Johnston Rep Method

Discussion in 'Basic Training Principles and Methods' started by shakeel, Dec 15, 2005.

  1. leegee38

    leegee38 Member

    "i have been doing 1 month of jreps... "
    How have you been doing jreps, Shakeel?  Which version are you using, and are you doing it as part of common HST routine or have you altered your workout specifically for jreps?  Are you training to failure?  Do you see what you started with this thread?  :D
     
  2. shakeel

    shakeel New Member

    have used mostly jrep halves using a 3 way split chest delts and tris back bis forearms and legs with 1 day of rest between each workout .i modify the rep count .bdj recommends 12 but i tried 9 on both range and thus more heavy weights .every workout the weights goes up for same number of minireps .
    well i have been training to failure before using hit feeling drained cns .but with jreps the failure on each zone does nt affect me at all cns that i can train the next day.and keep in mind after 2 sets of jreps on a particular exercise the bodypart explode and even if i want to add 1 more set i cannot .chest i do 2 sets compound movement plus 1 set flyes jrep and small bodypart only 2 sets .
    i wont return to traditional trining for the time being as am gaining on jreps .the benefits is an ectomorph and poor recovery and cannot tolerate high sets i know from a mere 2 sets am done.

    yep i see what is going on with this thread .when i started this thread i did not know anything about it.then a friend give me the report and another one lend me the book which btw he did not want to lend it.i understand as he paid for it.that why i think people buying the book are not willing to discuss or share about it as they paid for it.in a way ehy do i give it to others for free as i did not get it for free.
     
  3. navigator

    navigator New Member

    Dude, I don't hate you or anyone else around here.  I don't hate Jreps, either.  Moreover, I don't even hate BDJ--I don't even know you guys.  But I sure don't like it that this book is sold with a Nondisclosure Requirement (which apparently is so terribly binding that your limps are sealed for life).

    In none of my posts have I argued that Jreps don't work--I have no idea whether they do or not.  And if they truly do work for you, then I think that's great, you rightfully should get something for your money and your lifelong commitment to secrecy.

    When you and BDJ come on here and claim that you don't care whether or not anyone buys the book, well that doesn't seem entirely true.  Logically, BDJ would not threaten legal action if he didn't care about selling his book.  He would not have compelled you to keep your silence if he didn't care about selling the book.  And you, xtreme, would not maintain your secrecy if you didn't think he was keen to sell the book.  So it's obvious that BDJ wants to sell as many copies of his book as possible.  Nothing wrong with that, I just don't like his selling methodology.

    Now, I'm sure, xtreme, that you want to come here and tell us your good news about this new training techique.  Now, I, for one, say nothing wrong with that, either.  That's what this forum is all about--the free exchange of training information.  Problem is, however, you are legally bound to not discuss your new favorite way of training with anyone that has not already bought the book.  So, you are not free to exchange this particular training information with us.  I know this is true because you have already made it clear that it is true.

    You have said that you have no financial conenction with the sales of this book.  Okay, fair enough.  I believe you.  But, based on the prevous 9 pages of this thread, I'd say you've been suckered by BDJ.  That is to say, you want to talk about your new training, but you cannot.  So you're left with saying how great your training is and nothing more.  Everyone else detects that you're keeping a secret, and they immediately assume your posts are spam.  And this leads you into trying forevermore to convince everyone that you're not spamming--which serves the purpose of getting BDJ's book discussed across several pages in just one thread. Even worse is you, xtreme, are not alone.  There are many, many others who've bought the book and are going through the very same situation trying to share their training with everyone else.  I've seem the very same type of thing going on all over the world.

    Don't you see?  It's all about name recognition.  As the saying goes, "it's better to be talked ill of than not at all."  I think BDJ has very cunningly drawn every customer into being a negative ad campaigner.  And that, my friend, is what I don't like about this book.

    So, xtreme, I don't hate you ... "it's nothing personal, just business." [​IMG]

    Oh yeah, I almost forgot: None of above should be construed, in whole or in part, as being anything other than the opinion of one American Citizen who is, and will continue to invoke his rights under the 1st Amendment of the U.S. Constitution.
     
  4. xahrx

    xahrx New Member

    Not my point. Compare it to some of Xtreme's posts. It's almost word for word. However, there's no marketing going on at all here...
     
