 x 12 reps.

Leg Curls

3 sets of 80 x 12 reps, 1 set of 70 on a seated leg curl for 12 reps (other one was in use).

Calf Raises

2 plates per side for 12 reps + 12 bottom half reps. Doing just the bottom half after it becomes impossible to get a full contraction is rather nice/excruciating, since you can kind of keep going for quite a while.

Another set of 2 plates per side for 10 reps + 12 bottom half reps.

Down to 3 total plates for 10 reps + 12 bottom half reps, and finally something like 8 reps + 12 bottom half reps + a bunch of pulses. Calves totally fried.
 
<div>
(mikeynov @ Oct. 11 2008,2:40)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Doing just the bottom half after it becomes impossible to get a full contraction is rather nice/excruciating, since you can kind of keep going for quite a while.</div>
The one thing I miss about not training in a commercial gym anymore is being able to hit my calves hard in various machines. I loved pulses at the end of a heavy set of donkeys and always remember (with a strange fondness) having to hobble the first few hundred yards home while my calves recovered from the beating they had just taken.
 
So, this week my plan was to consolidate the two power days into a single power day, with the result being more or less identical to the &quot;volume&quot; day in Rippetoe's Texas Method.

I did this because I was starting to feel run down all of 2 weeks into the new routine, and I figured the extra day of rest would help.  Sadly, today went kind of poorly, so my troubleshooting will have to start sooner rather than later.

I'm considering putting deadlifts on legs day, too, to prevent myself from doing too much heavy work all in one day.  I keep tinkering with the order of the hypertrophy days to get stuff feeling right, and I might try a chest/back, legs, and shoulders/arms split this week, where the only direct shoulder work is strict presses (since delts are heavily involved in all presses, and rear delts in most back exercises).

I'll have to think about it, though, I don't want to change too much because it will be difficult to separate what works from what doesn't in terms of getting this routine to work for me.

Strength/Indicator Day

Squats

I noticed on my last leg day that my legs just felt kind of dead, and this feeling persisted a bit into today.

Warmed up to 285, which felt alright I guess, then back down to 250 for 3 sets of 5.  Considering the weight, this really isn't that bad, and I may sit here and add a set per week until I get to 250 for 5 sets of 5, then up it another 5 lbs and do the same.

Bench

This is where things went to hell.

The odd thing is I warmed up at home to 225 for a single yesterday to keep a bench groove since I knew I was going to have an extra day off, and it actually felt very light/fast.

Today, I just felt sluggish, possibly due to the fatigue of squatting beforehand?  I'm not really sure.  The other difference is that I went back to benching in a rack, which might have been a mistake.

Anyways, warmed up to 245 for a paused single, which was slow, then back down to 212.5 for a set of 5 reps, which was hard.

At this point, I figured it was smart to only have incremented 2.5 lbs since the last session, and I figured I'd grind out another couple of sets of 5 and call it a day.

Unfortunately, on set #2, the fifth rep got stuck just prior to lockout, and I actually had to terminate the set.  What...the ****?  5 sets of 5 @ 210 was not just easy last week, it was SILLY easy, and now I'm struggling to do TWO sets of 5 @ 212.5?

I tried a third set in an actual bench station, but after struggling on the last rep of the last set, I just had nothing in me, and only managed ~4 reps (spotter touched it though I instructed him not to).

The way I see it, my options include:

* Going back to separate upper/lower days, it's possible squatting massively interfered with my zip in bench.
* Try benching before squatting next time, which might be the option I use, actually.

Chins

Me + 70 lbs for 3 sets of 5.  This was actually surprisingly easy, considering how bench went.  Why the **** does my bench always stall first, even when everything else is reasonably strong?

Calves

A couple of sets of 12 + 12 bottom half reps in a calf machine.  Deep, scream-inducing burny pain that lets me know it's working.

High Rep Cooldown

Dumbbell bench (flat) - 40s for 35 reps, which was actually surprisingly easy (relatively speaking).

Cable Rows - 90 for 30 reps.  Not bad.

Bulgarian Split Squats (unweighted) - 40 reps per side.  Jesus @ *** burn.
 
Today I tried a chest/back day. It definitely passed the first test - performance was up in most exercises by pairing antagonists, it didn't take too long, and it felt quite good.

The second test will be to see this split's overall interaction with the strength/indicator day(s). Obviously, I want to get stronger over time.

