Slapshotz' SST journal
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Liege wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Congrats on the PB! Wow, are those strict presses?</div>
Sure are! The only "cheat" is that I'm doing it MS style, so each rep is in perfect form. By the 5th rep I'm fatigued, but I don't go anywhere near failure.
Colby wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I may try C&P again in the fall when I actually do some strength training.
Great log Slapz!
I am following the pseudo-MaxStim style with great interest!</div>
Thanks, Colby! I've never seen it done quite the way I'm doing it; high frequency, high loads, little burnout. So far, I'm really liking it. I'll know more when I get my BF analysis in about 10 days
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Congrats on the PB! Wow, are those strict presses?</div>
Sure are! The only "cheat" is that I'm doing it MS style, so each rep is in perfect form. By the 5th rep I'm fatigued, but I don't go anywhere near failure.
Colby wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I may try C&P again in the fall when I actually do some strength training.
Great log Slapz!
I am following the pseudo-MaxStim style with great interest!</div>
Thanks, Colby! I've never seen it done quite the way I'm doing it; high frequency, high loads, little burnout. So far, I'm really liking it. I'll know more when I get my BF analysis in about 10 days
<div>
(colby2152 @ Jun. 22 2007,07:58)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">So, you only did 5 reps Max-Stim style for each exercise?
Correct me if I'm wrong.</div>
Yup, that's it. My idea is to hit each muscle group as often as possible, with as much weight as possible, without crushing the CNS, as lifting heavy is apt to do.
Standard HST just never allowed me to train heavy enough to make strength gains, and my own hybrid strength routine was a tad too infrequent. IMHO, this is a good blend of both worlds.
Of course, I'm eating at or ever-so-slightly below maintenance, and low carbing it too boot. Unless my carb intake changes, I can't do too much volume of anything.
That said, I'd be awfully curious to see how something like this would work on a bulk...maybe 250,300 calories a day above maintenance, maybe 6-10 MS reps per exercise in the 85% and over range.
(colby2152 @ Jun. 22 2007,07:58)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">So, you only did 5 reps Max-Stim style for each exercise?
Correct me if I'm wrong.</div>
Yup, that's it. My idea is to hit each muscle group as often as possible, with as much weight as possible, without crushing the CNS, as lifting heavy is apt to do.
Standard HST just never allowed me to train heavy enough to make strength gains, and my own hybrid strength routine was a tad too infrequent. IMHO, this is a good blend of both worlds.
Of course, I'm eating at or ever-so-slightly below maintenance, and low carbing it too boot. Unless my carb intake changes, I can't do too much volume of anything.
That said, I'd be awfully curious to see how something like this would work on a bulk...maybe 250,300 calories a day above maintenance, maybe 6-10 MS reps per exercise in the 85% and over range.
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">That said, I'd be awfully curious to see how something like this would work on a bulk...maybe 250,300 calories a day above maintenance, maybe 6-10 MS reps per exercise in the 85% and over range. </div>
It would most likely be a successful cycle for most people. The volume would definitely have to increase.
It would most likely be a successful cycle for most people. The volume would definitely have to increase.
<div>
(liegelord @ Jun. 22 2007,22:11)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">slapz, you're a pressing machine; strict presses with bw, good lifting brother.</div>
Hey, thanks, Liege! Since deads are a no-go still, gotta work the other areas that need it!
MS Overload Week IV, Workout IV
Flat Bench Press: 235 - 5 (MS)
Squats: 255 - 5 (MS)
Weighted Chins: BW+90 - 4 (MS)
NOTES: Solid!
(liegelord @ Jun. 22 2007,22:11)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">slapz, you're a pressing machine; strict presses with bw, good lifting brother.</div>
Hey, thanks, Liege! Since deads are a no-go still, gotta work the other areas that need it!
MS Overload Week IV, Workout IV
Flat Bench Press: 235 - 5 (MS)
Squats: 255 - 5 (MS)
Weighted Chins: BW+90 - 4 (MS)
NOTES: Solid!