  5. robefc

    robefc New Member

    I guess it all comes down to the fact that only people who are willing to pay for the book are going to find out exactly what jreps are and as none of us are willing to do that (and I'm guessing would only be willing to do that if there were several respected scientific studies proving that they are more beneficial for growth than other methods currently being used) we're all going to have to live with the fact that we don't know what they are...something which I reckon everyone on this board is going to be able to accept without losing too much sleep over it! :D

    Xtreme - I'm sure you're aware that the internet is full of training/fat loss miracle methods with only testomonials to back them up that require you to part with your cash in order to find out about them and the vast vast majority of these are absolute bull. Therefore, and possibly unfairly as it could be the best thing since sliced bread and all the testomonials could be true, no-one is going to believe the claims attributed to jreps without knowing exactly what the method is, why it works and being able to debate the science behind why it works.

    Which brings us back to my first point...

    Luckily there are fantastic sites like this one (and I've learned a lot form other sites prior to discovering this one too) where someone who had no grounding, scientific or otherwise, in bodybuilding/weight training like me can learn so much that has enabled me to have an understanding of building muscle, losing fat etc etc and greatly enhance the amount of enjoyment I get out of this hobby.

    Why oh why would I then decide to purchase a book on the back of unsubstantiated claims?
     
  6. xahrx

    xahrx New Member

    Because we can't see it in any way, shape or form. What JReps are has been pretty much spilt, they are reworked 21s for the most part, or any variation of modified ROM exercises that are available. To date in this thread that has gone 10 pages:

    1) There has been no proof of any kind for the claimed body changes. This could be either before and afterpics or a physiological explanation of how they happened. Some of the claimed changes are impossible.

    2) There has been no explanation whatsoever of how JReps are supposed to work. Recently someone brought a program here called ACIT. He gave a good explanation of it. However, if he was selling it he could have just as easily said it was training meant to take advantage of the effects of occlusion. This is not describing the method but would have at least given us something to go on to see if he was full of it. Absolutely nothing similar has been done with JReps.

    3) After repeated requests for at least a little more information, something to go on, all we get is a repetition of how well JReps have worked for you with no proof whatsoever. Well, I'm happy for you, but I'm not buying a book on your say so, especially after the behavior of its author here and elsewhere, and especially in light of the fact that you and others are on several message boards engaging in the same routine over and over again. For someone who is not selling something there's a lot of effort being put forward.

    You may get a few rubes to buy the book, maybe that's your goal and maybe it isn't. For various reasons when you say it isn't you really don't have any credibility with me and a lot of others. For one, I've seen this marketing approach before. I was in sales for quite a while when I was younger. The sales method, like the JReps method, is nothing new. As has been said, JReps will be out and available information-wise for free fairly soon. I have no doubt they'll be ripped to pieces as either a junk method or a reworking of a relatively useful but already known and applied method.
     
  7. xtreme

    xtreme New Member

    Removed.
     
  8. liegelord

    liegelord New Member

    This thread should be locked. [​IMG]
     
  9. Aaron_F

    Aaron_F New Member

  10. xtreme

    xtreme New Member

    Removed.
     
  11. xahrx

    xahrx New Member

    No, but pretty much anyone can get into really good shape if they put their mind to it and go about it right.

    I don't know. Why don't you tell us how they supposedly work?

    In the last few weeks I've added four inches to my arms just by lifting coffee cans filled with dog dook. That statement has as much proof behind it as your claim for JReps. Provide before and after photos or an explanation of how JReps work physiologically.

    The only reason I'm still posting in this thread is because someone might be uninformed enough to come here and fall for this drivel. Any effort to stop someone giving you, sorry, Johnston, we all know you have no financial interest in this at all, any money for a book about reworked 21s is time well spent.
     
  12. navigator

    navigator New Member

    Oh gosh, don't lock the thread--let freedom prevail! [​IMG]
     
  13. Joe.Muscle

    Joe.Muscle Active Member

    What if I just buy the book and scan it and let everyone read it?:confused: Word for word???

    What is wrong with that...just b/c they ask you not to tell dont mean you can tell the secrets this is america!
     
  14. Jester

    Jester Well-Known Member

    "WHAT THE... Are you seriously saying we all possess untapped Mentzer potential? :D I wish!!!"

    Mentzer took steroids. He lifted heavy. He put on muscle mass. Yes, you can do this too and get to the same size...esp. if you had started at the same young age he did.

