Fred´s Log

29.4.2015 Cutting
In brackets the weight diference between the beginning of the cicle and the daily weight.

BW 87.1 (trained in the afternoon)

Squat 2+2+1 110kg (+10)kgs will keep the weight here for a while RPE 10 elbow pain

BP 1x5 85kgs 2+2+1 (+5kgs) had help in the last rep. RPE 10 super elbow pain, could do better but the pain was a great limitation here

Dips 1x5 - BW+22.5 kg (+5 kgs) (3+2) RPE 10 pain started to dissipate but was still there

Overhead Press 3+2x 52.5kg (+2.5 kgs) RPE 10

Calf raises 2x10 150kgs (+20kgs)

Buterflies: 1x7 25 kgs (+5kgs)

Thought elbow was better, i couldnt be more wrong. Will start anti inflamatory medication. Anyone knows if beta-alanine can provoke joint pain?
 
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Totentanz said:
Because it does nothing.

Don't work abs while on a cut. It's a waste of time.
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Jester said:
What Totentanz just said - it does nothing. And not actively doing nothing like a trippy LOST episode plot or something ... it will do nothing at all.
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OK.

I also cant se em to find evidence it causes elbow/joint pain.

Will drop ABS for nos. Squats and deads take care of them.
 
Yeah as I'm sure you know, doing abs on a cut doesn't help them become more visible (spot reduction myth) and the other work you are doing will hit the whole core plenty well enough so no need to spend the time on them when you could be using that time for something else.
 
30.4.2015 Cutting
In brackets the weight diference between the beginning of the cicle and the daily weight.

BW: 87.1


Deadlift 1x5 135kgs 3+2

Pendlay Row 1x5 80kgs RPE 9.5 form improvments.

Chins 4+2 BW+22.5 (+5kgs) RPE 10 elbow pain!

Barbell Curls 1x8 39kgs mild elbow pain!

Glute Ham raise 5+5 slight help pulling.

Shrugs 8+7 95kgs (+15kgs)

Dropped Abs

Elbow dear elbow why you bother me?? Still a bit better
 
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1.5..2015 Cutting
In brackets the weight diference between the beginning of the cicle and the daily weight.

BW 86.6

Got a tiny bit hammered last night, red wine took its toll.
Felt unrested and overall fatigued.

Squat 2+1+1+0 110kg (+10)kgs RPE 10 elbow pain, could not do 5 reps.

BP 1x5 85kgs (3+2) (+5kgs) had help in the last rep. RPE 10 elbow pain

Dips 1x5 - BW+22.5 kg (+5 kgs) (5) RPE 9.5

Overhead Press 3+3 x 52.5kg (+2.5 kgs) RPE 10

Calf raises 2x10 150kgs (+20kgs)

Buterflies: 1x6 25 kgs (+5kgs)

Elbow was better, perhaps the wine helped ;)
Workout took 1h30, hard to recover between exercises.
 
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2.5.2015 Cutting
In brackets the weight diference between the beginning of the cicle and the daily weight.

BW: 86.6


Deadlift 1x5 135kgs 4+2

Pendlay Row 1x5 80kgs RPE 9.5 cant seem to improve here.

Chins 5+1 BW+22.5 (+5kgs) RPE 10

Barbell Curls 1x8 39kgs

Glute Ham raise 5+5 slight help pulling.

Shrugs 10+10 95kgs (+15kgs)


Elbow is finally getting good to go, mo major pain, slight disconfort.
 
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4.5..2015 Cutting
In brackets the weight diference between the beginning of the cicle and the daily weight.

BW 87.2

Elbow is good to go, slight discofort only.

Squat 1+1+1+1+1 110kg (+10)kgs RPE 10 Dam!!! Crap!! Could not perform 2 reps in a row?????? Although 1 rep felt easier. What the hell?? Found that squats are the true cause for the elbow pain.

BP 1x5 85kgs (3+3) (+5kgs) RPE 9.5

Dips 1x5 - BW+25 kg (+7.5 kgs) (3+2) RPE 9.5

Overhead Press 3+2 x 52.5kg (+2.5 kgs) RPE 10 Down 1 rep

Calf raises 2x10 150kgs (+20kgs)

Buterflies: 1x6 27.5 kgs (+7.5kgs)

Elbow is finally ok. Squats reminded me that it isnt 100% recovered. Still no pain only a light disconfort.

Cant understand why i cant perform 2x110kg in the squats. Form seems good, Going deep. Failed twice trying to get that second rep..
 
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5.5.2015 Cutting
In brackets the weight diference between the beginning of the cicle and the daily weight.

BW: 86.6


Deadlift 1x5 135kgs 5+3

Pendlay Row 1x5 80kgs RPE 9.5 cant seem to improve here.

Chins BW+25 (+5kgs) 3+2 RPE 10, elbow pain, again f***

Barbell Curls 6+2 41kgs

Glute Ham raise 5+5 slight help pulling.

Shrugs 10+10 95kgs (+15kgs)


Elbow was a bit painfull after the chins, got better after them.
 
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6.5.2015 Cutting
In brackets the weight diference between the beginning of the cicle and the daily weight.

BW 85.4

Ok, i need help from you guys!

Squat 110kg (+10)kgs 2+1+f+f+1+f Droped to 100kg 1+f........ Took me 40 minutes to warm up and do these reps. What is wrong?? Am i loosing strenght here?