Chest/Back Hypertrophy

Dips

Me + 25 lbs for 12,12,12

Chins

Me for 12,12,12. Quasi-supersetted with dips, i.e. I didn't rest long going back and forth between the two.

DB Low Incline Bench

One of my favorite exercises, I think I feel this more in my chest than any other bench variant.

50s for 12,12,12.

Seated Cable Rows

120 for 12,12,12. Quasi-supersetted with the DB low incline bench.

Machine Flies

Different machine this time, weight scale seems different.

75 x 12,12,12

Wide Grip Pulldowns

My lats and arms were pretty fried at this point. First set was 120 for 12. Second set was 105 for 12. Third 90 for 12. I'll have to figure out a good weight for next week to be able to do 3 sets of 12 across at the end of the workout (I have been doing them at the beginning).

I try to do these while &quot;feeling&quot; it in my lats as much as possible, and these were done paired with the flies.
 
Legs Hypertrophy

Deadlifts - oly shoes

Warmed up to 365, back down to 335 for a couple of sets of 5.

I think I may still be a bit stiff-leggier than I realize, as I had a side mirror to look at. But hell, it feels good!

Leg Press - Nautilus Nitro

I have a new job at a new gym, so I got to use some of the Nautilus Nitro pieces, which are all pretty damn nice.

400 x 12,12,12

Leg Extensions

I played with both a Nautilus and Star Track machine, the weight was ~100 or 105 by the end.

Sets of 12,12,12.

Leg Curls - Nautilus Nitro

Sets of 12,12,12 with 80 and then 85 for the latter two sets.

Calf Raises in Calf Stack

The weight was totally weird on these, I've been in some before where 300 lbs wasn't hard, this made 100 lbs somehow feel significant.

Anyways, ~100 for a set of 12/12, then a bit lighter for another set of 12/12.
 
<div>
(mikeynov @ Oct. 16 2008,4:36)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Legs Hypertrophy

Deadlifts - oly shoes

Warmed up to 365, back down to 335 for a couple of sets of 5.

I think I may still be a bit stiff-leggier than I realize, as I had a side mirror to look at.  But hell, it feels good!</div>
I've seen some pretty dang strong guys deadlift, not only pretty stiff-legged, but some with fairly rounded lower backs. I'm not going to recommend the latter, but I've come to a certain peace with the idea that I'm stronger starting with my back a lot closer to parallel to the ground than vertical to it.

If you're not rounding your lower back, especially if you're not going from less rounding to more as you raise the bar, then I'd say that it's probably not a problem.
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">It seems extremely clear to me at this point that &quot;strength training&quot; that does not represent a sufficient acute stimulus is not capable of driving progress in muscle mass for many, many trainees.

It is also clear to me that the old mantra of &quot;get stronger to get bigger&quot; is fundamentally flawed, that adding substantial strength past some point requires growing substantially more, which facilitates you getting stronger, not the other way around.</div>
Interesting observations from an experienced lifter. I think that an aspect of training that is often overlooked is one's training experience. As Bryan adequately put it, a seasoned lifter needs to do more in order to get the same hypertrophic stimulous.

At least for me, it seems that my strength depends almost exclusively on my bodyweight.
 
Shoulders/Traps/Arms

Strict Press - oly shoes, no belt

I was originally going to use a belt, but my back actually felt pretty good.

Anyways, warmed up to 135 for 5 sets of 3 reps.

Shrugs

A set of 80 lb dumbbells for 12 reps, a set of 70 lb dumbbells for 12 reps, and two sets of Hammer Seated Shrugs for 1 plate + 10 lbs per side for 12 reps.

EZ Bar Curls

70 x 12,12

Skullcrushers (to right behind my head on a bench)

60 x 12,12

Nautilus Nitro Preacher Curl

This thing is damn nice. 80 x 12, then 65 x 12.

Nautilus Nitro Triceps Extension

80 x 8 then 65 x 12.
 
Back to dips...

I decided that the trouble of going out of my way for a rack where I could self spot in the bench press was too much of a hassle, and instead I'd concentrate on my strongest natural push in the form of dips for a while.

In other news, I appear to be averaging ~1 lb of weight gain per week since starting this program, which is probably a pretty good rate of weight gain.

Strength/Indicator Day

Squats - oly shoes + loose belt

Warmed up to 275 for a single, then back down to 250 for 5 sets of 5 reps.