    "And what prey tell does that have to do with my JRep gains?"

    Your 'JRep gains'...? Not a damned thing. Your ridiculous insinuation that you have significantly subpar genetics...it's a lil related.

    "Oh but there is... those who have, and are still using it with great success... you're neysaying can't change that!"

    Where is this evidence...?:confused:? Pictures, scientific backing, stats...where where where?

    "but I have reshaped certain muscle groups... whether you want to believe that or not"

    Who cares what I believe...? It's physiological fact that you can't...get over it already.

    "At 22 you have barely scratched the surface of what your needs truly are when it comes to training, so don't try and ridicule someone who knows themselves inside and out!
    Btw, your birth date didn't pass my attention <13 Dec. 1983> I clearly see you're quite the authority! I was in hard training for 6 years by then, squatting while you were still learning to walk or wipe your butt! Obviously you know much more than I do, being half my age and all, I can't wait for your e-book to come out... can I place an early order???"

    1. I don't NEED to be an expert....there's half a century of worth of expertise...and there's incredibly perceptive and innovative minds like Bryan Haycock's, Lyle McD's, Aaron F's, Dan's (dkm) and so on...all I need to do is READ, UNDERSTAND and APPLY...I'm not a fool, but I don't need to be a genius to do the above.

    2. You were born before me . . . umm...ok, join the billions.

    3. Does it get to you just a lil that a kid like me has a better grasp on such simple concepts and knowledge...?

    "I was in Bagdad when you were in your Dad's bags! LOL"

    You took a gun to a sandy country for oil....again I say, 'umm'...
     
  15. xtreme

    xtreme New Member

    Removed.
     
  16. shakeel

    shakeel New Member

    i think it is better for people to try jreps to see for themselves.if they dont like it then dump it
     
  17. Fausto

    Fausto HST Expert

    Shakeel

    Seems to me that our "friend" Johnston made sure that whoever has bought the book, cannot share th information for fear of reprisal.

    And i have offered to do this myself but there is not much to go on, is there?

    Can you shed some more light? Xtreme will probably help too, so between the two ofyou I should get some light, just.....don't get yourself into hot water because of this! [​IMG]

    I, for lack of better words think that Johnston is a bit of a A.H. for protecting his stuff so much, I don't think any of us here wants to take his method and call it our own and then make a ton of money of it, but..........WHATEVER [​IMG]
     
  18. xahrx

    xahrx New Member

    Actually if your training and diet were right, you probably could have some close. When you'r dealing with exogenous hormones genetics matters a lot less than your willingness and tolerance for the drugs/training involved.

    No. Ectomorph, endomorph or whatever anyone is, the biggest factors in achieving your goals are diet and training. You're going to make yourself taller or anything, but within the basic framework almost everyone is given, it's possible to go a very, very long way. Your genetics can affect how you go about this. But, in the end, with effort and the right approach most people can get big if they want to, naturally or with the help of drugs.

    If you had rough beginings, well not everyone has the greatest hand dealt to them. I have knees that severely limit my leg training options but I still manage to train them and keep them on par with the rest of my body.

    Again, asked for evidence. Again, provided nothing.

    Standard fare for those who want you to ignore what is known with relative certainty. As a process science will deliver results over time with varying degrees of certainty, usually incvreasing over time. Some things we just know at this point.

    Well by your own admission you weren't accomplishing much of anything before in your training. You couldn't even reliably gain weight during a bulking cycle. That was a nice claim as well. To repeat what someone else has said already, if you didn't gain weight your weren't eating enough. If you are looking to add muscle and you're not gaining any weight, regardless of training you need to up the calories. If your training was bad you should have gained fat. If it was good, muscle. But you should have gained something.

    Since you've tried them, instead of simply claiming they work why don't you tell us how they work? And do so without making claims that can't justified based on what we know about muscles and how they work, such as selective recruitment of fibers in one area or another or lengthening of the actual fibers resting length.

    I hate to break it to you, but you haven't posted anything that shows you have a grasp of anything other than a barbell. If reduced ROM movements work for you then use them, they may have benefits. But, they are nothing new. They are nothing Johnston invented, and nothing he can have a copyright on, incidentally, despite any disclosure agreements or threats. His and your claims seem a bit outrageous considering what we do know about how muscles function, if not in terms of results but in terms of how they were achieved.
     