Also elbows were both very hurt from this. What should i do??? Go to the 8 rep range to preserve the elbows? Should i drop squats for a while? Please advise they are killing my elbows and i am not progressing here, and this is killing my exercises and my mental health .

(after failing the second time i punch a door and brooke it, wife came yelling at me, i was pretty angry the whole workout because of my elbows and squat failures).. Oh yeah and now i have a new door to buy...............

BP 1x5 85kgs (3+2) (+5kgs) RPE 9.5 Elbows hurt a lot, hard to press, led to bad tecnich.

Dips 1x5 - BW+25 kg (+7.5 kgs) (5+f) RPE 9.5 Did 5 in a row but elbows no longer want to transmit force. Its not really pain at this point, the body is protecting by not allowing me to contract the arms.

Overhead Press 3+2 x 52.5kg (+2.5 kgs) RPE 10 Down 1 rep

Calf raises 2x10 150kgs (+20kgs)

Buterflies: 27.5 kgs (+7.5kgs) 0, couldnt even get the weight up, elbows again.

So, after elbows went better they now are very hurtfull. Need to stop squats or go lighter so i can continue to do the rest, Probably the same on chin ups, will see tomorrow. Also doing 1 rep at a time and most times failing that rep is creating a very negative effect on me. (110kgs was my rep max PR after the HST cicle).

What should i do? Go lighter? Stop?
 
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I would suggest time off as it would appear from your log that it is getting worse, or at least drop the exercises that are causing the pain - if squats are causing the most pain then I would do them at the end of the workout and reduce the load - 40 minutes just to do squats what is your warm up routine like?

Where is the pain in your elbows, have you seen a doctor / physio?

I used to get elbow pain so I started to take glucosamine sulphate and cod liver oil and the pain subsided and have recently dropped bench press and now have virtually no pain (hopefully I haven't spoken to soon)
 
My warm up routine is really quick,
12x empty bar, explosive
6x 40kg
4x80kg
2x100kg

Thats it.

It took really long because of failling/recovery.

Pain is located in the bicep insertion and on the outter portion of the elbow dont know the names in english. It matters more the injury mechanics. It hurts in a flexed position when pressure is aplied (squats, bench press, chin ups). Overhead press does not seem to affect this but its also the lightest of the exercises from a simplistic view of the total weight only.

I have medics and physios where i work, i am also a somewhat experienced and have knowledged in sport injuries so yes i do know that in order to heal up i must lower the load. At my max weight what happens is that i start to compensate the movement and the arms also start pushing the bar up when i am squating putting a lot of torque in the elbows. Problem is that where i work i am by far the mos abilitated person to evaluate this kind of injuries, wich is bad since you are very prone to error when you evaluate yourself, especially when you have lifting goals and you want to pursue them. Still i will talk again today with the physios.


I will try as you said, do squats at the end of the workout, and i will reduce the load to around. 90kgs, i believe that at this weight my tecniche is near perfect or at least i can control wich muscle i use and relax the arms. Does this sound good?

Strenght wise, would it be any good to increase the reps from 5 to 10? Assuming good form, not using the arms? (i am still cutting and loosing strengh is a major concern to me). Will it still keep my current muscle mass?

Will try to get some glucosamine, i allready do fish oil.
Will wide my grip.

Thanks Mick!
 
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Geez Fred - sounds like you are dealing with some nastiness here. For your squat-based elbow pain - are you doing front squats or back squats? If you're doing front squats, consider using a cross grip instead of a clean grip. I use the former as my wrists and elbows can't take more than a couple reps using a clean grip. For back squats, I'd imagine simply moving your hands out on the bar will reduce the stress on your elbows. Bear in mind - the job of your hands and arms for a BB squat is literally just to stabilize the bar; that's all. I'd imagine that you might be pushing a bit too hard on the bar.

In terms of loss of strength - get yourself healthy first, and then focus on strength preservation. Glucosamine will help, but this sounds like something that might be able to be corrected with some form changes.
 
Fred said:
I will try as you said, do squats at the end of the workout, and i will reduce the load to around. 90kgs, i believe that at this weight my tecniche is near perfect or at least i can control wich muscle i use and relax the arms. Does this sound good?

Strenght wise, would it be any good to increase the reps from 5 to 10? Assuming good form, not using the arms? (i am still cutting and loosing strengh is a major concern to me). Will it still keep my current muscle mass?
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As you are cutting I would try and stay nearer to your 5rm than your 10rm but if staying nearer to your 5rm still causes pain then I see no alternative but to go lighter still - I assume that you train at home so no access to leg press or a hack squat machine
 
I train at home but i have a power rack, otherwise i would be dead ;) Still no fancy other equipments but those are a good idea, perhaps i will do a month in a gym if needed.

For now:
Wide grip
Thumbless grip
Elbows up.

Lets see how it goes.

I could do when i started to cut 100kgs x 5, today it still is an RPE of 9 or more to do 2 reps with that weight so i dont know if i can do it and keep form good enough and torque out of the elbows. I will have to try.
 
Fred said:
I could do when i started to cut 100kgs x 5, today it still is an RPE of 9 or more to do 2 reps with that weight so i dont know if i can do it and keep form good enough and torque out of the elbows. I will have to try.
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Then as you said earlier in this thread drop the load to 90 kgs and push for 5 or more reps and stop before the form breaks down, I tend not to grip the bar tightly when doing back squats, as @_tim wrote just use your hands to stabilise the bar.
 
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