<div>
(liegelord @ Jun. 23 2007,23:54)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Am I missing something slapz? You're max bench is 295, why are you doing max-stim benches with only 235? Shouldn't you be doing about 280?</div>
Those stats are indeed depressing, but I'm probably a good 8 or 9 pounds lighter than when I nailed the 295. I've been able to maintain/even increase most of my current loads despite the weight drop, but bench is one area that has suffered greatly. Deads, probably, too.
I think, though, that with this hybrid method I'm using, it'll be possible to build myself back up to that bench number in the next 6 months at my current bw (which I'll find out exactly what it is next Saturday when I do my next & final bf analysis).
(liegelord @ Jun. 23 2007,23:54)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Am I missing something slapz? You're max bench is 295, why are you doing max-stim benches with only 235? Shouldn't you be doing about 280?</div>
Those stats are indeed depressing, but I'm probably a good 8 or 9 pounds lighter than when I nailed the 295. I've been able to maintain/even increase most of my current loads despite the weight drop, but bench is one area that has suffered greatly. Deads, probably, too.
I think, though, that with this hybrid method I'm using, it'll be possible to build myself back up to that bench number in the next 6 months at my current bw (which I'll find out exactly what it is next Saturday when I do my next & final bf analysis).
You made some impressive PR's while cutting, I didn't think your bench suffered though. I know your dead suffered from your injury. And don't get the wrong idea when I wrote "just 235", you're a very strong presser. I just meant in relation to your max.
"Depressing" is what I press.
"Depressing" is what I press.
Liege wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">You made some impressive PR's while cutting, I didn't think your bench suffered though. I know your dead suffered from your injury. And don't get the wrong idea when I wrote "just 235", you're a very strong presser. I just meant in relation to your max.
"Depressing" is what I press.</div>
Liege, you have some awesome lifts going. Everyone has their Achille's heel lift, and for most, it actually is the bench press...with what you press, though, I'm a bit shocked that your bench isn't around 300. Maybe it's just a question of form? My bench shot up when I placed my hands closer together on the bar and kept my elbows in. It stablized those tricky rotators, and put all the pressure on the pecs...maybe worth a try??
As far as my deads, I haven't deadlifted since my injury, that's true, but my max dropped a bit b/4 the injury, so I'm surmizing that a new PR for me would be tough, given my lighter state.
After a year of making strength gains while cutting, eventually the gravy train comes to a stop, and reevaluation is necessary. I'm absolutely sure of one thing: I'm not gonna bulk. I kind of like where I am, aesthetic-wise, so I'm going to have to work really hard for those PRs from my current bodyweight. My new routine might just work for me in that regard
Quad wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">As my bench and stuff is going down while cutting (it WAS going up), and reading Slappy's shortened MS idea I get a tweak on that. I wonder if you could, say, do heavy MS like that but increase the weights? Oooooh, geee, sounds familiar, no?
5 x 5</div>
Yeah, kinda does, eh?
But my M time is consistently around 30 seconds to a minute. I make sure I'm as fresh as possible for each rep, and therein lies the difference, I think. Volume is, still, only about 15 to 20 reps per session....but they're good reps in the 85% and up range, for the most part.
Time will tell, tho...it's only been four weeks. I'd need at least four more to make an honest evaluation.
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">You made some impressive PR's while cutting, I didn't think your bench suffered though. I know your dead suffered from your injury. And don't get the wrong idea when I wrote "just 235", you're a very strong presser. I just meant in relation to your max.
"Depressing" is what I press.</div>
Liege, you have some awesome lifts going. Everyone has their Achille's heel lift, and for most, it actually is the bench press...with what you press, though, I'm a bit shocked that your bench isn't around 300. Maybe it's just a question of form? My bench shot up when I placed my hands closer together on the bar and kept my elbows in. It stablized those tricky rotators, and put all the pressure on the pecs...maybe worth a try??
As far as my deads, I haven't deadlifted since my injury, that's true, but my max dropped a bit b/4 the injury, so I'm surmizing that a new PR for me would be tough, given my lighter state.