The first few sets actually weren't that bad, the latter two were quite tiring.

I'm having trouble not hip shifting and GMing my reps a bit as the weights get heavier, but such is life.

5 sets of 5 reps @ 250 represents an all time PR, so I'll take it.

Dips

Me + 90 lbs for 5 sets of 5 reps going basically as deep as I can physically go with a forward lean on every rep.

Chins

Me + 70 lbs for 5 sets of 5 reps.  I think this represents an all time chins PR.

I decided to skip the high rep cooldown stuff today, I'm curious to see how/if it affects my recovery for my strength/indicator day next week.
 
Some new equipment used today as I started a new job at a new gym the past week.

Chest/Back Hypertrophy

Barbell Bench

3 sets of 155 for 12 reps touch and go style.

Lat Pulldowns

This was a bit all over the place.

First was a set of wide grip pulldowns with 130 for 12 done on some Lifefitness machine.  The weight didn't feel quite the same as at Cardinal, so this was arguably too heavy.

Second set was 140 for ~12 on a Nautilus Nitro pulldown, which felt pretty nice, but was a little too heavy.

Third set was 125 for ~12 on the Nautilus Nitro pulldown, and by this point, this was almost too heavy as my lats were dead forever.

Dumbbell Incline Bench

The lowest incline setting on the adjustable benches at my new gym is higher than what I was using before, so it's a little more difficult.

3 sets of 55's for 12 reps.

Nautilus Nitro Plate Loaded Seated Row

2 plates per side for a hard set of 12, 1 plate + 25 lbs per side for two better sets of 12.

Nautilus Nitro Fly Machine

The best fly type machine I've ever used, it has pads that you push against with the inner part of your elbows and the &quot;peak contraction&quot; you get in your chest at the top is crazy.  A pumper's dream come true.

Anyways, 50 lbs for 3 sets of 12 reps.

Nautilus Nitro Pullover

Despite adjusting the seat, for some reason this thing felt awkward.

110 for a set of 12 pushing against the pads with my elbow, another set of 12 doing it more like &quot;normal&quot; pullovers with my elbows off the pad and my hands on the rear bar, then another set of 110 for 12 with the elbows pushing against the pads.

Of the three sets, I actually liked the second the best, I realize it's supposed to be a &quot;lat isolation&quot; exercise of sorts, but turning it more into a &quot;normal&quot; pullover felt the most natural.
 
Legs Hypertrophy

Deadlifts - oly shoes + loose belt + straps

Worked on form a little today, trying to reduce my roundback tendencies to some degree.

Warmed up to 365 for a single, then back down to 345 for a set of 5.  Heavy/slow.  Having to lower the bar really slowly on each rep to avoid making noise definitely makes pulls harder.

Nautilus Nitro Lower Back Machine

Wound up using 140? for a hard set of 12.  Might back this down next time, but I actually really like this machine.  Feels very...productive.

Nautilus Nitro Leg Press - Seat setting 5/6

440 for a set of 12, as I was feeling ambitious, then 420 for two more sets of 12 afterwards.  Hard.

Played around with seat settings, I always try to get it as low as possible without my butt coming off the pad.

Nautilus Nitro Leg Curls

3 sets of 85 for 12 reps.

Nautilus Nitro Leg Extensions

110 x 12, 100 x 12, and 85 x 12.  Probably should have started with the lightest weight.

Calf Raises in Calf Stack

130? x 12/12, then did this weird thing a guy suggested doing 10/10/10 reps with ~10 breaths between mini-sets with my feet angled out, then forward, then in.  Weight was light, something like 75? 60? Worked okay I guess.  15 more half reps after 5 deep breaths after this.  Hard to walk.
 
Shoulders/Traps/Arms

Strict Press - oly shoes + belt

Warmed up to 137.5 for 5 sets of 3 reps.  First set was done beltless.

EZ Bar Curls

2 sets of 80 lbs for 12 reps.

Skullcrushers Behind the Head

2 sets of 65 lbs for 12 reps.

Nautilus Nitro Preacher Curl

2 sets of 70 lbs x 12 reps.

Nautilus Nitro Triceps Extension

One machine looked sort of like a preacher bench, 110 for 12 on this, the other had the arms/elbows up high, 70 for 12 on that.

Hammer Shrugs

A set of 1 plate + 25 + 5 lbs per side for 12 reps, 3 more sets of 1 plate + 25 lbs per side for 12 reps.
 
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