  19. xahrx

    xahrx New Member

    You know, Xtreme, I'm always looking to expand my library. Something interesting you and Johnston might want to consider is people buy books for reference, for rereading, to have, etc. An explanation of how and why JReps work would have a tendency to make people want to buy his book. Hell, I may even try them in the near future now I know what they are just to see what all the fuss was about. And, if they had worked, I likely would have bought the book for a more in depth reference, even if only on how to apply the method to certain exercises, etc. But, this pathetic marketing campain and his attitude especially when he was here, were enough to put me and lot of other people off. The more you give, the more you get. Try a different marketing approach.
     
  20. AShortt

    AShortt New Member

    Hello, my first time to this board and as a contributor to the JReps book I couldn't help but chime in ;^)

    The problem with explaining is; this isn't a particular rep performance like a rest-pause or stutter rep. Like blitzing it is a method that needs to be understood then applied by the individual based on individual needs/goals, available equipment etc.

    The Johnston Rep Method is simply about breaking down exercises into zones and only training in zones (as opposed to Full or partial ROM training). Done properly one gets a great deep thorough fatigue. You can work the method many different ways the key is to properly fatigue a muscle through its entire ROM. Machine cams were supposed to do this but had limited success.

    One gets far more muscular contractions per unit time, a great pump and if weights and performance are fine-tuned, your muscles feel rubbery with a deep buzzing sensation afterwards. Plus for those who like to train heavy and to failure you feel less systemic fatigue yet your local muscle tissue is worked harder.

    I'll give a basic example of a one application I like:

    I use a Bowflex for many exercise and get a great stretch and major contraction doing a modified standing dip motion. That is, I have the handles off the high pulleys and stand with my back facing the tower. I hold the handles to my sides and lean in with my chest a bit. I push down the handles just like performing a dip in a dip rack. With the Bowflex I can get hand positioning just so and really feel my pectorals and triceps crank through this move. The problem is as you push down, the resistance gets greater (rods are bending and getting tougher as they bend). This mean with my body weight being what it is I am limited to how much resistance I can use in the stretch zone relative to the top zone (arms straight). Too much reistance and the cables pull me backwards and up into a standing position.
    With JReps I start with my normal work weight and squeeze out about 8-10 reps in the top third of the move, then I squeeze out 8-10 in the middle zone and finally finish with 8 –10 in the stretch/bottom zone. The cumulative fatigue and fact that the resistance lets off towards the bottom makes this a killer set. I get 24 to 30 hard muscular contractions total, all in about 60 seconds.

    Next I take a couple of minutes rest and load up about 30 to 40% extra weight and perform the Stretch Bottom "half" with more resistance than usual. I try to squeeze (and I mean squeeze! ) out about 12 –14 reps. I stop and strip the weight when I hit failure (all MY mini sets are to M.M.F.) and finish off with about 12 reps in the top zone. This allows me to use a more appropriate weight in the stretch zone (which is easiest on the Bowflex) AND it allows my to deal with the "transition point" of this move. That is, where allot of the resistance is taken off the pectorals and transferred more to the triceps. That transition point can be a limiting factor when it comes to possible load and number of reps (or TUT). In the case of this second version, I work to but not through the transition. During the second half I work just down to but again not "through" this area. This allows not only for more reps and greater load but I don't lose that fluid/smooth feel during a set.

    In the end, I work around the limits of the equipment AND I make the most out of the good points of this machine. I get major quality work in all points of the possible ROM.

    The muscular feel, pump and strength of the contractions are far better than any other method I have used in the past 2 decades. The fatigue is deep and thorough, not just burning or achy but deep and buzzing. My muscles get a ridiculous pump and hang there afterwards all rubbery for hours.

    When you understand the method and its basic in's and out's you can manipulate it at will. For me full ROM reps are a thing of the past. I use this with all my clients except absolute beginners. The results are far better in many ways compared with traditional techniques.

    By the way, I am not selling anything, I don't receive money for book sales, my contribution to the book was given for 2 reasons.

    1. I was offered a test drive of the method for experimentation sake and my opinion offered.

    2. As a Fitness Clinician, I am required to make a contribution to my certification body each year. There are many options and my experimentation and write up of personal experience and thoughts on the method were one way to meet this criterion and maintain my certification status.

    Regards,
    Andrew
    IART 2004/2005 Fitness Clinician of the Year
    [email protected]
     

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