After a year of making strength gains while cutting, eventually the gravy train comes to a stop, and reevaluation is necessary. I'm absolutely sure of one thing: I'm not gonna bulk. I kind of like where I am, aesthetic-wise, so I'm going to have to work really hard for those PRs from my current bodyweight. My new routine might just work for me in that regard
Quad wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">As my bench and stuff is going down while cutting (it WAS going up), and reading Slappy's shortened MS idea I get a tweak on that. I wonder if you could, say, do heavy MS like that but increase the weights? Oooooh, geee, sounds familiar, no?
5 x 5</div>
Yeah, kinda does, eh?
But my M time is consistently around 30 seconds to a minute. I make sure I'm as fresh as possible for each rep, and therein lies the difference, I think. Volume is, still, only about 15 to 20 reps per session....but they're good reps in the 85% and up range, for the most part.
Time will tell, tho...it's only been four weeks. I'd need at least four more to make an honest evaluation.
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">After a year of making strength gains while cutting, eventually the gravy train comes to a stop, and reevaluation is necessary. I'm absolutely sure of one thing: I'm not gonna bulk. I kind of like where I am, aesthetic-wise, so I'm going to have to work really hard for those PRs from my current bodyweight. My new routine might just work for me in that regard </div>
Well, you won't want to cut. Maintaining is a stupid practice IMO. Why don't you consider doing a slow bulk. That should add muscle and retain bodyfat%. You could also do a body-recomposition cycle like e^pi is doing.
Well, you won't want to cut. Maintaining is a stupid practice IMO. Why don't you consider doing a slow bulk. That should add muscle and retain bodyfat%. You could also do a body-recomposition cycle like e^pi is doing.
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Well, you won't want to cut. Maintaining is a stupid practice IMO. Why don't you consider doing a slow bulk. That should add muscle and retain bodyfat%. You could also do a body-recomposition cycle like e^pi is doing.</div>
I see your point, but respectfully disagree
As bodybuilders, too many of us are never satisfied with our physiques, almost to the point that months and even years are spent obsessing over it. I find my approach to this sport to be a healthy one. I actually like how I look, and will not "bulk" for the sake of bulking. I have nothing to prove in that regard.
I worked hard to get my 6-pack, and at 37 years old, this is right where I want to be. But just because I don't feel the need to bulk, it doesn't mean I don't have goals. My goals are strength; pure, raw strength, and if it takes me years to reach my goals, so be it. I've gotten more satisfaction out of cutting & strength training this last year or so than from any bulking program I've ever done.
In the end, it's all individual, I guess.
I see your point, but respectfully disagree
As bodybuilders, too many of us are never satisfied with our physiques, almost to the point that months and even years are spent obsessing over it. I find my approach to this sport to be a healthy one. I actually like how I look, and will not "bulk" for the sake of bulking. I have nothing to prove in that regard.
I worked hard to get my 6-pack, and at 37 years old, this is right where I want to be. But just because I don't feel the need to bulk, it doesn't mean I don't have goals. My goals are strength; pure, raw strength, and if it takes me years to reach my goals, so be it. I've gotten more satisfaction out of cutting & strength training this last year or so than from any bulking program I've ever done.
In the end, it's all individual, I guess.
Yeah, I just ain't built to bench. That's a good suggestion though slapz, I know a guy who's 57 and he's a pressing machine, he takes a narrower grip. He's a 400 lbs bencher without leg drive. I'll try that in a few days. I found out the hard way tonight I CANNOT bench after doing snatches for more than an hour.
UFGatorDude30
New Member
I, too, have seen some of the strongest guys (on bench press) use a narrower grip. Why would that be better? While I'm not doubting it worked for you, slapz, I just see it as a mechanical disadvantage... making your elbows having to extend even more. Anybody whose more anatomy-savvy know something about this?
Sorry for the hijack.
Sorry for the hijack.
MS Overload Week V, Workout I
Incline Bench Press: 175 - 5 (MS)
Squats: 265 - 5 (MS)
Shrugs: 365 - 5 (Normal reps, 2 sets, just to keep my traps from a-shrinkin'!
20 mins cardio
NOTES: Solid. Okay, now that I'm in my 5th week, here's my working theory on how all this is playing out. My strength has been waning as each week goes on due to fatigue, but after either a day's rest and/or a weekend rest, I've been coming back just a bit stronger.
For example, last w/o I tried to do 175 on incline, and couldn't do one rep. I was completely fatigued from the prior week's workouts. Today, I came in fresh and was able to do a full five reps. What this method is doing is giving me brief bouts of slight overtraining (a GOOD thing), but allowing me to come back each week just a bit stronger b/4 feeling the effects again. Long term SD is not required b/c the volume is not completely crushing the CNS.
I'm taking a page out of Liege's playbook, as well. I'm going to skip flat bench this week, and hopefully come back and nail 245 next week, and thusly make my way back up the benching ladder. Likewise, I'm going to skip pullups this week, and hopefully match my PB of BW+100 after the layoff, maybe even break it.
I'm sort of feeling my way as I go, but after a month I'm convinced I'm on the right track. The true test will be how many strength PBs I can break at my new, lighter, leaner bodyweight.
UFG wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I, too, have seen some of the strongest guys (on bench press) use a narrower grip. Why would that be better? While I'm not doubting it worked for you, slapz, I just see it as a mechanical disadvantage... making your elbows having to extend even more. Anybody whose more anatomy-savvy know something about this?</div>
Colby wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">To this day, I am not sure if a closer or wider grip is better for bench press?</div>
I put these two quotes together because they both address the same thing. I know one thing, the closer grip/elbows in approach was VERY tough to get used to. At first, my bench press actually dropped @50 pounds. My trainer told me to stick with it, and I'm glad I did, b/c my previous bench high prior was about 245.
As to the mechanics of why it works, I'll ask him on Saturday and report back what he says. Of course, anyone can jump right in and say so, if they know. But the closer grip, elbows in approach does put more emphasis on the pecs, whereas the wider grip puts more emphasis on the delts (which is why bench causes so many rotator problems for those that bench that way). That much, I do know
Incline Bench Press: 175 - 5 (MS)
Squats: 265 - 5 (MS)
Shrugs: 365 - 5 (Normal reps, 2 sets, just to keep my traps from a-shrinkin'!
20 mins cardio
NOTES: Solid. Okay, now that I'm in my 5th week, here's my working theory on how all this is playing out. My strength has been waning as each week goes on due to fatigue, but after either a day's rest and/or a weekend rest, I've been coming back just a bit stronger.
For example, last w/o I tried to do 175 on incline, and couldn't do one rep. I was completely fatigued from the prior week's workouts. Today, I came in fresh and was able to do a full five reps. What this method is doing is giving me brief bouts of slight overtraining (a GOOD thing), but allowing me to come back each week just a bit stronger b/4 feeling the effects again. Long term SD is not required b/c the volume is not completely crushing the CNS.
I'm taking a page out of Liege's playbook, as well. I'm going to skip flat bench this week, and hopefully come back and nail 245 next week, and thusly make my way back up the benching ladder. Likewise, I'm going to skip pullups this week, and hopefully match my PB of BW+100 after the layoff, maybe even break it.
I'm sort of feeling my way as I go, but after a month I'm convinced I'm on the right track. The true test will be how many strength PBs I can break at my new, lighter, leaner bodyweight.
UFG wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I, too, have seen some of the strongest guys (on bench press) use a narrower grip. Why would that be better? While I'm not doubting it worked for you, slapz, I just see it as a mechanical disadvantage... making your elbows having to extend even more. Anybody whose more anatomy-savvy know something about this?</div>
Colby wrote:
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">To this day, I am not sure if a closer or wider grip is better for bench press?</div>
I put these two quotes together because they both address the same thing. I know one thing, the closer grip/elbows in approach was VERY tough to get used to. At first, my bench press actually dropped @50 pounds. My trainer told me to stick with it, and I'm glad I did, b/c my previous bench high prior was about 245.
As to the mechanics of why it works, I'll ask him on Saturday and report back what he says. Of course, anyone can jump right in and say so, if they know. But the closer grip, elbows in approach does put more emphasis on the pecs, whereas the wider grip puts more emphasis on the delts (which is why bench causes so many rotator problems for those that bench that way). That much, I do know